QUOTE]Running them in parallel (non-seq) will eliminate the majority of the b.s., to include the prespool actuator and flapper valve, which leads to better exhaust flow. [/QUOTE]

Nice...
is anyone planning to run theese twins at the Rx7 Revolution meet in Indy in this spring?
would like to see how they compare to the singles,first hand, in the heat of battle so to speak.C.

 

The greddy fmic is more than enough for the "secret weapon " twins.

 

Question on ICs and the "secret weapon" twins...

Any upgraded one or is there one that they prefer? All one would really need is just the IC for better flow correct?

 

I think we all agree that the stock IC is a pos and idealy shouldnt be used with these turbos if you want to make power. Also dont expect to get these kinda numbers on these turbos.

However if your turbos are shot it would be ok to get these in conjunction with the stock IC BUT you need to keep the boost down to prob 10-11psi.

Also the more I think about it I dont think I'd recommend anyone running these with a upgraded ecu unless they hit the dyno to check thier a/f and it check out to be ok. The upgraded ecu's only squirt a certain amount of fuel at a certain rpm and boost level. If your running 10psi your going to be running much more air than the stockers at 10psi. The question is this.....is there enough margin of richness to conpensate for all the additional air??? I've never check the a/f on upgraded ecu's and have no idea. I think if they have enough fuel to cover these turbos then they would have to be running VEEERRRRYYYY rich on the stock turbos.

Check the a/f, thats the only way to know. Personally I dont think there is enough margin because these turbo are obviously flowing MUCh more O2.

We are working on getting a dyno Thurs in Atlanta. I plan on backing up my runs on pump gas just like before at the same boost level. I also might turn the boost down to around 12ish and see how it does there just so you guys can check it out. THEN, I'm going throw in a splas of race gas and turn it up to the stock map sensor max. I wont be running it like that on the street but some of us what to know what they are capable of. I wish I had a 3 bar map sensor.....on second thought its prob good I dont haha

Of yes, also if any of you are questioning your upgraded IC, I made this on a custom IC that is very similar to the M2 MED with the straight IC pipes.

HoHoHo, Merry Christmas!!!!
STEPHEN

 

I would look at total capacity of the core in cubic inches. Having an M2 large makes me feel much better about running the Top Secrets. If I had a smaller stock mount, such as a greddy or blitz I'd prolly be looking to upgrade. I remember reading that more surface area is desirable when considering ICs as opposed to thickness, b/c the air flow is not as efficient traveling through a thicker core. Also, the first 50% of the IC core (thickness-wise) does 75% of the cooling. I think this comes from Corky Bell's Maximum Boost, but could be mistaken. Take it with a grain of salt--don't want to open a can of worms here.

take care,
Rich

 

Can someone supply the dimensions for both the GReddy FMIC (stock twins), and the M2 large in regards to total surface area, and also for core thickness. I'm perfectly content with my IC as is, but I would definately like the "coolest" option, ya know?

Why not get a Single Turbo IC, and have custom piping made? The Y-pipe from the Turbo outlets to the IC can be dropped in favor of a custom mandrel bent unit, wouldn't you say?

 

Dude im getting giddy to hear the results!!! If they come in well im in for good. Singles are great, but damn...for the money i could buy a lot of other neat go fast stuff, and end up faster then the single int he long run! Good Luck!!

bobby

 

Seems that alot of people if they do make big power with a smic they made it with either the M2 medium or large smic. They have been proven time and time again with 400 rwhp hp runs. The core design is excellent for cooling and pressure drop is less than 0.5 psi for the medium and a little more for the large. Both the medium and large M2 work great - the large will cool a little more but not much - the medium you can keep your battery. I'd recommend running one of the M2 units as they are proven - with upgraded twins or single.

 

Hey kwikrx7, thats exactly my point! The reason I asked Bryan that question was so that I could get the 20b twins upgraded so I wouldn't have to go with a big single turbo on my future 20b project for my FD. This would make it so much easier (less fabrication work)and my car would pass inspection at the gas station because the tech wouldn't see a large turbo in the engine bay (everyone knows how big singles through up a red flag with the inspection guys) and I could acheive similar hp levels as big singles.



Hey Bryan, I will most definetly wil be checking back with you this summer.

 

hey rx7 rage: that little IC works fine with a couple bolt ons...now way would i run that thing with my upgraded twins....every tuner will tell you that that little greddy unit is not a good unit to go with. (with the exception for rikki at pfs whose IC's are similar).

dont waste your time on the little greddy or the little blitz.

get the m2 medium or the m2 large and do it right. though rotary reliability and racing also makes a large IC (which they should have in stock) that will perform similar to the m2 units. you can reach them at 7148398018...ask for louis.

you can find the numbers for the IC's at www.scuderiaciriani.com

j

 

Also guys the core isnt the entire issue. The prob with the stock mounts like the Greddy and such is that they use stock or similar to stock IC pipes with all the bends that kill the flow. I bet 70% of the flow problems of the stock IC set up is the pipes and not the IC. Every 90 degree bent in IC pipes cuts a LEAST 10% flow. The stock IC pipes have a ton of 90 degree bends.

That is one of the main advantages the M2 IC's and my IC has over others is the straight pipes. Mine go straight from the Y to the IC then from the IC to the Greddy. From the Y to the Greddy I have one small bend and its only about 20 degrees.

Anyway, just giving you some info, if you get a upgraded IC make sure it has fairly sraight pipes.

STEPHEN

 

But like the FM Blitz and Greddy would be fine correct? Not the stock replacements but the larger ones.

 

I would suggest the streetfight/RX-7 fashion FMIC to all who want a front mount. Bryan or Stephen feel free to chime in here too!! From all that I've read those IC's have the least amount of press drop and they are by far the largest. The price isn't too bad either. I'm still trying to decide between the Apex'i GT FMIC and the Streetfighter one, but I'm leaning very heavily towards the streetfighter. I would like to hear some opinions on what I said though. Anybody??

Zach

 

yea, the greddy smic is junk.....i was referring to the greddy fmic and that it should be adequate enough for the "secret weapon" twins.

 

So, what do you guys think would suite these upgraded twins the best? A) m2 large smic or b) greddy 2 row fmic.
Also, if only ran at 15psi could I just use a pettit unlimited?

 

I posted some info on upgraded ecu's with these turbos. I dont think your going to get enough fuel BUT I dont know how rich they run either. You can try it and test the a/f but I would only do it up to maybe 11 or so PSI of boost. I dont know what they timing is on the Pettit ecu but feel its probably to advanced to be making a ton of power. Might be wrong but thats the problem with a upgraded ecu with a ton of power, you dont really know what tuning your have.

Either IC would work fine, the M2 is going to cost more but the Greddy will be a huge PITA to install. Its up to you, both are larger than what I'm running and should be pleanty. If you get a FMIC you might also need a upgraded alum radiator.

STEPHEN

 

Puh-LEAZE lets not let this thread degenerate into another pointless intercooler debate/discussion... there should be PLENTY of info already out there for anyone to make an informed decision.

 

why does everyone want everyone to use the search..... aren't we all on this forum so we can have a decision on our cars?...

 

for real. im tired of hearing "search"

I search, but still liek to hear some fresh input.

Im going to stop being a post ***** now...

latr
bobby

 

yes but this is a BNR twin, NOT an intercooler thread. There are a million recent intercooler threads on here.

 

Point taken. Ive asked about the ICs too but it was more for just input. Not for whats right or wrong, or whats good or bad, just Will this one do? Thats all I really wanted to know.

 

Steve,

Intercoolers are coool....

...back to the main subject....It's thursday, let me see some of those DYNO NUMBERS!! I'm excited man...i'm very curious as to see what these babies do at the lower boost levels. If they can yank out say close to 380rwhp+ on 12psi.....that's just cool.

Danny

 

Well, look at it this way...you've been posting here for a couple months now. Others have been here for several YEARS. Trust me...we've seen more repeat threads and repeat discussions than you have seen us say 'search'...by a factor of about 10,000.

Don't get me wrong...I like good discussions on new stuff, even if the general topic has been discussed in length before. But there is NOTHING new in the intercooler world. No new mainstream designs...no new neat-o products. Most of the time when people say search, they aren't saying just for the hell of it...

https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...hreadid=140587
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...hreadid=127172
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...hreadid=100600
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...hreadid=125146
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...hreadid=132608
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...threadid=50002
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...threadid=81194 <-----EXCELLENT SMIC THREAD!
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...threadid=95780
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...threadid=68616
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...threadid=37219 <-----GOOD FMIC THREAD!
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...threadid=23389
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...hreadid=115167
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...threadid=96632
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...threadid=98860
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...threadid=22848
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...threadid=84427

There ya go! All the facking intercooler information you will ever need! And it took me a whole 9 minutes to do!!!! And there's even MORE out there.

This is why people tell you to search. There is so much invaluable information out there and a very useful tool at your disposal to access that information...yet it seems nobody wants to use it??



Sorry for contributing to the hijacking of this thread SPO...just had to set some people straight...

 

Great, now it's another "search" thread

I've been keeping an eye on this BNR thread, and I can't wait to see the next dyno figures. My turbos have 84 k miles on them, and are starting to leak some oil, so these BNR's sound like they could be exactly what I'm looking for. Just think, only weeks ago, I would have been happy with 300 RWHP

Cheers,

 

Well, it wouldn't be if folks would actually use the search feature.

Back to topic though...I know it was mentioned briefly, but I don't think it was answered. Do the 'Secret Weapons' carry the same warranty as the regular Stage II rebuilds? Says on BNR's website that the oil supply lines MUST be replaced for the warranty to be valid. Anyone know the cost of *brand new* oil lines from Mazda? Mazdaformance has the supply line for $113, and the return lines are $80 each.

Also, what does the warranty really cover? Obviously if someone didn't know what they were doing while tuning and blew their motor...throwing chunks of apex seals at the turbines...

Or is there a MAX boost level that these can run and still be under warranty?

Info please, Bryan