gerald m

Hi everyone Will is the guy building the header pipes for me He's from the Dinsmore Hutterite colony and runs the metal shop there ..


Hi will this is the hose and stuff I was talking about . the waste gate in the picture is what I bought but can't see how we can do that pipe until you have it to look at then you can come up with some kind of plan .

The flange picture only comes with one flange don't know why they have two shown . Again Will if you don't want to wait for the main exhaust flange and want to carry on I guess if you want just make one ,, . like I said I think the hose will be a pretty close fit .

For the fuel vessels make the holders how ever you want just keep as simple as possible so I can swap the tanks out quick if I want to. sorry for the small pics

Bumpstart I never got any video of the exhaust build so far but I am impressed , I know you will like them , It really is impressive how he came off the engine with 2 inch pipes over the jack shaft and blended them into a three inch that he shaped to fit the turbo flange that he made . It misses every thing with about 1/8 to 1/4 inch .. All I had to do was sit down for a bit and talk things over and he came up with a work of art , I post a video next time I go over . Also he told me he wants to blend the waste gate pipe back into the main , he figures it will look better and I agree .. I found out early in the game that if he doesn't like something he is going to change it . It's looking great show you soon ..

chainreaction

Well, the last motor I bought, had a bad water seal so I parked the car. i put a feeler on this site in the NE rotary group thread and was approached by a guy from New York that had a lower mileage professionally built full bridge-port 12a sitting in his garage. He had sold his RX-2 and kept the motor. The best part was he was working less than an hours drive from where i live. i am still working on debugging the little motor, but it is radically different than the stock motors i have been running. I'm shooting to have it on the track in a couple of weeks. We should have my sons sno-mo-quad done for the same race.

gerald m

I for one would like to know what kinda goodies that little engine has ,, I'm sure there are a few others that would like to hear about it .. Make sure you post some video of the car running on the track . me thinks you have a ripper there .

gerald m

Well the turbo conversion is almost done will has just a few things to finish up , I have a video if I can get a good connection I will upload asap .

The turbo is mounted close to the engine cold side lined up perfect just about 2 inches short for the 2 inch end to fit , As far as I can tell the waste gate should flow fine I guess we will see what happens . Will got the fuel vessel mounts made and mounted . (( He seems to be right on with his thoughts and the way I want things and have come to trust his judgement .

The exhaust is made from heavy wall stainless adding a little extra weight but should take a bit of a beating and stand up well . the battery can stay where it always was as Will made sure he would have ample space as he went along .

The bearded dude in the pictures is a good chum of mine Brian Spigott from the area . and the young guy in the background is Will's youngest son he doesn't say much he just sits and takes it all in . WON"T BE LONG NOW !!

Video to come shortly ...

bumpstart

looks great though absolutely you will need to turn that exhaust around to point rearwards as it will have significant enough thrust out the end

no room for a BOV unless tapped into the front cover on the turbo.. you may not yet need it as your drive setup wont have snap shut throttles during gear changes

gerald m

Yea we had a short discussion and he agrees actually he had mentioned before that the exhaust should go back a bit on the end

If we do need a waste gate since the blue elbow is a little short he is going to cut part off and join a piece of aluminum into the hose so if we need it we can go from there instead of the turbo but I do like the idea of coming right off the cold side with the BOV . I guess a little more time and we will know for sure .

chainreaction

Can't wait to see video of it running.
We got one of our projects mostly done, still got the never ending adjustments to do....
http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/j...ps360036bc.jpg

MVI_0481_zps7e2b68f9.mp4 Video by traffordracing | Photobucket

gerald m

finally got the bike home now can clean up exhaust manifold and waste gate assembly and install gaskets , propane is finished , one more hose for the regulator , cleaned up header and waste gate assembly ,pressure line is on filter housing but this inlet on the turbo bothers me a tad ,

There is a 1/8 line going to turbo from filter housing the plate fitting that the line attaches to and bolts to top of turbo has a 1/8 inlet but when I turn it over it has just a pin hole .. something tells me it should have a 1/8 hole all the way through or is this a way to control pressure to protect seals ??? .

The exhaust is still not pointing back as much as it should ,, (( I think for now I will just give it a tapered baloney slice end but will have to do for now as time is running down .

gerald m

couple of pics of the turbo oil inlet

bumpstart

the restrictor is for ball bearing turbos.. far too small for our purpose
.. the t04 b is designed to take about 60 psi oil pressure and the rotary with a modded oil pressure reg it may well be seeing 95

the mazda stock turbo ( ht18s-2s ) has a small restictor in built to the 270 bearing to cut it down a bit


so some restrictor is required .. but not the tiny hole a BB turbo needs


drill it through to about 1.6 mm -2.0 mm ( 1/16 - 5/64 )

bumpstart

exhaust pipework looks excellent , though the flanges may be a bit on the thin side , but im not expecting any issue with short term use


i also would have thought you would have welded something to the compressor cover outlet to make it fit with the one silicon bend
and thus given yourself somewhere to potentially add a BOV and perhaps a location for a nipple to pressurise your water tank ( if you chose that method )

something to think about for when you have more time , as you havent burned that bridge yet


have you commissioned the gas yet ?
would be really nice to see a vid of everything pressuring up to the convertor and to the mixer , ready to go

gerald m

yea the flanges are only 1/2 inch but they are stainless so I'm hoping .. (( I finally got one up on you bumpstart )) there is a hidden pipe under the silicone
hose that should do for the things we need .

I have a urge to tap into the cold side outlet housing for pressure to the water tank .. the tank already has a fitting in it for venting the fuel tank , they ran from the tank with a hose to a hole inside the frame to keep them clean .. the fuel outlet will be used for the water outlet , but it will need a coating of some kind to keep them from rusting inside . I think I will just use one tank and the other can just be there to keep it visually balanced . If I used them both it would mean another 30 lbs.

The vessels are full to the spitter , hoses are on and checked for tight , actually all I'm doing is keeping my promise to not turn the taps on in the shack . As far as the thread work I had my gas chum check them with his sniffer and they are A OK.
Drilled the turbo oil feed plate to 5/ 64 .. And yes I like the pipe work also except for the exhaust from waste gate to exit , the darn stuff is so heavy that it is almost impossible to shape ,, when I told WILL the blacksmith to use heavy pipe he sure did 3/16 wall but when I took everything apart and installed gaskets everything went together perfect as he told me to make sure it is all together before tightening or it wont fit proper , he was right on the money just snugged up everything together and he's perfect . except for one piece of poo china flange clamp for the hot side so just used a real one from a 6.5 turbo diesel and it went nice ,, yes the 6.5 diesel and the little engine have the same 3 inch exhaust size .


So are you saying that the lines will show the fuel going through by frosting or what ?? because if so I will make sure I do take some vid . my internet is so poor that I cant upload videos for a while now Me thinks it's time to upgrade .


SO anyone that cares I have and I quote (( a little piece of vintage gold )) coming from half way around the world to help with the tuning end of things , some of the old school guys will probably be interested in what we have up our sleeves now .. Once it's here we will show you what it is ,and what it does , I'm sure many of you including myself have never heard of such a thing ..

Terribly large drain hose for the turbo I think I would like to downsize to 1/4 inch instead of 3/8 . For intake I think I will build a simple cage with light rod and stretch a couple of pairs of nylon stockings sprayed with some kind of a oil base to collect dust .

latest pics ,, I think this is the way it will be for now ..

bumpstart

sounds like you are going the no pump method for WI .. i much prefer that route
( though the pump kit would be up and running faster,, and can potentially be tapped into the mixer or cold side .. it is better pre turbo .. and self adjusting with boost )

i would think about 300-350 cc per minute should be all we need at this ( relatively ) low HP end of the scale


the turbo drain needs to be as big as it physically can be ( important ! )

also in aus ,, tanks are deliberately left filled only 80 % max to get away with some funky things that may happen

the lines should not freeze ( as it is liquid in the hard line )
but the solenoids will all click and vapour will fill up the convertor top stage and the little primer button on top will be hard to press down
( press this for first cold start to fill the vapour line to the mixer )

if you get all the solenoid clicks.. and have pressure under the button ( at least till the solenoids shut )

then all is very good for go

bumpstart

oh. ps.. on some tracks it may be a requirement ( or at least good manners )
to weld a cross ( two perpendicular long bolts )
across ( pun partly intended ) the exit of your dump pipe . a few cm from the end

this is done in some drag cars in some futile attempt to keep failing turbine wheels from going hyper velocity into a crowd
though i rather suspect the issue is more related to some brands shop made hybrid turbo combinations exceeding turbine housing quality burst and containment standards

ie .. if a turbine shaft lets go .. it shouldnt be able to burst the turbine housing itself ..
.. the main cause of such incidents ..
and i suspect there is little realistic chance that an entire turbine wheel can exit via the dump pipe ..
but none the less ..sometimes the cross is still evident in some racetracks and it may be something to consider for a conversation piece,, and method to keep squirels out in winter

gerald m

I think maybe the spitter tube is a tad more than 80 % but not much , in comparison to size and volume they are pretty much the same as the 20 lb. tank , I think we are good there and if worst comes to worst the relief blows at 315 lbs.

the cross pieces were suppose to be done but WILL just forgot about them . try to work them in .

Yea I would like to try the no pump but the prices I got from the guy you mentioned 360.00 without tank are as much as a kit with pump so I will need to find a different source ??

About the wideband is it necessary to have more than 1 option or have you got other things up your big sleeves .. I could just run a 1 inch satellite oil pressure gauge . the only time I see much of any of them is on startup . I take it the air fuel is for tuning ?

but first the water injection do you have any hints where these components can be found .. this is my busy season and don't have much time for shopping right now .

The Dragon is getting fat he has gained i'm thinking 60 lbs over winter and spring so he will weigh in with rider around 725 lbs, with one tank of water but that is still in a ratio of around 2.3 pounds for every horse power at full potential.

I wonder if it will start

bumpstart

wideband you can chose what you like,, certainly wont blame you if you just make a non permanent setup that pokes up the exhaust dump just for tuning purpose

beware some name brands that have a poor rep for thermal shock of the probe ,, making for short longevity

the dm6 afr2 however has a good rep for probe life and can be setup as a multigauge to display whichever plumbed device you want,, and alarm when others reach thresholds

am thinking it suits your current dash to replace one gauge with another..rather than make space for a new 52 mm hole
( ie replace coolant temp gauge )
and then upgrade the dm6 afr2 with a coolant sender kit , display the AFR more or less permanently and let it alarm when coolant temps go offspec
( other wise engine temp display is there at touch of the screen )

the main reason i like the PLX though is the ability to keep a small onscreen trend display , so you you can drive the thing and then look back at the short log,, without driving off the road trying to squint at the gauge as it changes rapidly

this is very handy for carb guys who do not necessarily have the data recorded to an ecu to look back over

water injection wise .. time prudent . it may be best to err for now with a small pump kit .. which i guess can be plumbed into the compressor discharge ( or mixer inlet ) for now to easy up on the install around the turbo airfilter
( it works better pre turbo however ,, and tapers off less in flow against the boost )

the pre- turbo , no pump WI thing can be done at your leisure with aim to supplement or replace the pump kit later
( when you stumble over the parts for realistic prices in some horticultural or painters catalog )

kits from snow, devils own and aem come to mind .. bear in mind the pump should be made with methanol compatible seals .. and i have seen simple stage one kits for $250.. with tank

the balance in the bike is more important than the few kg it took on .. expecting a huge lift in power for that 30 - 35 kg , and your power to weight is going to be up there with 8 second rx3s
.. though you will never get that traction , will need ear muffs and asbestos undies ,, and will set fire to anyone in the left hand lane


start wise .. easy peasy from here ,, bloody easy to clear a flood .. just pull off a solenoid wire and crank it through ...
( flooded lpg responds like a petrol car with no fuel at all,, no coughs,, nothing ,, and a very lean one will cough but not quite catch )


after setting the plugs gaps to 0.60 mm ( b9 or b10 EG NGK ) and pressing that primer button on the convertor
im expecting it to fire up..
( if not , aerostart spray to get it to fire ,, once you have an idle adjusted,, it will be fine to start )
and may require you to feather a little and move base timing to around 15 BTDC at idle
once warmed a little adjust the carb ( low speed mixtures,, air bypass ) screw and the throttle stop to get an idle

the main fuel mixture should for now be set wide open ,, check down it by eye if your mixers full mixture valve is unmarked for graduations

after that.. it should start right up.. and only ever really be a problem needing the physical primer or the solenoid primer on the very first cold starts

gerald m

If there is time I will do some of these things , but on the weekend me thinks its time to get some oil in it finish the turbo lines and get ready for the thing . so I need different plugs than I ran NA ?

the valve in on full rich ,, there are still many small things to do but they are getting less .

If I am going wide band might as well get something that can grow , first I need a cash injection . as well as water might as well get things right . getting to old to redo things .. onward and upward ..

bumpstart

yes. fortunately PLX is one of the lesser priced units . and gives more bang for your buck than others

you do not need the wideband until you narrow down the tune for power

i am expecting it to run a little too rich out of the box and the power will be found in backing things off,,
prudently with a wideband ( and ultimately with a exhaust temp K couple kit ) as we do it

concentrate on the cheaper water kit .. we need the cooling and error margin this will bring as you lack intercooling and have the high comp rotors


plugs wise.. you will need a plug you can gap.. these EG, EV or EGV plugs have a single fine electrode tip that we can gap down .. they also require a spark plug socket that is lathed down thinwall to suit them

9 or 10 NGK heatrange ( cold ! ) ,, im thinking 9s for now .. these plugs are around $15 each

gerald m

This kinda jumped out out at me is this what you are talking or no I guess it will need a gauge also .


http://http://www.ebay.ca/itm/181392...84.m1423.l2649

gerald m

This kinda jumped out out at me is this what you are talking or no I guess it will need a gauge also .
PLX SM AFR GEN3 AIR Fuel Ratio Wideband Uego O2 Controler Bosch LSU 4 2 Sensor | eBay

bumpstart

that is the unit ! looks like it has had an update .. mine is only a gen 2 !!

the control unit is very small ..52 x 75 x 28mm and shouldnt be hard to find a spot for

when you wish to add devices like coolant and exhaust temp senders then the cases just slide together and will display through the one ( or as many ) gauges as you fit .. and you can set warning thresholds so they will alarm over the top of the gauge you currently veiw

the only thing i can fault about the PLX data system is the lack of a tacho module which would tie the data logs up together much better

usually the DM6 guage is included as a package .. ie.. AFR2/ DM6 combo
( in this case , that would be a AFR3/DM6 combo )

keep looking till you get them together

gerald m

Yea there is a set up with gauge and all for cheap , I think 219 and a little shipping not bad still haven't found a 52 mm gauge so might just go remote and mount somewhere ,

, I think i getting a little closer with the nozzles should be able to decide on something soon .

bumpstart

plx dm6 is 52mm standard gauge size and doesnt require much depth behind it , so should be able to replace any of the other gauges in your dash ( when you are ready )
you will have to find space for the little 52 x 75 x 28mm control unit
and purchase the wideband weld on socklet for the exhaust ( ebay )
.. since you dont have 800mm length in dump pipe and need to keep the wideband probe away from the exit to avoid air contaminating the exhaust stream
then you should err about halfway along the dump
( mindful of the instructions install angle and position )

again. it isnt necessary until you start to tune for power , as the basic setup will be a little rich out of the box
which is safe .. but will hold back the power and force up exhaust temps ( with LPG )

gerald m

well i think i will order it up for when the time comes , i had a long think about things and me thinks as i'm sure you suspected we will be heading for the 1/4 mile down the road a bit .

gerald m

Thought I mentioned my new old distributor that was coming from Australia of course who else but Bumpstart but I guess I missed it somehow . He has explained things to me on how it works , I know some of you are well aware of this type of Dizzy but am sure that there are tons of people on this forum that have never heard of an old school one that advances timing under boost . he has just finished explaining it to me but perhaps he would be kind enough to explain exactly how the dizzy works the vintage and so on . from what I understand it will help save me the detonation problems associated with boost pressures .

I have been doing a little search and I don't believe this dizzy was available on north American Mazda's but I could be very wrong . It's hard to find for any price and besides I like oddities so here is one more to integrate into my system . Thanks again bumpstart I knew you would have the solution up your big sleeves .

How about a little history .