500RWHP FD RX7 on PUMP gas...
12-31-07, 09:47 AM
#101
Will work for horsepower
I agree with Howard that on the street you reach a point were traction and common sense is the limiting factor. I drive on 11.50 et's becouse if or when i act stupid on the street there the only thing that helps me keep between the lines. They also keep me from driveing in the rain which i dont want to do anyway. If i want to travel i put on the 18's and swap hoods. I dont see how anyone with street tires and 500 h/p or more is safe to play at all! Even the new vetts cant use the power on street tires as i have found out!
12-31-07, 12:33 PM
#103
https://www.rx7club.com/time-slips-dyno-121/dyno-graphs-229717/page10/
scroll down a few and read the 567hp and 668ftlbs post!
also claimed on pump gas!
scroll down a few and read the 567hp and 668ftlbs post!
also claimed on pump gas!
12-31-07, 12:49 PM
#104
Living life 9 seconds at a time
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https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=229717&page=10
scroll down a few and read the 567hp and 668ftlbs post!
also claimed on pump gas!
scroll down a few and read the 567hp and 668ftlbs post!
also claimed on pump gas!
12-31-07, 01:14 PM
#106
To the original poster, if you are interested in road racing, be sure to check out the rules regarding AI. I know NASA whom I track with does not allow alcohol injection under any circumstances. Water on the other hand is fine and a better option imho for many reasons. Yes I have tried just alcohol and a mix before too.
The real limiting factor in your application will be controlling the heat produced by the engine for extended periods of time.
The real limiting factor in your application will be controlling the heat produced by the engine for extended periods of time.
12-31-07, 02:10 PM
#108
I agree with Howard that on the street you reach a point were traction and common sense is the limiting factor. I drive on 11.50 et's becouse if or when i act stupid on the street there the only thing that helps me keep between the lines. They also keep me from driveing in the rain which i dont want to do anyway. If i want to travel i put on the 18's and swap hoods. I dont see how anyone with street tires and 500 h/p or more is safe to play at all! Even the new vetts cant use the power on street tires as i have found out!
I think its a matter of who's behind the wheel, and what the are capable of controlling.
12-31-07, 04:01 PM
#109
BDC Motorsports
12-31-07, 05:55 PM
#110
Will work for horsepower
But my car on most of the streets i drive on wont hold the power with out a little drift action, but thats the fun part.
I have friends with 800/900 h/p supras and they handle better than i do. Maybe i need to work on the suspension.
12-31-07, 06:30 PM
#111
Performance Veteran...
Thread Starter
...AI technology renders 20B upgrades obsolete for 99% of the applications now. Like I said, for a significant performance advantage ONLY with respect to what you can run on straight PUMP maybe. But the 13B can delivery everything I'd ask of it at a fraction of the cost and weight/size at 550RWHP. Anything beyond ~550rwhp is useless on the street or race track...
12-31-07, 06:38 PM
#112
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here's an attaboy to Viper GTSR on the 13B-20B comparo.
...if you have driven an FD w 500 rwhp you will know that ponies above mid 500s are a little nutso. the car is pretty much out of control w 500+hp.
....if you road race/street race.... no you don't need more than 500 or thereabouts.
... there a people that are on, or have been on this board that have built 600+ hp street monsters and have been bummed to the point of selling their FDs as they just go sideways at any speed.
...550+ street FD = drifting anytime you want.
there is a sweet spot where you can pretty much run w anything and still live happily w your car. while that spot varies for each of us, the top of it is probably mid 500s.
hc
...if you have driven an FD w 500 rwhp you will know that ponies above mid 500s are a little nutso. the car is pretty much out of control w 500+hp.
....if you road race/street race.... no you don't need more than 500 or thereabouts.
... there a people that are on, or have been on this board that have built 600+ hp street monsters and have been bummed to the point of selling their FDs as they just go sideways at any speed.
...550+ street FD = drifting anytime you want.
there is a sweet spot where you can pretty much run w anything and still live happily w your car. while that spot varies for each of us, the top of it is probably mid 500s.
hc
Can't you solve this problem by using something like the Apexi AVCR for gear based boost control?
http://boostcontrollers.wordpress.co...st-controller/
For example, program the AVCR like this: 1st gear = 15lbs boost, 2nd gear = 18 lbs, 3rd = 22lbs, 4th = 25, 5th = 28???
Don't you just tweak the boost setting per gear so that the tires don't break free?
12-31-07, 07:57 PM
#113
My point exactly.
It's all about the combination. Anyone who can claim anything above 500hp is not needed does not have the entire combination figured out. Jason made a suggestion that is part of the combination of enjoying high horsepower on the street.
BTW. I have no problems putting down 40psi in 1st gear on the street because I've done what it takes to balance the combination and enjoy a 700hp street car on the street. Some build dyno queens. The rest buid the car for the intended use it was made for.
It's all about the combination. Anyone who can claim anything above 500hp is not needed does not have the entire combination figured out. Jason made a suggestion that is part of the combination of enjoying high horsepower on the street.
BTW. I have no problems putting down 40psi in 1st gear on the street because I've done what it takes to balance the combination and enjoy a 700hp street car on the street. Some build dyno queens. The rest buid the car for the intended use it was made for.
Last edited by crispeed; 12-31-07 at 08:21 PM.
12-31-07, 08:59 PM
#114
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My point exactly.
It's all about the combination. Anyone who can claim anything above 500hp is not needed does not have the entire combination figured out. Jason made a suggestion that is part of the combination of enjoying high horsepower on the street.
BTW. I have no problems putting down 40psi in 1st gear on the street because I've done what it takes to balance the combination and enjoy a 700hp street car on the street. Some build dyno queens. The rest buid the car for the intended use it was made for.
It's all about the combination. Anyone who can claim anything above 500hp is not needed does not have the entire combination figured out. Jason made a suggestion that is part of the combination of enjoying high horsepower on the street.
BTW. I have no problems putting down 40psi in 1st gear on the street because I've done what it takes to balance the combination and enjoy a 700hp street car on the street. Some build dyno queens. The rest buid the car for the intended use it was made for.
Anyhow, I never got the impression that the OP had the same intended use that your car was made for. He never said he was looking for a 1.3 60' time.
My suggestion of gear based boost control should be evaluated in the context of the OPs stated desire to build a daily driver that gets tracked now and then.
Last edited by Old Slow Coach; 12-31-07 at 09:28 PM.
12-31-07, 09:37 PM
#115
I thought that the comment about no more than 500 hp being necessary was made in the context of having a good set-up for road racing. If that is the case, if you have a good track set-up and keep adding power, then you'll have a great 4th gear, but you'll just smoke the tires in 3rd. WIth a good street/track set-up, around 575whp, Second and third gear become useless. My solution to this is to keep the good good track set-up, keep the monster 4th gear that'll pin you to the seat from 80-140, and just limit boost in 2nd and 3rd.
Anyhow, I never got the impression that the OP had the same intended use that your car was made for. He never said he was looking for a 1.3 60' time.
My suggestion of gear based boost control should be evaluated in the context of the OPs stated desire to build a daily driver that gets tracked now and then.
Anyhow, I never got the impression that the OP had the same intended use that your car was made for. He never said he was looking for a 1.3 60' time.
My suggestion of gear based boost control should be evaluated in the context of the OPs stated desire to build a daily driver that gets tracked now and then.
BTW. The 40psi in 1st gear I was talking about is a 100% street car and will never see a track in it's lifetime.
12-31-07, 09:46 PM
#117
Some dynos are known for doing that type of stuff. Sometimes common sence play a small part in the world we live in.
12-31-07, 09:58 PM
#118
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So, do you wanna keep this interesting and spec a turbo that would best suit the OP's intended use?
12-31-07, 10:06 PM
#119
Typical 20B setup shouldnt run more than about $15-$20k.
If I was to do it over again I would have just gone 20B instead of dumping almost the same amount of money into my 13B's. If you compare the cost of building both there isnt that much of a price difference, depending on the bells and whistles you add to the 20B.
12-31-07, 10:11 PM
#120
X2 Ernie.
...AI technology renders 20B upgrades obsolete for 99% of the applications now. Like I said, for a significant performance advantage ONLY with respect to what you can run on straight PUMP maybe. But the 13B can delivery everything I'd ask of it at a fraction of the cost and weight/size at 550RWHP. Anything beyond ~550rwhp is useless on the street or race track...
...AI technology renders 20B upgrades obsolete for 99% of the applications now. Like I said, for a significant performance advantage ONLY with respect to what you can run on straight PUMP maybe. But the 13B can delivery everything I'd ask of it at a fraction of the cost and weight/size at 550RWHP. Anything beyond ~550rwhp is useless on the street or race track...
If you are building an RX-7 for a drag car then yea its a little cheaper to do the 13B.
12-31-07, 11:49 PM
#121
Performance Veteran...
Thread Starter
Really depends on what your looking for. I have a shop car that makes 620 RWHP on a full bridge/large turbo thats on pump gas and Meth, but you couldnt pay me to drive that on a daily basis as my ears bleed from the damn loud bridge. On the other hand the 20B making similar numbers, idles like a Lexus and sounds like an Indy car under WOT.
If you are building an RX-7 for a drag car then yea its a little cheaper to do the 13B.
If you are building an RX-7 for a drag car then yea its a little cheaper to do the 13B.
That will be very fast in a straight line...but with a GT40R, she'll have a powerband for the road courses to boot*
01-01-08, 09:50 AM
#124
Lives on the Forum
This is not a question of "if" it can be done....because it really isn't that hard to make 500 on pump gas alone. To me the question is why? Why take such a risk for "bragging rights"? Why would you set out to build a time bomb? Why would you want to build a $15K set up that's life relies on a sticker that says "93 oct" on it? Pump gas is sooo unreliable and unstable especially @ the boost levels needed to to make 500rwhp.
I love to prove people wrong, make a stand, prove a point or do what someone tells me cant be done but I'm also trying to go about it in an intelligent way as well.
And I don't believe pump gas @ those levels is "intelligent". My $0.02 AI ftw!
I love to prove people wrong, make a stand, prove a point or do what someone tells me cant be done but I'm also trying to go about it in an intelligent way as well.
And I don't believe pump gas @ those levels is "intelligent". My $0.02 AI ftw!
I guess we're all wasting our time throwing all this cash "just to prove a point"...
Sure, supplemental injection adds a safety margin, so I guess it all comes down to how big your ***** are...?
I remember people who used to bitch about me whining about what can and cannot be done...
Funny how it sounds with the shoe on the other foot.
-Ted
