2ndGen.rocket

Exactly. Don't listen to these idiots, most of them are 17 or dumb. You will never get people to admit that RX-7's and imports in general are not the end all, be all of automobiles. To them, anything with a V8 in it is for rednecks. I know that these guys don't smoke TA's, Cobra's, or various other LS1's all day long, they just don't post the numerous times that they've been killed by them.

audiobot7

Agreed.

IndyKid

I will try to sum a few things up. First-Nihilanthic. Your post are way to long. I never read any of them because of the size and the fact that I was board to death by the fourth sentence. If you can't get your point across in 1 paragragh then don't post. My car gets full boost all of it by 3700rmps!!!! Add 500lbs.of tq to go with it Pump gas!!The other area supras that are drag racers are getting 60' times of 1.6 on et streets! There is not a domestic in the state that is eager to run these guys. I really didn't want a bashing but you dumb *** don't know the first thing about jap supercars. I have owned 2 porsche 3 corvettes and **** load of other cars. There is a reason that I bought the supra and it wasn't for its ******* looks!!

sleeper_fc

I was going to run that Trans Am but I need to sell my car. He is a local guy that I know.

BTW: Supras are overratted, buy my car.

audiobot7

This forum and the supra forum has all the haters (Including myself, I hate on whiners). You race with what you got, a kill is a kill. Simple as that. No excuses, no crying, no whining, no bitching. Give respect where its due.

Alex-7

Shinobi-X

I'd actually be interested in hearing of LSx powered 7's going up against their domestic powered counterparts.

03EBZ06

Where are you getting 305 flywheel hp from? Factory rating? That rating was under-rated to keep Vette owners happy. I'm pretty sure many knowledgeable gearheads on this site knows that LS1 motor in F-Body was under-rated.

My bone stock 2000 SS dyno'ed 315 rwhp and vast majority of them are dyno'ing 285 rwhp - 320+ rwhp, in fact, I would say there are more LS1s dyno'ing 300+ rwhp than 290 range, far from 305 flywheel hp. This is based on being LS1 engine moderator for over 2 years and having set up several local F-Body dyno days.

2ndGen.rocket

It's pointless, LS1's are total crap here. No matter how many time you beat it into someone's head that the LS1 is a much better, stronger, and more capable platform than any rotary, they won't get it.

MakoRacing

iTrader: (12)

Agreed.... a supra lost, give props to another fast car. Why must people cry for 8 pages about it?

quick_brick

Dude, i know an 96' Impala SS that will wax those numbers. 1300hp on pump gas. See, all this is is a pissing contest. Give credit where credit is dude, imports are not the end all be all of cars, especially the supra. I'd rather own a Turbo T/A or a GNX over that anyway, personal prefrence.

quick_brick

A turbo LS1 savanna would be a site to behold.

Nihilanthic

Take a reading comprehension class. This is a forum, not IRC. Maybe if you had the attention span to read longer you might learn more.


500 foot lbs at 3700 rpms? Got a dyno to prove it?

Uh, I know plenty about them. I also know that most I see are people with money and a desire to adhere to 'image' who put dubz and lowering springs on a supra, get the biggest turbo they can easily find, slap it on, and go do top speed runs.

Cut springs, dubz, and a 1000 hp turbo make not a drag racer. Drag wheels, slicks, and a suitably sized turbo, or nitrous to spool a giant one, does. I never doubed Supras can drag - but most of those race from a roll highway run **** just throw money at an already expensive car for ******* image, which matters to everyone here more than the numbers or who won the race... at least if its against a F-Body.

Also, Im sure all the domestic guys hang out with bigoted, pissy import guys and try to race them, Suuure. I doubt theyre hanging out with them to race them! Why the **** would they WANT to when even if they win theyre just called 'crappy cheap redneck cars' by the likes of you?

For any Supra running insane times there are Mustangs or F-Bodies or PICKUPS doing the same or more. Tell ya what, how about I go get a forged 3800 and slap a turbo on that? Or if I want to throw money at it, which Supra owners are so renound at doing, I could get a forged 406 (or bigger) to turbocharge. Or if Im really insane, a big block.

Oh but hey, big turbo = cool, but big displacment = not cool, according to the mindset everyone here has gotten from the marketing departments of thsoe jap manufacturers and the F/F movies.


This isnt even about different platforms and their pros or cons. Its about people like you and your ilk who get sucked into the mindset of 'us vs them' and you think that you're on the Jap import team, and are thus sooo superior. You think expensive import + smaller displacement than a domestic v8 + big turbo = superior, and **** on everything else. Yes, Supras are better built, arguably nicer cars than F-bodies. They were also more expensive! ****, theyre still going for 30 large.

Part of the american mindset has been to just make something that ******* works without dumping on techno-**** for marketing or for the sake of it. Simplicity is a virture - at least if people talk about a rotary And for that matter, the F-body was more or less intended for everyone... not an expensive sports-luxury car.

So yeah, a Supra can kick *** if you have the money to throw at it and a turbo for that engine to lean on. Congrats.

P.S. - if you read all of this, go call up that guy from Star Trek on reading rainbow and ask for a cookie.

quick_brick

Big displacement is for red necks, as are the laws of physics. Turbos and 4 cylinders are the way to go because it is high tech!!! All motors have potential. Only monomaniacs say that v8's are for rednecks, but who is bitching about that firechicken cooking the supra? You guessed it. Personally, i like hanging out with import owners more than i do domestic owners, as the domestic owners can be stupid too. I just love me some imports.
(p.s. i don't hate on 4 cylinders, i love my volvo station wagon.)

Nihilanthic

Im building a ford 2.3T (lima) because Im broke but still wanna go fast. Also, I got into a pissymatch with someone and he had a friend building a budget 13b-T build and he wants to race me... so Im basically stuck with that unless I wanna be a chickenshit.

If I had more money Id go with a v8... more potential, more ways to go - though to be fair, Id go 13b-T if it was the cheapest route to go. Yes, if someone right now proved to me I could get 350-400 whp cheaper with a 13b-T than a 2.3 Id eat my words this very second, and go that route! Im not hating on rotaries - theyre different, and they use turbos at lower boost but high flow and it gives a different sort of 'feel' than higher boost ratios and lower revs do. Hell, Ive seen GT35R dynos that looked like it was a N/A engine. And, the increasing torque feels faster than a midrange torque peak and flat power - which would be fun, but what FEELS fastest isnt necessarily what IS fastest, or wins the race.

Im doing this 'poorboy', and in the USA thats perfectly okay - you dont have to be patrician or win the lottery to have big bucks to buy something, you can put some effort into it and build it to get where you want to go, and I like that. Its not about how you show off your money by blowing it on 'image' related bullshit and talking and acting in a way that calls into questions how you got your job in the first place, unless youre a trust fund kiddy, at least to me.

RETed

You size the turbo(s) to the engine, not the other way around.
If you have no idea what I'm talking about, you should've be ******* with turbos in the first place.

If the assumption is using a particular turbo (i.e. turbine A/R) on one engine and then slapping that identical turbo on a different displacement engine, then that other guy is right - but that's a downright ludicrous assumption.

To the guy arguing about the 1990 IROC - I'm sorry, but the car is a piece of ****, period.
My best friend owns one.
He bought it new.
It has about 30,000 miles on it now, and he babies it.
The car is immaculate...or immaculate as a 1990 Camaro can be.
It's still a piece of ****.
I know the car inside and out.
The car goes through front tires like there's no tomorrow - too much weight up front.
The chassis is so loose and creaky, nothing short of a a roll cage can get it to tighten it up.
Suspenion upgrades makes the body flex MORE.
That same friend comment how well my 1987 Turbo II drove...on STOCK suspension.
The stock suspension on the IROC is seriously underdamped - it wallows like a pig and shows it's weight.
5.0 + 5-speed...still slow.
5.7 + auto...better grunt, but auto trans is sluggish.

Now, we can argue till we're all blue in the face about mods, but that's an endless argument.
I'm just trying to straight some of the "facts" that got twisted in here.

That TA is downright fast, period.
No one can deny that.
But it's still on a straight, and to me it was a relatively short sprint race - maybe 70 to 150?


-Ted

Nihilanthic

Hey, RETed... I got one too! I go through REAR tires like theres no tomorrow.

You or him put SFCs on it? Or replaced the shocks? Somehow, I doubt 15 y/o shocks are up to the task of damping an IROC-Z. But yes, a car that old, and that heavy, does need new shocks, and SFCs would go a LONG way to stiffen the chassis. Id also want to make the top end a little stiffer too, as mine has T-Tops. Its no Supra, but then again, its a 3rd gen CAMARO! Its a cheaper car by design, but then again who doesnt put strut bars, SFCs or a cage in a car theyre seriously going to race around? As cheap as they are these days its not hard to justify the expense. You'd certainly have one hell of a car before you got up to the 20-30 large (if you could get it that cheaply) for a TT Supra.

As far as the poopra/firechicken debacle... Uh... TOP END HIGHWAY RUNS ARE ON STRAIGHTS! Stop bringing up the handling bullshit, nobody races from a roll on a highway through turns, sheesh. If a Supra was stripped and setup for handling, it more than likely would spend all of its time on the highway at 0 rpms in the back of a trailer.

And as far as turbo sizing, yes, most of us here know at least something about turbo sizing. However putting a turbo that was on a 3 liter Supra on a larger displacement engine will result in the turbo spooling faster RPM wise. Even if the A/R on the hotside is too small... it will still spool up faster! It will probably run out of breath and might end up choking out the engine, but then again, ANY several-hundred-to-one-thousand horsepower capable turbo will be able to flow plenty of exhaust gas, so why even bring that up?

I mean ****, if you wanna get into more advanced subjects such as compressor surge... uh... a bigger displacement engine will move more air and be less likely to do so. This isnt like someone slapping a ginormous turbo on some integra and surging it, its a GIANT turbo on a supra being put on an even bigger engine. There is nothing ludicrous about thinking a 500+ hp turbo on a v8 would spool faster or would be more tractable, unless your WG couldnt flow and you got boost creep, etc.

rotorsownyou7

That is what I was talking about. Supra's do the same, and they run close to the same excat times stock. So why would a Supra need 150 hp extra to keep up.(some guy said that.

rotorsownyou7

I wasn't saying that. I like LS1's. I have had one. I was thinking about putting one in a 7. Bad *** engine I think.

Anyway, this thread is stupid. That Trans Am is fast. Whoopdie doo. There are a lot of Supras out there that would smoke that Trans Am. There are Trans Ams that would smoke those Supras. There are Supras that would whip those last TA's. There are TA's that would again come ahead. This will keep going, and in the end John Force rules all.

quick_brick

Maybe his is, but i know i haven't been through a set of front tires yet on my car. I don't find my car wallowing in turns at all. And more than a few guys have been very sucessful with these cars in autocross and road racing. But hey, then again mine has subframe connectors, a strut tower brace and a custom rear brace so there is ZERO flex. It doesn't matter how many miles are on it, those shocks are old AND it depends on what suspension RPO it came with. i have Global West springs and Tokico adjustable shocks, and stock sway bars with poly end links and mounts and let me tell you this thing barely has any body roll. Enough disinformation please.

quick_brick

hah, thats true.

SoontobeLS1'd

I never made any mention of which turbos were being used on the 7.0 iron block. In fact, at this point, I do not know what would be the best turbo(s) for said application-as I am not in the middle of building a turbo motor anyways. I do know that given the large amount of displacement the same turbo(s) you put on the Supra will spool relatively quicker.

I do know what you are talking about but I am still not ready to "be ******* with turbos."

Nihilanthic

SFCS, tower braces, coilovers, and just bushings would go a long way. Same for tubular LCAs and PHB. It would basically be like a real wide FB if it was properly set up.

I relay think that his car is just... er... plagued iwth loose mounts/bushings and some worn, tired shocks.

socalrotor

iTrader: (1)

JUST FOR THE RECORD. Base price for LS1 F body is around HALF the supra. Apples to oranges for 9 pages. If you decided to buy either car used right now and want to build a fast car under 20 grand which car you think will end up faster? A supra with 5 grand in mods or a F body with 10-12 grand in mods? DUH

Alex-7

Rofl,

For the record. 20 grand will get you an NA supra, or a turbo with a 5-10k loan and no money left to mod.