Kilo Racing 3 Rotor FD Conversion
01-09-17, 05:34 PM
#4426
Nevermind about the clarification. With Davids above confirmation, I did some searching and it's shocking that "C" needs to go to each individual rotor housing. With the whole block being a ground, this is just weird. That wire must sense some sort of feed back? Guess I'll just use each one of the engine knock holes for "C" and run "B" to the ECU ground like I've seen in other photos. Thanks again David!
Last edited by t-von; 01-09-17 at 05:39 PM.
01-10-17, 10:34 AM
#4429
^ Really am not looking forward to pulling the dash to repair the air mix control. We will see what is lurking in there. My wild dream is something is unplugged and that is it. We will see.
Going to pull the steering wheel later this week and send it out for recovering. I've never liked the way the current recovering has looked and I think the new style will be pretty trick. This should give me motivation to pull the dash.
Off tomorrow to Addicted to have the idle speed control fixed and my fuel gauge adjusted.
T-von, I don't know why the wiring works that way but I know it needs to be done. You have some really good options thought on top of each rotor housing to locate the grounds.
Going to pull the steering wheel later this week and send it out for recovering. I've never liked the way the current recovering has looked and I think the new style will be pretty trick. This should give me motivation to pull the dash.
Off tomorrow to Addicted to have the idle speed control fixed and my fuel gauge adjusted.
T-von, I don't know why the wiring works that way but I know it needs to be done. You have some really good options thought on top of each rotor housing to locate the grounds.
01-28-17, 05:22 PM
#4432
Couple of updates on the car.
Drove a few weeks ago to Addicted Performance to have the idle speed controller and the fuel gauge adjusted. We struck out on getting the idle speed controller to work. Just can't get the unit to close fully when turned off so it creates a boost leak. Not good. Would work if we used the DPO now occupied by the OMP control via the Haltech PS2000 but I'd rather have that working so living with less than ideal warm up idle. Once warmed up, no issues.
Addicted pulled out the CJ Motorsports fuel pump assembly and reclocked the gauge sender. The stock fuel pump rail uses two holes to keep the sender calibrated but the CJ Motorsports unit only has one hole so things can get off. The adjustment has corrected the incorrect readings but what a bitch taking the unit out for something like this.
Had a problem with the air temp mix actuator (hot/cold) - it wasn't working. The manual says you have to pull the dash and I wasn't looking forward to that so I did some reviewing and was successful in removing the actuator without pulling the dash. Good news on that. Pulled the motor apart and cleaned it out and it now works so I can have hot air during the winter. Thumbs up to that.
Had the windshield replaced. Got to say for the money (cost $203) this is one of the best things you can do on the car. In addition to 23 years of rock chips, the body shop that painted the car got something on the inside of the windshield that just wouldn't come off. I tried everything but ultimately needed to replace the unit. Can't believe how clear it now is. A few shots:
Removing the old windshield. SafeLite has a really cool tool that uses string to cut through the window adhesive. This prevents scratches on the frame and the dash.
Old window being removed. Look closely for all the small rock chips.
Prepping the frame for the new glass. The technician was very careful.
New glass installed.
I know there has been some issue with FD glass availability but Satellite found the correct (grey tint) unit for my car so give them a call. I'd recommend this for any FD owner as the cost is small and the result great.
Drove the car a few weeks ago and noted that vacuum had dropped from around 18 to 16 or so. Had me worried. While not bad (16) for an altitude of 2,200 feet (Asheville), any change is worrisome given what I have gone though. So, my first thought was to pull the plugs to inspect them. Biggest issue I had was the plugs were "Shorties" and my spark plug remover wouldn't reach them. After a few failed attempts at ordering thin wall sockets (they weren't) I ordered a socket from Atkins Rotary that worked perfectly. A shot of the plugs. What do you think?
The plugs have obviously been through a rough time on the dyno so I replaced them with some NGK BUR9EQP units. Fired up the car and took it out for a spin to warm it up. Pleased to report vacuum has not only gone back up but it's higher than before, sitting at around 19 versus the previous 18. Small victory but a good one.
Finally, while I was chasing a spark plug socket for the shorties, I sent out my Miata steering wheel for recovering. Have never been pleased with the quality of the recovering done here in Asheville so I took some time to review all of the options and the quality of work from each shop. Ended up sending the wheel to Dallas Custom Steering Wheels:
Dallas Custom Steering Wheel
Crappy website but fantastic customer service and work. I am blown away by the quality of the recovering but will let you be the judge.
Before
After
Installed
I used perforated leather on the center sections and non-perforated on the bottom to mimic the 99 spec look but added Alcantara and a red stripe to the top. I also had them add "thumb inserts" to the wheel and had it thickened to update its appearance.
All in all, very pleased and would highly recommend Dallas Custom Steering Wheels to you.
That's it for now. Have a few more projects to spruce up the engine bay and will post those up soon.
Drove a few weeks ago to Addicted Performance to have the idle speed controller and the fuel gauge adjusted. We struck out on getting the idle speed controller to work. Just can't get the unit to close fully when turned off so it creates a boost leak. Not good. Would work if we used the DPO now occupied by the OMP control via the Haltech PS2000 but I'd rather have that working so living with less than ideal warm up idle. Once warmed up, no issues.
Addicted pulled out the CJ Motorsports fuel pump assembly and reclocked the gauge sender. The stock fuel pump rail uses two holes to keep the sender calibrated but the CJ Motorsports unit only has one hole so things can get off. The adjustment has corrected the incorrect readings but what a bitch taking the unit out for something like this.
Had a problem with the air temp mix actuator (hot/cold) - it wasn't working. The manual says you have to pull the dash and I wasn't looking forward to that so I did some reviewing and was successful in removing the actuator without pulling the dash. Good news on that. Pulled the motor apart and cleaned it out and it now works so I can have hot air during the winter. Thumbs up to that.
Had the windshield replaced. Got to say for the money (cost $203) this is one of the best things you can do on the car. In addition to 23 years of rock chips, the body shop that painted the car got something on the inside of the windshield that just wouldn't come off. I tried everything but ultimately needed to replace the unit. Can't believe how clear it now is. A few shots:
Removing the old windshield. SafeLite has a really cool tool that uses string to cut through the window adhesive. This prevents scratches on the frame and the dash.
Old window being removed. Look closely for all the small rock chips.
Prepping the frame for the new glass. The technician was very careful.
New glass installed.
I know there has been some issue with FD glass availability but Satellite found the correct (grey tint) unit for my car so give them a call. I'd recommend this for any FD owner as the cost is small and the result great.
Drove the car a few weeks ago and noted that vacuum had dropped from around 18 to 16 or so. Had me worried. While not bad (16) for an altitude of 2,200 feet (Asheville), any change is worrisome given what I have gone though. So, my first thought was to pull the plugs to inspect them. Biggest issue I had was the plugs were "Shorties" and my spark plug remover wouldn't reach them. After a few failed attempts at ordering thin wall sockets (they weren't) I ordered a socket from Atkins Rotary that worked perfectly. A shot of the plugs. What do you think?
The plugs have obviously been through a rough time on the dyno so I replaced them with some NGK BUR9EQP units. Fired up the car and took it out for a spin to warm it up. Pleased to report vacuum has not only gone back up but it's higher than before, sitting at around 19 versus the previous 18. Small victory but a good one.
Finally, while I was chasing a spark plug socket for the shorties, I sent out my Miata steering wheel for recovering. Have never been pleased with the quality of the recovering done here in Asheville so I took some time to review all of the options and the quality of work from each shop. Ended up sending the wheel to Dallas Custom Steering Wheels:
Dallas Custom Steering Wheel
Crappy website but fantastic customer service and work. I am blown away by the quality of the recovering but will let you be the judge.
Before
After
Installed
I used perforated leather on the center sections and non-perforated on the bottom to mimic the 99 spec look but added Alcantara and a red stripe to the top. I also had them add "thumb inserts" to the wheel and had it thickened to update its appearance.
All in all, very pleased and would highly recommend Dallas Custom Steering Wheels to you.
That's it for now. Have a few more projects to spruce up the engine bay and will post those up soon.
01-29-17, 04:55 PM
#4435
David glad to see progress being made on your car. Just got mine three weeks ago from Kilo Racing. Still working out some issues. Kilo not to happy with me having a dual wastegate set up. I also had to change my plugs after about 550 miles from rebuild from Kilo. Car is super rich going to switch out primary injectors to smaller ones. I also purchased those mhm plugs. They seem to work better
01-29-17, 07:28 PM
#4437
The NGK R7420 iridium spark plugs. They're expensive but they're worth it in the long run. If your only running 16-18 psi, you can leave them with the gap they come with. If you want to push a lot of boost through them, you can gap them to 0.18-0.2 . And after 10-20k miles later depending on driving, you can literally pull them out, clean them, regap them and throw them back in. If your running big boost, you'll be regapping a lot more often but that's to be expected from big boost, high HP setups.
I normally only get them in 10, 10.5, and 11 range now and I'll make a heat range choice based on the persons setup. But typically I'm putting 10.5 all around in most people's setups at a minimum.
thewird
I normally only get them in 10, 10.5, and 11 range now and I'll make a heat range choice based on the persons setup. But typically I'm putting 10.5 all around in most people's setups at a minimum.
thewird
01-30-17, 07:59 AM
#4438
David glad to see progress being made on your car. Just got mine three weeks ago from Kilo Racing. Still working out some issues. Kilo not to happy with me having a dual wastegate set up. I also had to change my plugs after about 550 miles from rebuild from Kilo. Car is super rich going to switch out primary injectors to smaller ones. I also purchased those mhm plugs. They seem to work better
What injectors are you running for the primaries? Check out the ID Injectors.
Finally, what are "mhm" plugs?
The NGK R7420 iridium spark plugs. They're expensive but they're worth it in the long run. If your only running 16-18 psi, you can leave them with the gap they come with. If you want to push a lot of boost through them, you can gap them to 0.18-0.2 . And after 10-20k miles later depending on driving, you can literally pull them out, clean them, regap them and throw them back in. If your running big boost, you'll be regapping a lot more often but that's to be expected from big boost, high HP setups.
I normally only get them in 10, 10.5, and 11 range now and I'll make a heat range choice based on the persons setup. But typically I'm putting 10.5 all around in most people's setups at a minimum.
thewird
I normally only get them in 10, 10.5, and 11 range now and I'll make a heat range choice based on the persons setup. But typically I'm putting 10.5 all around in most people's setups at a minimum.
thewird
01-30-17, 12:26 PM
#4440
^ Thanks for the update on NGK versus MHM plugs. Thought there was something new. 
1600s are way too big for the primaries. You need 850cc injectors for the primaries. Kilo will most likely use RC Engineering units and those are fine but there are some really nice, newer style injectors available. I recommended the ID Injectors to you:
ID1000 Injectors - Injector Dynamics
They have better, more consistent flow and are completely matched. Also, they can be installed with the FFE insets versus the "old school" way Kilo installs injectors:
Lower O-Ring Inserts | Full Function Engineering
My injectors started to leak on the dyno and are now swapped out to ID 1000s in the primary and 2000s in the secondary rail with the FFE inserts. Yes, they cost more but the results are better.
A fallback would be the Bosch EV injectors:
http://www.bosch-motorsport.com/medi...5993867pdf.pdf
They work similarly to the ID but are not matched like ID does. Food for thought as you move forward.
1600s are way too big for the primaries. You need 850cc injectors for the primaries. Kilo will most likely use RC Engineering units and those are fine but there are some really nice, newer style injectors available. I recommended the ID Injectors to you:
ID1000 Injectors - Injector Dynamics
They have better, more consistent flow and are completely matched. Also, they can be installed with the FFE insets versus the "old school" way Kilo installs injectors:
Lower O-Ring Inserts | Full Function Engineering
My injectors started to leak on the dyno and are now swapped out to ID 1000s in the primary and 2000s in the secondary rail with the FFE inserts. Yes, they cost more but the results are better.
A fallback would be the Bosch EV injectors:
http://www.bosch-motorsport.com/medi...5993867pdf.pdf
They work similarly to the ID but are not matched like ID does. Food for thought as you move forward.
01-30-17, 03:52 PM
#4442
david, saying "1600cc injectors are too big for primaries" is misleading unless you're aware of the guy's EMS setup, as some don't have resolution fine enough to shoot a tiny pulsewidth at idle.
i had ID2000 (2200cc) primary injectors in my red FD with a Haltech PS1000 and it idled perfectly fine.
(you actually *need* as big of primary injectors as you can get with the haltech sport series EMSs because they don't have automated injector staging like the Elite or some other EMSs do)
i had ID2000 (2200cc) primary injectors in my red FD with a Haltech PS1000 and it idled perfectly fine.
(you actually *need* as big of primary injectors as you can get with the haltech sport series EMSs because they don't have automated injector staging like the Elite or some other EMSs do)
01-30-17, 04:30 PM
#4443
Well I have seen 1600s used in the primaries on a bunch of 2 rotors, most without good success. They are very difficult to get to idle correctly. My guess is, if Kilo wants to replace the injectors, this is the problem on the car. I'd also guess the injectors are an older style injector and they will be tough to control.
But we can ask Spintriangles to post up his ECU and then, the brand of injectors and we will know. If Kilo did the tune, then it's Microtech which can't control the injectors like an Elite.
My 3 rotor had 850s for primaries and 1600s for the secondaries and we never ran out of fuel. Addicted replaced them because they were leaking under boost and the RC Engineering units are more difficult to control than the IDs.
But we can ask Spintriangles to post up his ECU and then, the brand of injectors and we will know. If Kilo did the tune, then it's Microtech which can't control the injectors like an Elite.
My 3 rotor had 850s for primaries and 1600s for the secondaries and we never ran out of fuel. Addicted replaced them because they were leaking under boost and the RC Engineering units are more difficult to control than the IDs.
01-30-17, 06:19 PM
#4448
Wow. I did not know that. Going to see what Majic Kilo can do with microtech. I have faith in him but not a lot in microtech. Worst case scenario I sell my power fc and microtech for maybe a haltech. I will research if I have to cross that bridge. David are you running single wastegate or dual
01-31-17, 10:14 AM
#4449
^ Yep, not a follower of Adaptronic much, but heard of the issues on FDs. I am sure it is like most new ECUs, things just need to be worked out.
Kilo will get the Microtech running like a champ for you so let him finish it up, drive the car for a while, and then decide what you want to do. The Haltech Elite is awesome and would be a nice next step but the important thing is to complete the plan you now have.
I run a single waste gate. Ask Kilo about it, he picked it out (Tial) and made me take off my Synapse unit. Works fine and no boost creep.
Kilo will get the Microtech running like a champ for you so let him finish it up, drive the car for a while, and then decide what you want to do. The Haltech Elite is awesome and would be a nice next step but the important thing is to complete the plan you now have.
I run a single waste gate. Ask Kilo about it, he picked it out (Tial) and made me take off my Synapse unit. Works fine and no boost creep.
01-31-17, 11:40 AM
#4450
David, i'm running bosch ev14 2000cc primaries and secondaries on my car . I like Adaptronic personally and have had good success in a lot of cars, the internet is full of whiners. Not that Haltech isn't good, its a great option too. My only down vote would be for Microtech as a street car ECU.
thewird
. I like Adaptronic personally and have had good success in a lot of cars, the internet is full of whiners. Not that Haltech isn't good, its a great option too. My only down vote would be for Microtech as a street car ECU.thewird