Kilo Racing 3 Rotor FD Conversion
07-11-13, 02:13 PM
#3777
^ Didn't really consider BFGoodrich until I learned of the Rival. For me, it seems like the perfect solution. I'm not an extremely skilled track driver and I also want something I can drive on the street but then take to the track on weekends. Given this, the Rival is specifically designed for me.
as for the GT wing ... I'm HONESTLY with you on the whole car looks better without one LoL , I loved your car at deals gap. who knows what alternatives there may be out there .
and I'm a big fan of the feed fenders they mix with the car's lines so well .
07-11-13, 02:36 PM
#3778
^ Glad it can help you, it did it for me. Seems to be ideal for the majority of us, or those that want to drive on the street and do some occasional weekend tracking. I'll let you know my impressions once I get to use them but more importantly, those of experienced track guys. They will feel more of the tire characteristics than I will.
On the wing, I am right there with you. Bought the car new in 94 without a wing because I didn't like them then and still not a big fan today. I'd guess at my level driving it won't make a big deal one way or another.
On the Feed (Shine replica) fenders, I never even knew these existed until Peter pointed them out. Think they will look nice on the car so I am going to see. Like the car the way it is now too so it will be interesting.
On the wing, I am right there with you. Bought the car new in 94 without a wing because I didn't like them then and still not a big fan today. I'd guess at my level driving it won't make a big deal one way or another.
On the Feed (Shine replica) fenders, I never even knew these existed until Peter pointed them out. Think they will look nice on the car so I am going to see. Like the car the way it is now too so it will be interesting.
07-11-13, 03:41 PM
#3779
David, a wing would keep you from spinning out. A 20b is oversteer happy from my shoort experience so far. There's a ton of weight up front and a light as hell rear. I've had to completely redo my suspension setup and max my 99 wing and I'm still not happy. Probably gonna end up getting a gt wing, maybe on another hatch.
thewird
thewird
07-11-13, 03:47 PM
#3780
Thanks Marco. I know one would be better, it's just the styling for me. The best solution I guess would be to get another hatch and GT wing like Jantore says. We will see.
Regarding the weight, mine tipped in on the scales at around 3,000 lbs. and was a 48/52 balance front to rear. What is it for a 2 rotor? Outside of the 3,000 lbs. (with a full tank of gas), I was pretty pleased with the distribution and it was about even on all 4 corners.
Kilo has the car going on a weight diet so we will reweigh it once we are done. Will still be heavier than most as I like the creature comforts (PS/AC,etc.) and I don't want to give them up.
Regarding the weight, mine tipped in on the scales at around 3,000 lbs. and was a 48/52 balance front to rear. What is it for a 2 rotor? Outside of the 3,000 lbs. (with a full tank of gas), I was pretty pleased with the distribution and it was about even on all 4 corners.
Kilo has the car going on a weight diet so we will reweigh it once we are done. Will still be heavier than most as I like the creature comforts (PS/AC,etc.) and I don't want to give them up.
07-11-13, 08:37 PM
#3781
David,
Not that you don't already have enough options for spoilers, have you considered Shine Auto's low profile spoiler? It kinda fits with your low key look. As far as function is concerned, I don't know, but it looks nice to me!
Keep up the good work!
Vince
Not that you don't already have enough options for spoilers, have you considered Shine Auto's low profile spoiler? It kinda fits with your low key look. As far as function is concerned, I don't know, but it looks nice to me!
Keep up the good work!
Vince
07-11-13, 09:27 PM
#3782
Hi Vince. I really like the look of the Shine spoiler and just about pulled the trigger on it a year or so ago. Thought it looked like a nice compromise for me. However, I found out it has to be taped onto the taillights and center light and I didn't like that very much as to remove the lights you've got to undo the tape. I think Shine needs a better solution than tape so I passed.
As much as I like the look, I'd also suspect it won't do much for downforce.
As much as I like the look, I'd also suspect it won't do much for downforce.
07-15-13, 12:39 PM
#3783
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David, a wing would keep you from spinning out. A 20b is oversteer happy from my shoort experience so far. There's a ton of weight up front and a light as hell rear. I've had to completely redo my suspension setup and max my 99 wing and I'm still not happy. Probably gonna end up getting a gt wing, maybe on another hatch.
thewird
thewird
07-16-13, 10:58 AM
#3784
^ Yep, mine was pretty close to perfect based on corner weighing. I gained weight though but that is attributable to my creature comfort needs such as keeping AC, PS, etc. and then all the layers of sound proofing on the car. Throw in the old man subwoofer in the trunk and then the wide wheels on the back, you've got some more weight at 3,034 lbs. Without the full tank of gas, you are around 2,950 and we will get that below 2,900 with the current weight reductions plans.
07-16-13, 11:37 AM
#3786
My car is quite light by comparison to many street 20b's due to all the carbon and stubborn removal of the useless stuff. It weighs about 2,950 lbs with me (220-225 lbs) in it and a 3/4+ tank of gas. Weights are always with my track setup so I got the 295/335 slicks on which adds to the weight as well. I've actually been able to remove some weight since I last had it corner balanced so I'm curious what it is now. I got a lighter racing sway bar and removed the windshield washer reservoir and motor. Hopefully that will bring me closer to the 50/50 range. Gonna change to a 7 lbs battery soon too which will save me another 20 lbs.
thewird
07-17-13, 08:18 AM
#3788
Yes, twice. My initial balance was around 52/48 the first time I corner balanced it but the car handled like poo so I made a whole bunch of suspension changes (including springs). After that it was closer to 51/49. The reason for my bias is probably because I have a lot of weight removed from the back. I have a carbon fiber hatch, carbon doors, no spare tire, jack or tools, really anything that isn't needed has been removed around the whole car.
My car is quite light by comparison to many street 20b's due to all the carbon and stubborn removal of the useless stuff. It weighs about 2,950 lbs with me (220-225 lbs) in it and a 3/4+ tank of gas. Weights are always with my track setup so I got the 295/335 slicks on which adds to the weight as well. I've actually been able to remove some weight since I last had it corner balanced so I'm curious what it is now. I got a lighter racing sway bar and removed the windshield washer reservoir and motor. Hopefully that will bring me closer to the 50/50 range. Gonna change to a 7 lbs battery soon too which will save me another 20 lbs.
thewird
My car is quite light by comparison to many street 20b's due to all the carbon and stubborn removal of the useless stuff. It weighs about 2,950 lbs with me (220-225 lbs) in it and a 3/4+ tank of gas. Weights are always with my track setup so I got the 295/335 slicks on which adds to the weight as well. I've actually been able to remove some weight since I last had it corner balanced so I'm curious what it is now. I got a lighter racing sway bar and removed the windshield washer reservoir and motor. Hopefully that will bring me closer to the 50/50 range. Gonna change to a 7 lbs battery soon too which will save me another 20 lbs.
thewird
Thanks for following the thread and I hope there is some useful info to be gained.Speaking of Kilo, I did talk with him yesterday and the car is still at his shop. He's taking out alt the engine bay stuff by Friday or Monday so paint hasn't happened yet but will start no later than Monday. I'll probably be in FL next week and if so, am going to swing by to check in on the car.
The latest progress is on the Forgeline wheels. They are done and being shipped to Kilo today and I am looking forward to seeing how they turned out. I did post up a "For Sale" thread on the current Forgeline WC3 wheels and Michelin PS2 tires which can be found here:
https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-generati...tires-1040602/
These are perfect for you wide body or Pettit flare guys so come and get them!
07-17-13, 12:48 PM
#3790
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I was at 2840 with half a tank of gas. Still have PS and A/C (if you can call it that. But the parts are there), ABS... I didn't have the rear bins in the car at the time, though. So... however much they way. But carbon hood, lighter fenders, bumpers, etc. I forget what seats you have, David, but switching those out dropped a bunch. How much do all of your mufflers weigh? :-) It was you that had about 12 mufflers, right?
I'm sure your ability to have a conversation with a passenger is worth at least a hundred pounds, though.
I'm sure your ability to have a conversation with a passenger is worth at least a hundred pounds, though.
07-17-13, 05:30 PM
#3791
^Too funny. When I was younger it was the more speakers the better and now it's all about mufflers and sound proofing. But I can carry on a conversation in the car with ease and not have my left ear ringing when I get out. That's a good thing.
My seats are Sparco EVOs so they are pretty light as it is. I will lose some weight on the new front fenders and some stuff out of the engine bay. Will get it under 3,000 lbs. but I suspect not much than that. Will have to turn up the boost to compensate
So my new Forgeline wheels are being shipped today and I will get to see them next week at Kilo Racing. The problem is the BFGoodrich Rival tires in 315s are not released for two weeks so there will be a delay in putting on the new wheels. Should work out well though with the timing of the paint.
More to come
My seats are Sparco EVOs so they are pretty light as it is. I will lose some weight on the new front fenders and some stuff out of the engine bay. Will get it under 3,000 lbs. but I suspect not much than that. Will have to turn up the boost to compensate
So my new Forgeline wheels are being shipped today and I will get to see them next week at Kilo Racing. The problem is the BFGoodrich Rival tires in 315s are not released for two weeks so there will be a delay in putting on the new wheels. Should work out well though with the timing of the paint.
More to come
07-21-13, 07:19 AM
#3792
Heading mid this week to Orlando FL so I am going to swing by Kilo Racing to check in on the car. The car should be at the body shop no later than tomorrow so it will be a good time to review the paint plans as well as to see what is happening with the engine.
My Shine fenders showed up a few weeks ago so those will go on the car. Haven't seen them in person yet so this gives me the opportunity to inspect the quality and weight of the fenders. My new Forgeline wheels will arrive tomorrow so I will take pics of those as well. I do have the current Forgeline rims and Michelin PS2s up for sale and just lowered the price so check them out here:
https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-generati...tires-1040602/
All in all, moving in the right direction. As a recap of what is being done:
ENGINE
The engine should be back together next week. The center housing lost compression due to two cracked corner seals. Housings are being resurfaced by Kilo, Goopy 3mm apex seals being installed, and the rest will be Mazda OEM stuff. Should have mentioned previously the oil and cooling seals were perfect with no damage or wear at all. I point this out as it is a pride of Kilo's. The housings will be repainted black and the irons silver but that is about it on the engine side. A pretty minor rebuild job.
Finally, flipping the oil cooler lines so they are on top instead of bottom. Have always felt that is just a problem waiting to happen.
COOLING SYSTEM
It's been a thorn in my side since day one so it's all out and a v-mount setup going in. My temps usually ran around 90 degrees Celsius and with the AC on, around 95. So, Kilo, with the help of metal fabricator "Gato" is making a custom v-mount setup. We will use as large a radiator core to fit across the bottom as we can and then do the same with an intercooler on the top. Kilo is also going to use an RX8 condenser as it has the dryer built into the end tank of the unit, saving some space. Still plan on using RCCAZ1's templates for proper ducting as well so thanks for those Tim.
All in all, this should put an end to my temp issues so I will be happy not to have to continuously stare at the temp gauge.
WIRING
In short, it is a mess. Somewhere recently new wiring caused a bunch of gremlins to pop up including the ABS and ebrake lights staying on, the AC switch and blower not working, and my headlight and parking lights doing funky things. Too many cooks in the kitchen on this one so it's all being redone with the goal of ensuring it's all correct and then hiding as much as possible, including the engine relay boxes.
PAINT
This is a big step for me as I am the original owner of the car and its paint is stock. But it has the normal wear and tear of a 20 year old car so it goes to paint this Monday at Integrity Body Shop, right across from Kilo. Contact info:
1106 Quotation Ct, Saint Cloud, FL 34772
407-498-0249
Carlos Santiago runs the shop and has been doing expert custom paint jobs for many years, including work on Mazdas, American Muscle cars, and foreign exotics. His work is outstanding and Kilo uses him quite a bit for his race cars and customer rides and I've seen cars that had been painted over 5 years ago by him. The work looks as nice now as it did then.
Carlos was gracious enough to "school" me on painting techniques as I know very little about the process. He's a PPG and Matrix guy and is going to paint the car in "Jet Black" to give it a deep color. He's also a rotary guy but feels the Mazda black is too "brown" and to achieve the rich deep finish I want we need to use the Jet Black. So on it goes.
He's stripping the car completely and removing the body panels to prep. His process is a multi-step one, where he does body work, then sprays the car with primer. He then does more body work and applies a second coat of primer with more body work if needed.
The car then goes into the paint booth (he's got a very nice one, highly filtered and vented) where he applies a coat of sealant and then two coats of Jet Black. He will then use up to 5 coats of clear, allowing them to dry between each coat, and will wet sand between coat, to achieve a deep wet look.
[/b]WHEELS[b]
I love my current Forgeline WC3 setup and Michelin PS2s but Forgeline has graciously offered to sponsor me so off they come!
The new setup will use Forgeline's latest technology, the GA3s, or the street version of their GA3 racing wheels. The wheels will be done in a matte black center with a gloss black outer lip and a red stripe.
There is a lot of info floating around the forum about rims and how they are made. I've asked Forgeline to give me some more info on their manufacturing process and will post it up once I receive it. Forgeline has been around for many years and is known as one of the highest quality manufacturers of lightweight performance wheels. They are also US based and do all of their own design and manufacturing in house.
TIRES
I've decided to try out the new BFGoodrich g-force Rivals. They get absolutely fantastic reviews (http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/...y.jsp?ttid=169) and are right in my sweet spot of having a daily driven tire that is very trackable. So we shall see if the hype matches reality. Going with 275s up front and 315s in the rear. Not perfect for track but a good compromise I think.
Tires are on order but waiting on the release of the 315s, due the first week of August.
My Shine fenders showed up a few weeks ago so those will go on the car. Haven't seen them in person yet so this gives me the opportunity to inspect the quality and weight of the fenders. My new Forgeline wheels will arrive tomorrow so I will take pics of those as well. I do have the current Forgeline rims and Michelin PS2s up for sale and just lowered the price so check them out here:
https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-generati...tires-1040602/
All in all, moving in the right direction. As a recap of what is being done:
ENGINE
The engine should be back together next week. The center housing lost compression due to two cracked corner seals. Housings are being resurfaced by Kilo, Goopy 3mm apex seals being installed, and the rest will be Mazda OEM stuff. Should have mentioned previously the oil and cooling seals were perfect with no damage or wear at all. I point this out as it is a pride of Kilo's. The housings will be repainted black and the irons silver but that is about it on the engine side. A pretty minor rebuild job.
Finally, flipping the oil cooler lines so they are on top instead of bottom. Have always felt that is just a problem waiting to happen.
COOLING SYSTEM
It's been a thorn in my side since day one so it's all out and a v-mount setup going in. My temps usually ran around 90 degrees Celsius and with the AC on, around 95. So, Kilo, with the help of metal fabricator "Gato" is making a custom v-mount setup. We will use as large a radiator core to fit across the bottom as we can and then do the same with an intercooler on the top. Kilo is also going to use an RX8 condenser as it has the dryer built into the end tank of the unit, saving some space. Still plan on using RCCAZ1's templates for proper ducting as well so thanks for those Tim.
All in all, this should put an end to my temp issues so I will be happy not to have to continuously stare at the temp gauge.
WIRING
In short, it is a mess. Somewhere recently new wiring caused a bunch of gremlins to pop up including the ABS and ebrake lights staying on, the AC switch and blower not working, and my headlight and parking lights doing funky things. Too many cooks in the kitchen on this one so it's all being redone with the goal of ensuring it's all correct and then hiding as much as possible, including the engine relay boxes.
PAINT
This is a big step for me as I am the original owner of the car and its paint is stock. But it has the normal wear and tear of a 20 year old car so it goes to paint this Monday at Integrity Body Shop, right across from Kilo. Contact info:
1106 Quotation Ct, Saint Cloud, FL 34772
407-498-0249
Carlos Santiago runs the shop and has been doing expert custom paint jobs for many years, including work on Mazdas, American Muscle cars, and foreign exotics. His work is outstanding and Kilo uses him quite a bit for his race cars and customer rides and I've seen cars that had been painted over 5 years ago by him. The work looks as nice now as it did then.
Carlos was gracious enough to "school" me on painting techniques as I know very little about the process. He's a PPG and Matrix guy and is going to paint the car in "Jet Black" to give it a deep color. He's also a rotary guy but feels the Mazda black is too "brown" and to achieve the rich deep finish I want we need to use the Jet Black. So on it goes.
He's stripping the car completely and removing the body panels to prep. His process is a multi-step one, where he does body work, then sprays the car with primer. He then does more body work and applies a second coat of primer with more body work if needed.
The car then goes into the paint booth (he's got a very nice one, highly filtered and vented) where he applies a coat of sealant and then two coats of Jet Black. He will then use up to 5 coats of clear, allowing them to dry between each coat, and will wet sand between coat, to achieve a deep wet look.
[/b]WHEELS[b]
I love my current Forgeline WC3 setup and Michelin PS2s but Forgeline has graciously offered to sponsor me so off they come!
The new setup will use Forgeline's latest technology, the GA3s, or the street version of their GA3 racing wheels. The wheels will be done in a matte black center with a gloss black outer lip and a red stripe.
There is a lot of info floating around the forum about rims and how they are made. I've asked Forgeline to give me some more info on their manufacturing process and will post it up once I receive it. Forgeline has been around for many years and is known as one of the highest quality manufacturers of lightweight performance wheels. They are also US based and do all of their own design and manufacturing in house.
TIRES
I've decided to try out the new BFGoodrich g-force Rivals. They get absolutely fantastic reviews (http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/...y.jsp?ttid=169) and are right in my sweet spot of having a daily driven tire that is very trackable. So we shall see if the hype matches reality. Going with 275s up front and 315s in the rear. Not perfect for track but a good compromise I think.
Tires are on order but waiting on the release of the 315s, due the first week of August.
07-22-13, 06:54 AM
#3796
Thanks for the compliments. I really appreciate it and yes, way too many pages. I had no idea when I started this back in mid 2004, I'd still be posting updates. A big lesson I've learned is you are truly never done.
Looking forward to Wednesday and seeing how things are progressing.
Looking forward to Wednesday and seeing how things are progressing.
07-27-13, 03:59 AM
#3800
UPDATE
A quick post of the progress on the car. I visited Kilo Racing on Wednesday to check in and was very surprised to see the engine was back together. Happy about that. They were just finishing it up when I arrived. As I posted before, the housings were in great shape so very little needed to be done. I talked Kilo into lapping them just to be safe and he did, but it wasn't needed. As an aside, he showed me another engine in the shop for a rebuild and the housings on that, which were toast. You could run your finger nail over the insides and catch at multiple spots. Mine were smooth.
So, the engine now has 3mm Goopy seals in it as well as OEM oil and coolant gaskets as well and OEM corner seals. I believe Kilo said he uses the 70s style corner seals on 3mm grooves but I could be wrong about that. Something about a particular type being stronger and whatever those are, they are in the engine. The flywheel and clutch were also in great shape.
Engine Pics:
Kilo putting on the finishing touches:
Note the Guru stud kit on the engine. For me, this is a must mod on a 3 rotor as it keeps everything together and from torquing.
A quick post of the progress on the car. I visited Kilo Racing on Wednesday to check in and was very surprised to see the engine was back together. Happy about that. They were just finishing it up when I arrived. As I posted before, the housings were in great shape so very little needed to be done. I talked Kilo into lapping them just to be safe and he did, but it wasn't needed. As an aside, he showed me another engine in the shop for a rebuild and the housings on that, which were toast. You could run your finger nail over the insides and catch at multiple spots. Mine were smooth.
So, the engine now has 3mm Goopy seals in it as well as OEM oil and coolant gaskets as well and OEM corner seals. I believe Kilo said he uses the 70s style corner seals on 3mm grooves but I could be wrong about that. Something about a particular type being stronger and whatever those are, they are in the engine. The flywheel and clutch were also in great shape.
Engine Pics:
Kilo putting on the finishing touches:
Note the Guru stud kit on the engine. For me, this is a must mod on a 3 rotor as it keeps everything together and from torquing.