its free to download...

and since its been brought up, in general a mustang dyno isnt going to show as high of HP as a dynojet. there's a whole argument about it, but overall I think most will agree that a mustang is more accurate. if Chris wanted to boast his high HP numbers he wouldve thrown on a dynojet. but since he doesnt want to blow his **** up... hes doing it the right way. afterall this is a build thread.

 

a mustang dyno reads lower because it is "braked" to show really world physics in things such as aerodynamics. That's also why it is generally considered better (although not necessary) to tune on a mustang dyno.

 

finally got it, SOunds SWEET!

 

Just drooped off my car at Banzai shop and got a chance to go for a ride in the FD. Words can not describe how fast it is and how it pulls. I can't believe how much torque that 20B puts out. At any speed it can break the tires lose. I didn't think it could get any better, then chris asked if I would like to drive it. Thinking he was joking I said yes, I didn't believe it when he pulled over.

I was lucky to get a chance to drive Chris's FD before the 20B swap and that was more power then I had ever driven, till how. This car is just the craziest thing I ever driven in my life! The feel of all that torque is just crazy, the pull and that sinking feeling in my chest. I was starting off slow, just trying to get a feel for the power. At one point I thought I was boosting and after looking at the boost gauge I realized I was still in vacuum. This car in vacuum is so impressive and in boost its just scary. I have been very lucky to drive many different rotary set up's and the 20B is by far the best I have ever driven. All the guys out there putting V8 in there cars for more power and torque, just stop and put in a 20B. I don't think a ZR1 could touch this FD, I don't think there is going to be many cars out there that can come close after its final tuning.

If you want a bad a** rotary that done right and has no problems, call Banzai. I cant wait till he starts pushing some higher boost.

Chris, Thanks for the chance to drive your FD and Michelle said "NO!" I guess I will have to wait for my 20B.

 

Chris, do you have any solution for an air filter, or is that a lost cause at this point?

What's a conservative tune on a car like this? more fuel, less aggressive ignition?

 

Joe, I didn't think Michelle would sign off on a 20B just yet. There is the chance we might be able to sneak it in there and she wouldn't notice. You could always say I just did a little more tuning to the low boost range...

Rob, by definition a conservative tune is less aggressive timing and richer AFR's. That is all cars, not just a car like this one. The filter was addressed long ago with the turbo screen, it keeps peoples' fingers out, as well as any large debris.

Quick update on the car...

The AI system is nearly finished. I figure we will get it back on the dyno in Sept, for higher boost runs. It has still be hovering around 95F here, it is just not great weather for tuning, hopefully it will start to cool down in the next few weeks.

Joe, I was thinking you might want to come down to play cameraman for the next dyno session.

 

don't you just love our awesome midwest weather?

 

Just let me know the day and I will be there.

 

So just read this thread for the first time. Amazing. I'm blown away by how clean it is. I've seen a few 20B's, and non come close. I'm so jealous...so so jealous...like seeing my friend kiss Jessica Alba in front of me jealous.

Also, thanks for clearing up the 2mm/3mm seal. I've been arguing with my dad about that (the 13B is torn apart now and he wanted to 'upgrade' them). Although he says he won't, car is like 5000 miles away so I can't stop him if he does...grr...

One more thing. Where did you get the idler pully from and how is it mounted? Thanks. Keep up the good work!

Jose

 

Jose- We bought the idler from a forum member that was making them, search Chadwick, he was having a group buy a few months ago.

 

I don't think Dan is making them currently

 

Really, why would you say that?

We still make them

Thanks,
Dan

 

Water/meth system is now installed and the outside temps have dropped to a comfortable 70-ish. Should have the car back on the dyno some time next week.

 

that is a true work of art... i expect you will be hearing from me soon...

 

great build!!!

 

IMO what stops most is price.

 

Thanks for the compliments.

It really does not cost a lot more to do a 20B then what most people spend on their cars with a Ported rebuild, single turbo and all the supporting mods. Don't get me wrong it does cost money, but in the "grand" scheme of things if someone were to just do a 20B, when their coolant seals went on their stock twins car, they would not have too much more invested then when they got done with the single turbo 13b. All the same upgraded parts need to be purchased, they are just a little bigger.

So here is an update on gaskets. Anyone thinking of using the new super polymer gaskets, don't bother. I had figured I would give them a shot, they did not last long at all. I recently developed a high idle and could smell fuel after boosting. Narrowed it down to a vacuum/boost leak at the LIM gasket. It literally deformed it's way into the runner causing a huge leak. Installed a stock metal reenforced 20b gasket this morning. All problems solved.

 

Seconded.

 

Hinson once quoted my a full turn key conversion for 12K. How close can you get to that price?

 

I dropped my car off a few weeks ago for some more upgrades and tuning.

I could not resist to ask Chris to take me for a spin in the 20B powered Rx7. As he started driving off, the car pulled really hard, and I made a comment(can't remember what I said). All I remember was Chris saying that he hasn't even gotten into boost yet... In my head I thought, oh crap, this thing has a lot more to give! When he drove the car in boost(I don't remember feeling like I had time to ask since I was simply amazed by the car) the car just sits you back in the seat with more force than anything you can readily think of.

Even my neck stretched to the point it cracked and felt better.

I thought the car would be a lot louder, but it really is well mannered. The car has a case of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. I can't wait to see your results after your updates to the car!

If anyone is planning to go 20B, I definitely have to recommend Banzai-Racing. That's my plan.

Thank you for the ride, and all the top-notch work done on my car!

 

What do you want to hear, that a 20B can be done for $12K? No chance.

My point was that it does not cost much more to do a 20b, then it does do have a well sorted out 13B single turbo. Obviously there are different extremes for the conversions. People do budget rebuilds, with ebay turbos etc, this is cheap but not very reliable. Same goes for your 12K quote for a V8, that will never make 700hp, probably closer to 350hp for that price, may as well just keep the 13b.

 

Chris, I found this thread today.

I have heard of Banzai Racing but never dealt with you or even been to your website!

After reading this whole thread i am absoultly amazed with the quality of this build! The Attention to detail is excellent and the engine is pure awesome! I wish i was closer to your shop so I could check it out!

Keep up the fantastic Work!!!!!

+1

Cheers,
Taylor

 

yeah didn't think so.

Ok now I follow what you are saying... but hey *someone* failed to mention in their monetary comparison that they were taking into account similar HP output didn't they

 

OK, had the FD on the dyno today. Was able to clean up the low boost setting, at 13psi it made 566rwhp. Then turned the controller over to the high setting. Decided to start with 17psi, with a rich tune it made 621rwhp. Here is where I found that the TB o-ring was the next weak spot. As you can see from the dyno sheet, the boost is dropping off after peak, down to 15-15.5 at redline. Once the water/meth started spaying, we could see it coming out of the rear of the elbow at the flange. The new lower intake gasket helped a bunch, which showed up as the big HP gain for low boost. I think once the TB o-ring is replaced and I can keep boost consistent to redline, there will be another large bump in power at 13psi. We will then play around some more with the 17psi+, probably end up taking it to 20psi.

For those of you comparing to a Dynojet, 13psi low boost is appx 650rwhp and 17psi run is appx 714rwhp.

 

Wow, must be a blast on the street. Is there any traction at all?