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Rats nest simple sequential setup how do i do this?
okay so this past week ive been head to head with the rats nest trying to get my injetors out. this rats nest bs gets annoying after a while its way over engineered. anyway im gettin some viton hoses for the nest. but i heard that theirs a way to cap all the emission bs crap off and have a simplified sequential setup. i was looking at block off plates but can you stay sequntial with them? if anybody has some info on what to cap off and keep it real simple please let me know thanks Sam
If memory serves correct, if you are doing this while using the stock ECU you might experience idle and catalytic converter issues as a result of the emissions delete.
1. Can you run the stock ECU without emissions controls? Yes
2. Can you run on the stock ECU without emission controls with a catalytic converter in place? Yes
Should you actually do these things? That's debatable. You do need to be aware that if you remove the emissions controls (i.e. airpump air injection system) that the car will idle like crap with the stock ECU. This can be overcome by increasing the idle rpm to around 1100 rpms, but to some people that is a concern.
You can remove the emission controls from the vacuum system without doing the simplified sequential diagram. IMO, that is a better way of doing things unless you completely understand how the sequential system works. If you don't, going simplified sequential will just cause you more confusion.
With the stock ECU you are required to install a bunch of resistors to stop the ECU from throwing error codes. We really recommend that you install a Power FC if you are modifying your engine emmissions contol system to this level.
Either kit supplies you with all the block off plates required to remove all the emmisions related items. You are NOT required to use all the plates. To keep the car sequential you simply to not modify the y-pipe and you have a spare plate. If you buy the single turbo kit, you have the rear oil return line plate remaining.
1. Can you run the stock ECU without emissions controls? Yes
2. Can you run on the stock ECU without emission controls with a catalytic converter in place? Yes
Should you actually do these things? That's debatable. You do need to be aware that if you remove the emissions controls (i.e. airpump air injection system) that the car will idle like crap with the stock ECU. This can be overcome by increasing the idle rpm to around 1100 rpms, but to some people that is a concern.
You can remove the emission controls from the vacuum system without doing the simplified sequential diagram. IMO, that is a better way of doing things unless you completely understand how the sequential system works. If you don't, going simplified sequential will just cause you more confusion.
Thank you for helping this guy a while back. I've been kicking myself for doing the simplified sequential setup. I'm on stock ECU and didn't use block off plates and have removed air pump and have hks downpipe/stock main/aftermarket cat-back. Everything is back together now, and I can't get the car to run right AT ALL. It ran perfectly beforehand. It's bucking and jerking like crazy, as if it's in limp mode. How do I know if I'm in limp mode or if I have bad injectors or clogged fuel filter? I would think limp mode would cause a CEL?
The stock ECU won't run right without the airpump - you will get a rough idle, harsh on/off throttle, and more.
Either put things back the way they were or get a PowerFC. Stock ECU is for a stock car, period.
Dale
Thank you for your input Dale. Seeing that big post number next to your name tells me you know what you are talking about as well (not that it is necessary, but it certainly shows!)
I don't even have the air pump anymore, lol.
I didn't do all this at once. The air pump was removed before the rats nest was removed and while i was still running the stock downpipe/pre-cat.
Honestly, it ran pretty good then. it didn't idle perfectly as it had a tiny "blip" ever 5 seconds or so (not noticeable to the normal ear), plus the idle was turned up to around 1100rpms. if i could get it back to that, i would be happy as a lark. Until then, I simply cannot afford $1000 PowerFC upgrade plus the cost of tuning it. There's gotta be a cheaper way no? Maybe if I just replace all the solenoids and vacuum hoses it will drive like it did before? Any thoughts there? The only change at that point would be that it will have the HKS downpipe installed.
The pump line that goes from the motor to the main cat is still installed.
I'm not challenging your thinking or knowledge, I hope you know that. I'm simply trying to figure out the cheapest way to get this thing back on the road. I know I don't want the stock downpipe with pre-cat on this thing as thats an EGT disaster waiting to happen. I don't want to turn this car into a money pit. I have other vehicles in the garage that have taken those titles (LS swap FD and 69 C10)
PowerFC's go used fairly reasonably, around $600 or so. It's rare for them to go bad, so it's a pretty safe bet to buy used.
You don't really *need* to have it tuned especially if your car is close to stock. There are a few things that can be tweaked with just the commander to make it better/safer on the stock map the PFC comes with.
That said, if it ran OK before you worked on the rat's nest, something you did messed things up. Is the MAP sensor vacuum line attached? Any air leaks after the throttle body? Did you remove the solenoid that controls pressure to the fuel pressure regulator? Is the ECU throwing any codes?
PowerFC's go used fairly reasonably, around $600 or so. It's rare for them to go bad, so it's a pretty safe bet to buy used.
You don't really *need* to have it tuned especially if your car is close to stock. There are a few things that can be tweaked with just the commander to make it better/safer on the stock map the PFC comes with.
That said, if it ran OK before you worked on the rat's nest, something you did messed things up. Is the MAP sensor vacuum line attached? Any air leaks after the throttle body? Did you remove the solenoid that controls pressure to the fuel pressure regulator? Is the ECU throwing any codes?
Dale
MAP sensor vacuum line is connected, and the FPR solenoid under the UIM is still connected. No CEL flashing or constant.
How can i verify whether or not i'm actually in "limp mode"?
Ok I have pulled the codes using the described method on the forum. All 4 of them to my knowledge are directly related to my following simplified sequential diagram of removing b,c,d, and g solenoids.
28 Solenoid Valve (EGR) - open or short circuit
31 Secondary Air Bypass Valve - open or short circuit
32 Secondary Air Switching Valve - open or short circuit
50 double throttle
So....based on researching the forums, you can keep the stock ECU and main cat and not have the air pump installed and have the rats nest removal (following the simplified sequential diagram on forum).
Assuming that's true, what's my better option? Should I buy resistors for those 4 solenoids I unplugged or should I just put all the rats nest vacuum hoses and solenoids junk back in (air pump stays gone though, don't have one anymore)
Just an update to help those that are doing the rats nest removal.
I did plug in 330 ohm .5w resistors on all 4 removed solenoids and it removed all 4 CEL codes from the ECU.
02-08-10, 12:54 AM
