Mr. LV

Can I run a 13B pump on a 20B? do they pump the same amount of liquid?

t-von

iTrader: (8)

Not sure about flow but if you run a 13b water pump, you will also need to run the 13b water pump housing it bolts to. The 20b water pumps mounting holes are in differant locations. Also the long housing bolts will need to be switched out as well.

94RHDFD

iTrader: (3)

Not sure if they flow the same but you can use all the 13b accessories on the 20b you just have to relocate the bolts to the work with the 13b

RETed

20B water pump studs can be used with FC water pump + housing.
If you're going FD 13B-REW water pump + housing, you'll need the longer studs from the 13B-REW.


-Ted

Mr. LV

Thanks All,

I have a crome FC housing and pump and just wanted to make sure that there wouldn't be a problem with flow.

SPOautos

I'm thinking of sending my stock FD water pump off to see exactly how much it flows at specific rpms and also what rpm it starts to cavitate. The only problem is its proabaly going to cost around $300 total. Thats the only reason I havent done it.

If some of you other guys are interested in the data maybe we can all get together and all contribute.

just thought I'd throw that out there and see if anyone is interested.

Stephen

SPOautos

BTW - The reason this will be good information is its possible I can get a company to produce a good upgraded pump or modify ours if people are interested. I have a feeling that when you guys increase displacement and heat by 50% you really do need a better pump. I'm also looking into electric water pump conversions, its a huge pita but if the elec flows better than our stocker then it will be worth it.

I bet where you guys will run into the most problems is low rpm and idle because I dont think the stock pump flows much at all on the bottom end and with 50% more inches and heat it might be an issue for a 20B street car. The elec pump would be WAY WAY better on the bottom/mid rpm end. I just would like to know how much the stocker flows on the top end to see if the elec is sufficient up top.

Stephen

onefastrx7turbo

iTrader: (5)

I'd be interested in a possible upgraded FD style pump, as long as it isnt crack prices....If its gonna cost 200 bucks, i can buy like 3 fd pumps for that price..you know?

zyounker

We did this a few years ago with the mezier(sp?) electric waterpump.. They even have a rotary adapter that replaces the waterpump and housing.

SPOautos

Right...but how do you know the Mezier flows more than stock? You might be shooting yourself in the foot on the high rpms by going elec if you dont know how much the stock FD pump flows.

I was looking into the Mezier adapter but you loose WAY WAY too much. That setup is severly lacking, there is no where for the 3 sensors, thermostat, fill cap, turbo coolant lines, heater hose, or air bleed. You loose everything.

I've already got something designed that if I knew for sure an elec pump is acutally an upgrade I'd switch in a heartbeat. I was planning on sending of my stock pump and having it flow tested and make a decision if I should switch or not untill I found out that it would cost me around $300 to have it tested.

Anyway, I just thought there might be some others looking down the same path I am that would be interested in contributing to testing.

Stephen

SPOautos

If your refering to my post what I'm trying to do is test the FD pump against an electric pump too see if the elec really flows more. I've been told that more than likely our stock FD pumps outflow an elec pump by a wide margin in the high rpms. The same company that I've been talking to about this that will set them up on a flow bench and test them side by side said they might also be interested in making an upgraded or moded replacement for the FD water pump....IF there is enough people AND if they find out that the FD pump really is sevearly lacking and a poor flowing POS.

I doubt it would be $200 though unless maybe you can send them a FD pump and they can do a few mild changes like change the wheel out, ect. If the solution is elec it will end up costing you around $500 and if its a high performance mechanical it would probably cost around $300-$400 since it would be such limited production.

Stephen

Mr. LV

Meziere's web site says their pump can pump 55 GPM. Anyone know what the rating is on the stock pumps?

SPOautos

Those 55gpm ratings arent real world. That is the pumps max free flow from a bucket to a sink. There is absolutly no restriction or elevation change. When you put it in the car and have to pump it thru the block, heater core, radiator, all the other little places it has to go, put it under pressure, push it up hill, ect ect ect the rating will drop of dramatically.

I've been doing some more reseach and making some phone calls and I think I've located someone thats flow tested the stock pump before. I should know more about it next week, probably Mon or Tues.

Also, I was wrong about it costing $300 to test the stock pump....the pump doesnt fit up to thier bench so they will have to make adapters and it'll cost closer to $600. I wont be doing that lol

Stephen

Mr. LV

Reguardless of any restrictions, it still has a rating of 55GPM. If the stock pump has less, then by shear volume, wouldn't the electric pump be superior. Don't forget the stock pump has to pump through all that stuff too.

SPOautos

The stock pumps ratings that I've seen were with the pump on the car. I'm calling someone else this coming week thats had the pump tested but I dont know if it was on the car or on a flow bench.

Also, the wheel of a pump has any efficiency range just like any other type pump. When you take it outside its efficiency range its performance will fall tremedously. Part of that range is the ability to deal with back pressure and resistance. One pump might better be able to pump thru the resistance and backpressure better than another pump, it could have less effect on one versus another. This means that just because 2 pumps have the same max free flow rating doesnt necessarily mean that they will flow the same when put in a harse environment full of restriction, back pressure, and heat. Hell in a max free flow test there's not even any coolant pressure.

I've heard that the MAX of the stock pump is around 32gpm (at redline) while on the car at around 6000 pump rpms which is about 8000 engine rpms. At idle its probably only around 4gpm and it basically just increases with rpm. I'd imagine that a 55gpm electric pump is probably going to be in the 30-40gpm (guessing at this point) range when on the car....the REAL difference is that its going to supply the same gpm no matter what rpm so at idle, cruising, redlights, wot, ect ect ect. It'll always be the same. I think this is going to be pretty important for 20B guys. I've talked to a couple 20B guys that thier cars ran hot at idle and cuise conditions.....the VERY low pump rating at low rpms could be why.

Not to mention the weight of water and how much power it could potentially free up.....which is a big reason I'm doing it hehe

Mr. LV

[QUOTE=SPOautos]The stock pumps ratings that I've seen were with the pump on the car. I'm calling someone else this coming week thats had the pump tested but I dont know if it was on the car or on a flow bench.

Also, the wheel of a pump has any efficiency range just like any other type pump. When you take it outside its efficiency range its performance will fall tremedously. Part of that range is the ability to deal with back pressure and resistance. One pump might better be able to pump thru the resistance and backpressure better than another pump, it could have less effect on one versus another. This means that just because 2 pumps have the same max free flow rating doesnt necessarily mean that they will flow the same when put in a harse environment full of restriction, back pressure, and heat. Hell in a max free flow test there's not even any coolant pressure.

I agree. I guess the true test would be to flow both pumps through the motor, coolant lines, radiator, etc... and measure the rate and volume that comes out at the end. I would be very interested as well.

SPOautos

Well, I have a place in mind that I THINK has flow tested a few electric pumps. The only prob is they didnt flow them on our car, its probably some V8, ect. However, that should at least give me an idea of how bad the pump falls off before I take my leap of faith.

I'll probably get an electric and when I do I'll test it and see how many gph it flows in a similar test proceedure that others have done with the stock pump. The only problem is I'm running a duel pass radiator, to cool much better but they are more restrictive so it wouldnt really be apples to apples.

I guess with this being an electric pump, I could rig up someone elses radiator to my setup without actually fully intalling it into my car. Hell with elec pump I dont even have to have my car finished, I can just turn the key and let it run.

Either way, we'll know before too much longer.