Weird ignition switch problem (won't stay "on")
03-21-05, 02:17 PM
#1
Anytime baby!
Thread Starter
Weird ignition switch problem (won't stay "on")
When I start the car it starts fine, but when I release the key after it fires up it dies immediately…It seems that the key is not catching in the “on” position and thus the car won’t stay on. It’s sensitive…and sometimes I can get it to stick but it’s tricky. I haven’t figured out a consistent trick to it yet.
I’ve had this problem occur in the past but it never was persistent, so I let it go…it’s been doing it more and more the last few days however.
Is anyone familiar with this problem? Bad ignition switch assembly? Maybe a worn out key? Any fixes? If it is a bad ignition, can I get it rebuilt or do I have to drop a new one in?
Right on.
I’ve had this problem occur in the past but it never was persistent, so I let it go…it’s been doing it more and more the last few days however.
Is anyone familiar with this problem? Bad ignition switch assembly? Maybe a worn out key? Any fixes? If it is a bad ignition, can I get it rebuilt or do I have to drop a new one in?
Right on.
03-21-05, 02:41 PM
#2
I had a similar problem with my SE and it turned out to be the ignition switch. The switch is real easy to replace. You just need to remove the column surround and there is one screw that holds the switch into the ignition cylinder. Then it is just a matter of unplugging the old one and plugging in a new one. The contacts tend to get corroded over time making poor contact.
I would also check to make sure that is the problem. Do you have the cutting out if you just turn the key to 'ON' without cranking. It could be that your trailing igniter or the connection to the trailing coil (blue spade connector) is not making good contact. This will cause the problems reported, because the fuel pump runs while cranking, but after words a signal from the trailing ignition is needed so that the ECU knows the engine is running and will then send a signal to the fuel pump relay to keep the fuel pump running.
Kent
I would also check to make sure that is the problem. Do you have the cutting out if you just turn the key to 'ON' without cranking. It could be that your trailing igniter or the connection to the trailing coil (blue spade connector) is not making good contact. This will cause the problems reported, because the fuel pump runs while cranking, but after words a signal from the trailing ignition is needed so that the ECU knows the engine is running and will then send a signal to the fuel pump relay to keep the fuel pump running.
Kent
03-21-05, 03:16 PM
#3
Anytime baby!
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by gsl-se addict
I had a similar problem with my SE and it turned out to be the ignition switch. The switch is real easy to replace. You just need to remove the column surround and there is one screw that holds the switch into the ignition cylinder. Then it is just a matter of unplugging the old one and plugging in a new one. The contacts tend to get corroded over time making poor contact.
I would also check to make sure that is the problem. Do you have the cutting out if you just turn the key to 'ON' without cranking. It could be that your trailing igniter or the connection to the trailing coil (blue spade connector) is not making good contact. This will cause the problems reported, because the fuel pump runs while cranking, but after words a signal from the trailing ignition is needed so that the ECU knows the engine is running and will then send a signal to the fuel pump relay to keep the fuel pump running.
Kent
I would also check to make sure that is the problem. Do you have the cutting out if you just turn the key to 'ON' without cranking. It could be that your trailing igniter or the connection to the trailing coil (blue spade connector) is not making good contact. This will cause the problems reported, because the fuel pump runs while cranking, but after words a signal from the trailing ignition is needed so that the ECU knows the engine is running and will then send a signal to the fuel pump relay to keep the fuel pump running.
Kent
Right on.
03-21-05, 03:33 PM
#4
When it happened to me, I had to rig a jumper wire to bypass that portion of the switch. So each time I started the car, I had to use the jumper to power the 'ON' and turn the key to start. Mine acted up all at once and I was almost stuck at a gas station.
It is a funny story. I had my trusty Haynes manual with me (don't leave home without it
) so I knew which wires I had to connect. I got the car running and started heading home. Well, almost home, the wire fell of and the engine died. I was able to pull over to the side of the road, but there wasn't much of a shoulder. So, there I am trying to reconnect the wire, but I can't see what I am doing, since I can't open the door (traffic). Well, after a few minutes, someone knocks on my window. I look up and it's a cop. So you can imagine how this looks. Here I am with the ignition switch torn apart with me trying to hot wire the car on the side of the road. The officer was cool about it, though (he did check liscense and resitration, though). He thought that there was something wrong with me (heart attack or something) because of me leaning over like that. He was nice enough to help me push the car into a parking lot and I was able to get it going from there. So, fix the problem before it leaves you stranded somewhere.
Kent
It is a funny story. I had my trusty Haynes manual with me (don't leave home without it
) so I knew which wires I had to connect. I got the car running and started heading home. Well, almost home, the wire fell of and the engine died. I was able to pull over to the side of the road, but there wasn't much of a shoulder. So, there I am trying to reconnect the wire, but I can't see what I am doing, since I can't open the door (traffic). Well, after a few minutes, someone knocks on my window. I look up and it's a cop. So you can imagine how this looks. Here I am with the ignition switch torn apart with me trying to hot wire the car on the side of the road. The officer was cool about it, though (he did check liscense and resitration, though). He thought that there was something wrong with me (heart attack or something) because of me leaning over like that. He was nice enough to help me push the car into a parking lot and I was able to get it going from there. So, fix the problem before it leaves you stranded somewhere.Kent
03-21-05, 07:23 PM
#5
Full Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Orlando Fl.
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
funny my car just died on me sunday from a bad ignition switch its an easy fix just expensive $134 for the switch from a local dealer or $114 from an online dealer I built a temporary bypass with a switch and a starter button untill thursday when mine comes in if you want to go the junkyard route I noticed this weekend at a u-pull it that alot of other older mazda's have similar ignition switches but different harness conectors I couldnt find an rx7 switch but I bet one from another mazda could be made to work
12-29-05, 11:09 AM
#7
Rotary Freak
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 1,711
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm bringing this thread back from the dead because I now have the same issue with my '85 GSL. The problem started out as an intermittent glitch but became progressively worse over a period of time until the switch finally crapped out permanently.
My wife also has an '85 GSL which is in storage for the winter, so I simply stole her switch and installed it into my car. I now have until spring to fix or replace her switch.
I dis-assembled my old switch and found the contacts inside to be worn but not corroded. They are made of copper, and the battery contact portion of the inside of the switch seems to be the most worn area. This would explain why the engine would crank and then catch with the switch in the "start" position, but would not stay lit with the switch in the "on" position.
My question is this:
Can these contacts be repaired by soldering? I'm sure I could do this and then sand the contacts smooth in about twenty minutes, but with solder being softer than the parent metal would the repair last? Has anyone actually tried this with an ingition (or other) switch?
According to Max (one of our local RX7 gurus) there is a silver-alloy solder available that is harder than the standard rosen-core stuff that might work, but neither of us are sure if it's in the same ballpark (wear-wise) as copper. Anybody?
My wife also has an '85 GSL which is in storage for the winter, so I simply stole her switch and installed it into my car. I now have until spring to fix or replace her switch.
I dis-assembled my old switch and found the contacts inside to be worn but not corroded. They are made of copper, and the battery contact portion of the inside of the switch seems to be the most worn area. This would explain why the engine would crank and then catch with the switch in the "start" position, but would not stay lit with the switch in the "on" position.
My question is this:
Can these contacts be repaired by soldering? I'm sure I could do this and then sand the contacts smooth in about twenty minutes, but with solder being softer than the parent metal would the repair last? Has anyone actually tried this with an ingition (or other) switch?
According to Max (one of our local RX7 gurus) there is a silver-alloy solder available that is harder than the standard rosen-core stuff that might work, but neither of us are sure if it's in the same ballpark (wear-wise) as copper. Anybody?
Trending Topics
12-29-05, 07:48 PM
#8
SoCal STi Hitman
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: In a paint booth
Posts: 880
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
replace your battery cables...and clean your posts. My car would be sitting in the "on" position, then the power would just go "off". negative battery cable was shorting against the body, and the smaller + cable was bad.
12-29-05, 08:52 PM
#9
Go Hawks!
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Cedar Rapids, Iowa
Posts: 1,933
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I fixed my switch by cleaning all the contacts, then bending things where necessary. It's really an easy switch to work with. But when testing, it took me a long time to realize that I had it fixed because the connection diagram in the factory service manual is wrong! It was very difficult to figure out how to read it, but I'm quite good with electrical stuff, so I'm pretty sure the manual is wrong.
While I was in the process of fixing it, I also ordered a new one, just in case. $99 from AutoZone.
Rich
While I was in the process of fixing it, I also ordered a new one, just in case. $99 from AutoZone.
Rich
12-29-05, 09:10 PM
#10
Rotary Freak
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 1,711
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Cowboyfun
replace your battery cables...and clean your posts. My car would be sitting in the "on" position, then the power would just go "off". negative battery cable was shorting against the body, and the smaller + cable was bad.
The negative cable shorting against the body would have no ill effects because it is already supposed to be a direct short to the body---- if you follow it from the post you'll find that the cable runs from the smaller-diameter post to a bolt that's threaded into the body. This is how the current from the + post gets back to the battery (completing the circuit) after it has travelled to all electrical circuits and components in the car.
But if the POS post or cable clamp were to short against the body (ex: touch the under side of the hood) you would definitely have a problem because this would effectively remove the battery from the electrical system. And you're also right about the dirty terminals--- this would cause nothing to happen when the key is turned, not even the instrument panel warning lights would illuminate.
As for my previously-mentioned ignition switch (three posts ago), I've successfully silver-soldered the rotating contact bezels inside the switch and then filed them smooth. The material was more difficult to file than normal solder, which means that this repair should have good wear characteristics similar to copper.
But since the only soldering heat I currently own is a flame rather than a soldering iron I will have to pick up an iron before building up the contact points (on which the bezels ride in order to complete the circuits) inside the back of the switch--- these are mounted in the plastic terminal support and an open flame would just melt the plastic.
Assuming that this repair will be successful it should eliminate the need for members to shell out $150 to $200 (including shipping) for a new switch. Of the five 1st gens I've owned (two of which are still in the family) two of them have had the ignition switch fail, so this appears to be a common problem. I'll keep you posted as to the effectiveness of this repair.
12-29-05, 09:22 PM
#11
Go Hawks!
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Cedar Rapids, Iowa
Posts: 1,933
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Aviator 902S
I'm guessing that when you say "the smaller cable" you're referring to the cable that clamps onto the smaller-diameter battery post? If so, that cable is the negative one, not the positive.
The negative cable shorting against the body would have no ill effects because it is already supposed to be a direct short to the body---- if you follow it from the post you'll find that the cable runs from the smaller-diameter post to a bolt that's threaded into the body. This is how the current from the + post gets back to the battery (completing the circuit) after it has travelled to all electrical circuits and components in the car.
But if the POS post or cable clamp were to short against the body (ex: touch the under side of the hood) you would definitely have a problem because this would effectively remove the battery from the electrical system. And you're also right about the dirty terminals--- this would cause nothing to happen when the key is turned, not even the instrument panel warning lights would illuminate.
As for my previously-mentioned ignition switch (three posts ago), I've successfully silver-soldered the rotating contact bezels inside the switch and then filed them smooth. The material was more difficult to file than normal solder, which means that this repair should have good wear characteristics similar to copper.
But since the only soldering heat I currently own is a flame rather than a soldering iron I will have to pick up an iron before building up the contact points (on which the bezels ride in order to complete the circuits) inside the back of the switch--- these are mounted in the plastic terminal support and an open flame would just melt the plastic.
Assuming that this repair will be successful it should eliminate the need for members to shell out $150 to $200 (including shipping) for a new switch. Of the five 1st gens I've owned (two of which are still in the family) two of them have had the ignition switch fail, so this appears to be a common problem. I'll keep you posted as to the effectiveness of this repair.
The negative cable shorting against the body would have no ill effects because it is already supposed to be a direct short to the body---- if you follow it from the post you'll find that the cable runs from the smaller-diameter post to a bolt that's threaded into the body. This is how the current from the + post gets back to the battery (completing the circuit) after it has travelled to all electrical circuits and components in the car.
But if the POS post or cable clamp were to short against the body (ex: touch the under side of the hood) you would definitely have a problem because this would effectively remove the battery from the electrical system. And you're also right about the dirty terminals--- this would cause nothing to happen when the key is turned, not even the instrument panel warning lights would illuminate.
As for my previously-mentioned ignition switch (three posts ago), I've successfully silver-soldered the rotating contact bezels inside the switch and then filed them smooth. The material was more difficult to file than normal solder, which means that this repair should have good wear characteristics similar to copper.
But since the only soldering heat I currently own is a flame rather than a soldering iron I will have to pick up an iron before building up the contact points (on which the bezels ride in order to complete the circuits) inside the back of the switch--- these are mounted in the plastic terminal support and an open flame would just melt the plastic.
Assuming that this repair will be successful it should eliminate the need for members to shell out $150 to $200 (including shipping) for a new switch. Of the five 1st gens I've owned (two of which are still in the family) two of them have had the ignition switch fail, so this appears to be a common problem. I'll keep you posted as to the effectiveness of this repair.
Rich
12-29-05, 09:27 PM
#12
Rotary Freak
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 1,711
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by 64mgb
I fixed my switch by cleaning all the contacts, then bending things where necessary. It's really an easy switch to work with. But when testing, it took me a long time to realize that I had it fixed because the connection diagram in the factory service manual is wrong! It was very difficult to figure out how to read it, but I'm quite good with electrical stuff, so I'm pretty sure the manual is wrong.
While I was in the process of fixing it, I also ordered a new one, just in case. $99 from AutoZone.
Rich
As for the $99 price tag, I'm quite certain that the GS and lesser models had a less-complex switch than the one used on GSL and SE models. This would explain their lower price.
12-29-05, 09:33 PM
#13
Go Hawks!
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Cedar Rapids, Iowa
Posts: 1,933
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Aviator 902S
I'm wondering if the SA switch is of the same designs as those of the later FB models? Did yours consist of two spring-loaded contact rings (bezels) and a center contact arm that rode over the contact points on the inside of each terminal? Or was it a simpler design?
As for the $99 price tag, I'm quite certain that the GS and lesser models had a less-complex switch than the one used on GSL and SE models. This would explain their lower price.
As for the $99 price tag, I'm quite certain that the GS and lesser models had a less-complex switch than the one used on GSL and SE models. This would explain their lower price.
Rich
12-29-05, 09:39 PM
#14
Go Hawks!
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Cedar Rapids, Iowa
Posts: 1,933
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Ok...here's a couple of pictures. In one, the small center piece is just laying in there, upside down, and in the other, it is removed.
By the way, these were taking before cleaning.
Rich
By the way, these were taking before cleaning.
Rich
12-29-05, 10:42 PM
#15
Rotary Freak
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 1,711
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks Rich, and that definitely looks like the same switch I have. In your photo you can see the wear patterns on the copper ring that caused my switch to fail. This is where I built up the base metal with silver-based solder.
Victoria British advertises this switch for $150 so it sounds like you got yourself a steal of a deal.
Victoria British advertises this switch for $150 so it sounds like you got yourself a steal of a deal.
07-29-23, 02:48 PM
#16
18 year old thread resurrection!
This same scenario is happening to me now. It happened a couple of week ago so I ordered a replacement ignition switch but it corrected itself before the replacement turned up. Today it is happening again so I replaced the ignition switch and it is still the same. Googled and searched the forum for fixes etc with no luck. Anyone with a similar experience? Anyone with a fix for this?
This same scenario is happening to me now. It happened a couple of week ago so I ordered a replacement ignition switch but it corrected itself before the replacement turned up. Today it is happening again so I replaced the ignition switch and it is still the same. Googled and searched the forum for fixes etc with no luck. Anyone with a similar experience? Anyone with a fix for this?
Last edited by Ruff sev; 07-29-23 at 04:25 PM.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
jaidedeye
1st Generation Specific (1979-1985)
4
06-07-08 11:48 AM
