mtfhod

Hi.

I've been browsing the forum for about a month now, but only registered today because, of course, I need some advice.

I have a 1985 RX7 GSL with the 12A engine that was rebuilt about 85k ago. I bought it from a kind gentleman who needed to sell, and I was very excited about it, excited enough to learn how to use a manual transmission for the first time, excited enough to take the manuals (part of the deal; the Haynes ones) and think that maybe, just maybe I could handle the repairs, etc. of the car.

It worked like a dream, I did all my basic, normal maintenance, and then...ah yes, there's always an "and then." And then it snowed and was cold and I didn't know as much as I do now and didn't keep it warm and, wait - I can see you're flinching now.

The mechanic wants to charge me more than I paid for the car to replace a starter, and the "ring gear" which is "pressed outside of the flywheel." It's a lot of money, and he's throwing in a replacement for the transmission/clutch (which I am not convinced is necessary, and he says he'll come down ~$300 in price if I don't want it done) but I've been reading the forum and need a second opinion.

It seems to me something I might be able to do myself, for a lot cheaper than $1300.00.

I could be fooling myself. I would need tools and time and a place to work on it. I don't know everything, or even everything I will need. I'm not afraid of getting dirty, and I love my car (and I've never loved a car before.) But am I biting off more than I can chew if I say, "Thanks for the diagnostic, I think we can handle it from here," or am I in danger of being ripped off, or is this a seriously non-trivial task and I should pony up the cash, have him do it and hold on to the warranty?

I appreciate opinions and horror stories and success stories as well...thanks!

yetterben

i could teach a monkey how to change the starter!!!!! of course i am a mechanic buy trade but. even on the ground in the snow with a few tools and a jack i could change the starter in 45min its supper easy man.

redbstd

$1300 holy **** that guys hosing you, when you take you starter off and just look at the ring gear for damaged teeth. I have a feeling that mechanics just tying to get a little exta cash. Besides now adays nobody replaces just the ring gear, you replace the whole flywheel. So save youreself ~$1200 and change your own starter. good luck

KetteringRotorhead

dude, if your ring gear is screwed, you might want to look at replacing the flywheel/counterweight. If I am correct, then the ring gear is hot/cold pressed into place and therefore easy to screw up "fixing" it. Also, the starter is easy, however make sure you get the right year. I have two 12a motors and the starters are different (also 1 is a 5spd trans and the other is a 4spd)

Just a personal opinion, I dont know that it is all that easy to "fix" a screwed up flywheel.

More likely the mechanic will simply replace the part. At that point it becomes a fairly simply unbolt-swap-rebolt procedure that isnt terribly difficult.

If you are going to tackle replacing the flywheel may i suggest renting a powerful impact wrench and a 54mm socket, and buy the tool from mazdatrix or other to put it back on. You'll thank me later.

mazda6guy

iTrader: (1)

Yeah I have a good extra flywheel for free as longs as you pay the shipping. Yeah I think that mechanic is full of it if you ask me. The starter is not very hard to change. You should find a good write up on it in the archives are just find it in the Haynes manual that you have.

mtfhod

I don't know if I'm as smart as a monkey. What about changing the flywheel, though? From what "my friends" (the knowledgeable monkeys I consult) say, it's a hassle because, should I be able to find the part, I need to remove the transmission as well.

mtfhod

I don't think I would have bought the car without the manuals. Seriously, though, I considered it a triumph to change the sparkplugs. (I've never done any of this before.) I'm totally willing to learn, though.

mtfhod

I expect that's what he's doing. Everything else is sounding like it's good, but it wouldn't start (and yeah, I went through the list here on the forum) and paid the fellow to diagnose it for me.

Sounds [ahem] [grin] like you've had Experience. Of course, an "impact wrench" sounds to me like something that happens after you get whiplash from a movie.

I'm not claiming any elite skillz.

redbstd

there is one **** of a nut holding the fly wheel on not several bolts like usual and yes you will nee a impact wrench to get the sob off i had to heat one up on a jetta i was working on to get the thing off have fun!!!

mazda6guy

iTrader: (1)

I wish that I lived a whole lot closer to you then I would lend you a hand. I see that you might not have the skills but you are willing to learn. I remember those days of trying to work and rehabiltate my RX-7 but since I have a mechanic background it came a little easier for me. The offer is still there if you need the flywheel.

KetteringRotorhead

in a nutshell, the best way to go about the starter flywheel change is to unbolt the electrical wires hooked to the transmission (LABEL THEM TO MAKE SURE YOU DONT CROSS THEM WHEN YOU REINSTALL) there are two (I think) bolts holding the starter in. GENTLY pull the starter motor straight out of the trans bell housing.

With the transmission in neutral, unbolt one of the inspection covers (sheet metal plate covering the top of the transmission bellhousing) so you can see the gear teeth below. Pull a couple spark plugs so that the motor will not make compression and turn the engine over by hand by putting a socket wrench on the front pulley bolt (engine turns clockwise by the way). this will allow you to see for yourself if the ring gear is messed up.

Take your starter to autozone or similar and have them check your starter motor. After this point you will have a better idea of exactly what you need to do.

Best of all, the whole process up to this point only requires a socket wrench, a couple of open end wrenches and a few minutes of time. Dont be intimidated and have fun!

old_skool

as for the 54mm socket, napa and mazda has it for almost $60. i went to harbor freight and got the whole 3/4" drive set (only need the 2.5") and a 7 piece adapter set for $30...

Mark_1

Welcome to the group, one newbie to another.

$1300 seems more than a little high to me. Replacing the starter is an easy job (a couple of bolts and an electrical connector). If the ring gear is damaged, look into replacing the flywheel and clutch parts at the same time. Might as well replace these when the trans is out. First, I'd get a second opinion from a reputable shop. Check the list for a rotary shop in Denver. Good luck with the project.

FBsliderseven

iTrader: (2)

https://www.rx7club.com/1st-generation-specific-1979-1985-18/1st-gen-rx-7-faq-page-237777/
there you go sir.
also, it has the service manuals on there too.

1983GSP

am i the only one here not seeing the all important "disconnect the negative battery terminal" phrase. im sure all of you want to keep the magic smoke in the car, cause when it goes, the car wont work.

kenn_chan

Yeah its kinda bad when you run out of magic smoke

kenn

mtfhod

Thank you for your help! We actually have a machined flywheel that I got a deal on, but your offer is greatly appreciated! I have this dream (this crazy, crazy dream) that I'll be able to do all of my own "regular" maintenance on her within a year, and that I'll be able to do more extraordinary stuff within five years. Getting this car has really enthused me to learn and do my own stuff! It's a little new because, of course, my background is computer geek...with a few years of working at a welding supply, the combination makes the idea of learning surmountable!

mtfhod

Is this the kind of set that will work for a number of projects on the beast, or is this more specific tools for the starter change?

Thanks!

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

54mm= 2 1/8" You can get a 2 1/8" socket from Sears (about $23 last time I checked). You'll need this socket whenever you need to pull the flywheel (new flywheel, engine rebuild, etc.).

Also, when you do the flywheel, consider replacing the clutch, throwout bearing, possibly pilot bearing (not expensive, but tough to remove). Also consider replacing the front transmission seal and transmission mount. It is a lot better to do this stuff while the tranny is out anyway than to have one of these things go bad and then have to pull the tranny all over again. It would also be a good idea to change the transmission oil (often something that is negleted).

mazdaverx713b

iTrader: (91)

why are you considering replacing the flywheel? i've never seen a ring gear fail on a 7. pull the starter and have someone rotate the engine by hand while you look into the starter's hole (with a flashlight) on the bellhousing and inspect the teeth on the ring gear yourself. look for broken or missing teeth. pretty easy to do. no broken or missing teeth, no need to pull the trans to replace the ring gear.

RX-7 Chris

iTrader: (19)

I am sending you a PM.

mtfhod

I went ahead and talked to my "investors" and we decided to let the mechanic do the work because I really did not have the time/tools/talent to do it. (The "three Ts," I'm sure.) The mechanic is reputable, but I have not gone to check his work. I think I will be printing out some of the messages from this thread in order to see if he's doing what needs to be done - so anything you think will be good "ammunition" to keep this under control is appreciated, as has been all of the fabulous information you guys have been offering!

trochoid

iTrader: (6)

Welcome to the forum. I really hate to see a new owner have to shell out this kind of money for so little work. If I was still in the the metro area, I'd be more than happy to take care of you. For what you will spend on this one repair alone, you could buy a complete tool set, parts, rent a garage and still have money left over. This is how one gains experience and knowledge. It helps to have a guide when first starting out though.

In my sig line is a link to the FSM and other rotary reading, DL the FSM and the carb manual, start studying. I know there used to be 1 or 2 rotary shops in the metro area, are you using one of them?
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gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

I agree with T and Dave. If it is just the starter, it is a simple task. All you need is a couple sockets and end wrenches. Probably less than a 1 hour job for even a beginner. If the ring gear is shot, then it becomes a more complex job (pulling tranny, and flywheel), but still not that bad. I see that from your profile that you are a lady (also explains the She-devil reference). I hope that you mechanic is not taking advantage of you because of that. As Dave said, the ring gear may not even be bad. If I was close, I would be happy to help you out.

In my opinion, the mechanic is charging too much (especially since it may only be just a starter replacement). Here is what you should do: Go to the regional sections of the forum(the section that would cover Denver) and just see if anyone could give a hand. I know that most of us would help for free or for some pizza and beer. If you can't find a 7 owner to help, how about getting a friend, family member, or neighbor that has some experience with cars to help? This kind of job is basically the same for any type of car, so someone with only piston engine experience could still handle this. Also, we can guide you if you run into problems or have questions.

You will never get the tools and talent if you don't jump in and go for it. It is how we learn. All of us started out in your position at some point. As you do these different repairs, you'll become more knowledgeable and more confident.

Best of luck to you.

Kent