bouis

I know this question has been asked before so I'll try to limit my question to my specific case as possible.

I picked up a nice looking 2nd gen oil cooler with the rubber mounts for $25. I didn't get any hoses, but I'm not sure if it should have fittings on the cooler or not. As it is now, it just has the threaded holes. I also got a filter pedestal from an SE. Here's what I know I need:

* 2 o-rings for the filter pedestal.
* to weld two little brackets to that round bar that runs in front of the radiator so I can mount the oil cooler on it properly (this is how most folks install it, right?)
* a plug for one of the coolant taps on the block (right?) Anyone know the thread?

Here's the thing: I don't know what kind of hoses I will need. Will 2nd gen hoses reach the cooler if it's installed on that bar in the FB? (they look longer?)

If not, I guess I'll have to make my own or have someone do it for me. This way, I'll need to know the fittings to use. I'd like to get them before I start taking things apart, because I don't think I can find metric stuff easily here.

I notice that Mazdatrix sells -AN style adapters. But I don't know exactly what they're used for. I assume that it's for metric-standard conversion. So could I get a couple of these to get standard threads, then take it to a shop and let them make the lines for me?

What I want is specific descriptions of any of these fittings/adapters so I can order them ahead of time. Also, if anyone can share their experiences doing this install, it'd be great.

breesej

Bouis,

this is what I would do.

I would try my hardest to use the Mazdatrix SS direct fit lines for the 2G oil cooler.

1. Attach the oil lines to the oil cooler and then run them back to attach them to the motor, but don't attach them just yet. The oil feed and return lines for the oil cooler will most likely straddle the front anti-sway bar.
2. Mark on the chassis where you will need to weld your brackets.
3. Weld away on those custom brackets
4. Install oil cooler and enjoy.

I would stay away from AN fittings since the fittings are malable aluminum and you would need the appropriate AN wrenches. AN fittings also leak a little sometimes and dealing with that kind of sucks. The Racing Beat lines use AN fittingss and they leaked like no other. Once I switched to the direct fit, all leaks were gone.

Keep us posted and take a few pics when it's all done....

bouis

Thanks, I'll keep that in mind about the AN- fittings. As you can see I have no experience with them.

But, I just don't know if 2nd gen lines will reach. I don't want to go buy a set and find that they won't. Surely someone has done this before and can say for sure -- right, guys?

Edit: Anyone know the length of 2gen hoses? Otherwise, I'll measure what I need, then go down to the junkyard and see if they have a 2nd gen and measure its hoses.

elwood

iTrader: (1)

First off, AN fittings come in (from softest to hardest): non-anodized aluminum, anodized aluminum, brass, zinc dacromet-coated steel, and stainless steel. I use the steel stuff because it's cheap and durable. I'd use stainless instead if I had an unlimited budget. The advantage of the anodized aluminum stuff is that it's relatively easy to find at your speed shop and places like Summit or Jegs and it often comes in red & blue, which some people like (you can also get in in clear anodized, which looks like stainless steel).

As far as leaks are concerned, I've had -10 AN oil lines on two different cars and never had a leak. I can't say the same for the original lines. The Racing Beat adapters are steel and go from a 14mm X 1.5mm crush washer to a -10 AN male fitting. The side with the crush washer is the weak link, which you will have no matter which method you choose. The secret on the crush washer side is to use a little high temp silicone sealant on both sides of the crush washer prior to installation. Once you install it, tighten everything (including the attaching hoses if you'r using AN stuff) and allow it to cure overnight (I don't care if the tube says less -- let it cure for at least 8)

If you go with custom lines, there are many types available, but they fall into two basic categories -- rubber and teflon. Rubber is cheaper and more flexible, but usually has a lower pressure rating and won't last quite as long (as compared to teflon, but even the rubber will last practically forever). When using teflon, you have to be very careful not to violate the bend radius and kink it. Once you have, the line is junk. I have teflon because they were both about the same price at the shop where I had them made. Next time around, I'll probably use rubber for the added flexibility. BTW -- the stainless steel jacket is principally there for abrasion resistance, not pressure support.

Where to get the stuff: If you want crimped-on steel fittings (what I have), go to a hydraulic hose shop for heavy equipment. If you give them the length and configuration, they can make practically anything you want. They can make these in rubber or teflon. If you want to assemble the lines yourself, you will typically go with aluminum or stainless fittings. You can get either one from hoseandfittings.com. Your hose will most likely be rubber.

rotarymike

iTrader: (1)

I made some brackets that bolted to the vertical bolt points the hood hinges use, and come down and over to bolt to the sides of the oil cooler. I'm using a piece of rubber sheet about 3/16 thick between one mounting tab and the bracket for vibe resistance, but the other is hard mounted. I will be taking my FC oil lines (I have just the ends the hose was trashed) to a hydraulic equipment (see who repair caterpillar machinery in your area) shop who charges in the $60 range.

Since I'm using -SE housings in my motor, it looks like the rear oil fitting and the front cover oil fitting are the only two, and I will hook the motor up like an (albeit shorter) 13B. Any confirmation of this?

MRGSL-SE

there's gonna be some need for cutting steel to give clearance... make sure you got a power tool of some sort

Rx7carl

Well I did mine on the racecar like this. Mazdatrix Metric to AN adapters and made my mount from some scrap angle iron I had around. As far as the hoses, I bought a length from summit along with the appropriate hose end fittings. You can make the hoses at home if you follow the directions. go to www.aeroquip.com and youll find all you need on the topic.

Total bs. I wrench on airplanes every day. We use AN fittings all over them. If they were that unsafe would air travel be as safe as it is? A properly built AN connection is a very safe and leak proof connection.

I didnt need to cut anything on my racecar. It would be illegal if I did.

bouis

Hey, thanks a bunch guys. I had to take a lot of abuse, but I found from the guys on 2nd gen forum that the 2gen hoses are 19" and 30" --- probably not long enough for this mounting location, huh? I haven't actually measured it yet because I'm still too busy with class... but that ends on Wednesday and I want to be ready for this project by the weekend. So, here's a revised "what I need" based on what I've read so far:

Mazdatrix:
2 o-rings for the filter pedestal. $ 8.00 #man, Mazdatrix gets you here!
1 ADAPTER -10 16MM THD $ 9.50 #for the front cover
3 ADAPTER -10 18MM THD $28.50 #for the oil cooler & block
1 Sealing washer for 16mm $ 1.25
3 Sealing washer 18mm $ 3.75
Summit:
10' Aeroquip -10 hose $51.00

Now I still have a little research to do but I assume I need four of the Aeroquip -10 to -10 fittings. I assume that I don't want to use the slip-over "socketless" fittings, right? I'm going to read the Aeroquip page over real good when I get the chance. Thanks guys!

bouis

Actually the socketless stuff uses different hoses and is rated at 250 psi and 300 degrees... plus, it's quite a bit cheaper. I'm very tempted to try it, instead. I don't care about the "bling bling" factor of SS hoses, though my washing machine does have SS hoses and racing stripes.

Edit: also, -10 AN sounds like overkill -- should I use -8 instead?

I think I'm going to go with socketless -- everything I've read about them (except putting them together) has been positive. I'd also rather get steel fittings but summit doesn't seem to carry them, I guess I'll have to look around.

bouis

Okay, nevermind, AN-10 is fine. Looks like I'm facing $50 for the line (since they don't sell the socketless line in less than 15ft sections) and 20 each for the four ends.

This is looking to be pretty darn expensive.

Rx7carl

Never go smaller than -10. This is your oil supply to the engine were talking about here. Veddy importante ****. I know a few roundy round guys who've tried the socketless stuff and werent impressed. I use regular old AN swivel ends, Aeroquip. They are $ but reuseable if the hose ever gets damaged so its a one time investment. I have a shitload of pics of my installation if you need some guidance BTW. Youll also see that the ends I use are the correct bend for the application.

bouis

Pictures are always appreciated. If it's not too much trouble, I'd like to see any you've got.

Socketless doesn't actually seem any cheaper (now that I add it all up) or easier to assemble (for 155lb me) so I'll probably stick with the SS. I do like to explore my options though. Thanks a lot for the input Carl.

bouis

Ever get those pics, Carl?

Rx7carl

Email me. Ill zip em up and send em. Hope you got lotsa space and a fast connection.

bouis

I do indeed. Edit: but your e-mail addy isn't set to public.

hornbm

The AN fittins never leak if you actually read the directions and use the right tools, which means an actual AN wrench. I can put 5 bucks on the table right now that says you didnt use one. these fittings are only supposed to be so tight and the wrench prevents you from over tightening. Read the damn directions next time. When an fittins are installed as per the directions they are LEAK FREE. PERIOD.