what can i do to make a friendly 400hp beast out of a s4 T2??
01-13-08, 03:18 PM
#53
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I would like to know how much it cost you to get the point of where your engine is. I am guessing it is a lot more than $10K...because it has taken more than one attempt. Also, what prices do you get parts at? With all the parts I have put together and put into my engine I am a little over $10K and I may have been able to save $1K, but not much more than that. You have MANY systems in the engine to think about, if you are starting with a completely stock car it is going to take some coin...
Engine build........$3500
Turbo system......$3000 + $800 in necessary parts to get it running (BOV, Boost control, IC piping)
Intercooler...........$500 (used)
Clutch setup.........$500
Fuel system..........$800
Exhaust................$800
ECU......................$1000
Wideband.............$300
Tuning/dyno..........$300
__________________
Total.....................$11,500
(options)
W/A Injection........$400
ignition box...........$350
coils.......................$100
heatshielding.........$150
gauges...................$200
__________________
Total w/options.......$12,700
That is a conservative estimate WITHOUT labor, and it also doesn't include all the little things that nickel and dime you to death with this car. I "thought" I could afford it when I started and even though it will turn out that I could afford it, I never wanted to sink this much money into a car.
All of this before ever even starting to build the suspension and braking components and also assuming all of the chasis is in PERFECT shape. I would NEVER drive a car with that much power with tired old bushings and suspension. That is just silly.
So perhaps it can be done cheaply, but it certainly won't hold together very long especially on roadrace type tracks and lapping sessions. I guess it depends on what you want out of it, but a reliably running 400whp is not cheap by any stretch of the imagination...well unless you are one of my clients and this type of money is what they spend on one of 10 fountains in their landscaping...
Oh, and I am not taking a shot at you, J-Rat, I am just asking if you added up everything it took to get you to the 400whp barrier, what would it come out to?
Engine build........$3500
Turbo system......$3000 + $800 in necessary parts to get it running (BOV, Boost control, IC piping)
Intercooler...........$500 (used)
Clutch setup.........$500
Fuel system..........$800
Exhaust................$800
ECU......................$1000
Wideband.............$300
Tuning/dyno..........$300
__________________
Total.....................$11,500
(options)
W/A Injection........$400
ignition box...........$350
coils.......................$100
heatshielding.........$150
gauges...................$200
__________________
Total w/options.......$12,700
That is a conservative estimate WITHOUT labor, and it also doesn't include all the little things that nickel and dime you to death with this car. I "thought" I could afford it when I started and even though it will turn out that I could afford it, I never wanted to sink this much money into a car.
All of this before ever even starting to build the suspension and braking components and also assuming all of the chasis is in PERFECT shape. I would NEVER drive a car with that much power with tired old bushings and suspension. That is just silly.
So perhaps it can be done cheaply, but it certainly won't hold together very long especially on roadrace type tracks and lapping sessions. I guess it depends on what you want out of it, but a reliably running 400whp is not cheap by any stretch of the imagination...well unless you are one of my clients and this type of money is what they spend on one of 10 fountains in their landscaping...
Oh, and I am not taking a shot at you, J-Rat, I am just asking if you added up everything it took to get you to the 400whp barrier, what would it come out to?
that is SOOOOO far off it isn't even funny
3500 for an engine build?!?!?!
you must have rebuilt it with everything you possibly could, full bridgeport, machined rotors, rx8 e-shaft, ext ext..... and THEN got ripped off..
that might cost 2000 if you literally did EVERYTHING, and did it yourself
turbo system 3800 bucks?!!?!?!?!?!?!
if you got a really good 100 buck turbo, you could actually PAY SOMEONE ELSE (i.e. there are labor charges there) to make you a FULL exhaust system for 1000$.
wastegate+piping+BOV+boost control is mabey 500$.
intercooler 500 dollars?!?!?!?! USED?!?!?!?!!?!!?!?!?!
yeh right
go on ebay right now, and get an intercooler good for 1000HP, it will work FINE for anything you're putting in a 13b, and cost like 250-300 BRAND NEW.
you got the clutch about right at 500$
800????
fuel system shouldn't really be more than 500$ if you do it yourself
EXHAUST 800!!?!?!?!
i already put exhuast as part of the turbo!
ECU? 1000$????
i see e6ks for 700 bucks on ebay all the time.
wideband 300.. ok
tuning dyno 300.. sure
and you'd be putting 600 RWHP like that pretty easy
now along with all those nice little things like painting up engine parts, all your little rice bullshit gauges, andwhatever else you feel like having
it should be 6000$ AT THE ******* MAXIMUM for what you just listed, and for what i just CORRECTED.
12,700 my ***, its people like you discouraging people out there like this dude to not do **** because they think its gunna cost them a brand new car.
01-13-08, 03:59 PM
#54
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rough estimate of my car:
haltech e6x - 1000
1680cc injectors x2 - 200
a1000-6 regulator - 140
new orings - 20
weld on bungs x4 - 30
-an fittings - 120
-6 an hose - 80
upgraded radiator - 300
half bridge - 850
rebuild kit- 800
block off plates - 100
efan - 150
front mount wtih custom brackets/and piping - 400
bov - 100
higgi elbow - 100
boost controller (apexi avc-r used)- 200
spark plug wires - 40
new plugs - 40
wide band/dual egt/other gauges - 550
fully ceramic coated aspec mani wiht 500r tubo and dp - 4500
custom exhaust - 500
rebuilt calipers and rotors - 300
clutch - 300 used going to have to be replaced soon
havent finished my meth setup but im planning on spending about 500 on it, a coolingmist s-hsv valve, coolingmist pump, custom tank, adn im swithcing to a haltech e8 to control the valve.
it comes to about 6k without including the brake rebuild, the turbo or the meth injection. a grand total of about 11k then tack on about 500 for dyno time and tuning and you are good to go.
a few things to note. a. i did not do this the cheap way. if you are a good shopper and check the for sale section you can get some great deals on people parting out setups. also, you can do your own port job. i elected not to because i didnt want to **** up my motor by accident. you probably can get away using some variety of rubber hose instead of ss hose for the fuel system. you could also not go front mount and use some water or meth injection. you could also save on the exhaust. i elected to custom my exhaust but you could look into corksport or pick up a used one off the forum for cheaper.
you could get a good turbo setup for around 1100 if you want to get a used one or 3k if you want to get a new one.
as far as the post above me... spend $100 on a turbo that you think is good for 600hp i doubt it but anythingis possible. 3500 for an engine build seems a bit much but if you have to replace an iron or a housing its going to get expensive. better to budget in a little extra money so you dont run out half way through your project. also.. you say 600hp easy you neglect to mention any AI so im assuming that is on race gas. im assuming this guy wants to drive the car with out having to use race gas so some ai is a must. 6k for 600hp as you mentioned seems a bit ambitious. 6k for 400hp might be doable.
im to lazy to proof read this so if it is jiberish just ignore it
haltech e6x - 1000
1680cc injectors x2 - 200
a1000-6 regulator - 140
new orings - 20
weld on bungs x4 - 30
-an fittings - 120
-6 an hose - 80
upgraded radiator - 300
half bridge - 850
rebuild kit- 800
block off plates - 100
efan - 150
front mount wtih custom brackets/and piping - 400
bov - 100
higgi elbow - 100
boost controller (apexi avc-r used)- 200
spark plug wires - 40
new plugs - 40
wide band/dual egt/other gauges - 550
fully ceramic coated aspec mani wiht 500r tubo and dp - 4500
custom exhaust - 500
rebuilt calipers and rotors - 300
clutch - 300 used going to have to be replaced soon
havent finished my meth setup but im planning on spending about 500 on it, a coolingmist s-hsv valve, coolingmist pump, custom tank, adn im swithcing to a haltech e8 to control the valve.
it comes to about 6k without including the brake rebuild, the turbo or the meth injection. a grand total of about 11k then tack on about 500 for dyno time and tuning and you are good to go.
a few things to note. a. i did not do this the cheap way. if you are a good shopper and check the for sale section you can get some great deals on people parting out setups. also, you can do your own port job. i elected not to because i didnt want to **** up my motor by accident. you probably can get away using some variety of rubber hose instead of ss hose for the fuel system. you could also not go front mount and use some water or meth injection. you could also save on the exhaust. i elected to custom my exhaust but you could look into corksport or pick up a used one off the forum for cheaper.
you could get a good turbo setup for around 1100 if you want to get a used one or 3k if you want to get a new one.
as far as the post above me... spend $100 on a turbo that you think is good for 600hp i doubt it but anythingis possible. 3500 for an engine build seems a bit much but if you have to replace an iron or a housing its going to get expensive. better to budget in a little extra money so you dont run out half way through your project. also.. you say 600hp easy you neglect to mention any AI so im assuming that is on race gas. im assuming this guy wants to drive the car with out having to use race gas so some ai is a must. 6k for 600hp as you mentioned seems a bit ambitious. 6k for 400hp might be doable.
im to lazy to proof read this so if it is jiberish just ignore it
01-13-08, 04:38 PM
#55
Lives on the Forum
that is SOOOOO far off it isn't even funny
3500 for an engine build?!?!?!
you must have rebuilt it with everything you possibly could, full bridgeport, machined rotors, rx8 e-shaft, ext ext..... and THEN got ripped off..
that might cost 2000 if you literally did EVERYTHING, and did it yourself
3500 for an engine build?!?!?!
you must have rebuilt it with everything you possibly could, full bridgeport, machined rotors, rx8 e-shaft, ext ext..... and THEN got ripped off..
that might cost 2000 if you literally did EVERYTHING, and did it yourself
I agree that the price is rather inflated, but if we're talking about a "professional" rebuild, people pay this kinda money all the time.
turbo system 3800 bucks?!!?!?!?!?!?!
if you got a really good 100 buck turbo, you could actually PAY SOMEONE ELSE (i.e. there are labor charges there) to make you a FULL exhaust system for 1000$.
wastegate+piping+BOV+boost control is mabey 500$.
if you got a really good 100 buck turbo, you could actually PAY SOMEONE ELSE (i.e. there are labor charges there) to make you a FULL exhaust system for 1000$.
wastegate+piping+BOV+boost control is mabey 500$.
HKS 50mm Race / 50mm or 60mm GT or GTII - minimum $500
Cheapie HKS cast, discontinued - $200 - $300 on eBay
Tial 50mm / GReddy Type-R - $200
That about $2,000 right there.
We need to still take care of oil supply / drain lines, possible coolant supply / drain lines, gaskets, downpipe, intake, etc. - should not cost over $1,000
Premade kits range around $4,000, so I think that what they were talking about.
I think even the cheaper A-Spec kits range about $3,000 complete.
intercooler 500 dollars?!?!?!?! USED?!?!?!?!!?!!?!?!?!
yeh right
go on ebay right now, and get an intercooler good for 1000HP, it will work FINE for anything you're putting in a 13b, and cost like 250-300 BRAND NEW.
yeh right
go on ebay right now, and get an intercooler good for 1000HP, it will work FINE for anything you're putting in a 13b, and cost like 250-300 BRAND NEW.
The better density cores are $500 and go up from there.
800????
fuel system shouldn't really be more than 500$ if you do it yourself
fuel system shouldn't really be more than 500$ if you do it yourself
These things are not drop-in replacements.
Fuel lines needs to be upgraded to large ID's.
SS AN -6 line for 25 feet is easily over $100...times 2.
1600 fuel injectors are cheap.
Fittings, aftermarket FPR will cost you several hundred right there.
If we're going surge tank, then there's added costs which can easily add another couple hundred.
$800 is not unreasonable.
EXHAUST 800!!?!?!?!
i already put exhuast as part of the turbo!
i already put exhuast as part of the turbo!
Even the RB 3" is okay, you really need to step up to a large than 3" diameter exhaust system.
This means custom...
$800 for a 3.5" custom exhaust is not uncommon.
Ever price out a good, quality 3.5" or 4.0" muffler section?
Borla charges $200 for just their 4" muffler.
ECU? 1000$????
i see e6ks for 700 bucks on ebay all the time.
i see e6ks for 700 bucks on ebay all the time.
Stop taking the getto **** way out.
I wouldn't go below a Haltech E8, and that retails around $1,500 brand new for everything.
wideband 300.. ok
tuning dyno 300.. sure
and you'd be putting 600 RWHP like that pretty easy
now along with all those nice little things like painting up engine parts, all your little rice bullshit gauges, andwhatever else you feel like having
it should be 6000$ AT THE ******* MAXIMUM for what you just listed, and for what i just CORRECTED.
12,700 my ***, its people like you discouraging people out there like this dude to not do **** because they think its gunna cost them a brand new car.
and you'd be putting 600 RWHP like that pretty easy
now along with all those nice little things like painting up engine parts, all your little rice bullshit gauges, andwhatever else you feel like having
it should be 6000$ AT THE ******* MAXIMUM for what you just listed, and for what i just CORRECTED.
12,700 my ***, its people like you discouraging people out there like this dude to not do **** because they think its gunna cost them a brand new car.
Build me a 500hp FC for $6,000, and I'll buy it off of you for that price?
-Ted
01-13-08, 09:48 PM
#57
Saiga-12 Power!
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Originally Posted by Chaotic_FC
its people like you discouraging people out there like this dude to not do **** because they think its gunna cost them a brand new car.
It is people like you that are the reason why so many FD's & FC's are such shitboxes and why there are so many failed\underbudgeted projects being parted out or sold to V8 swappers.
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