Old guys with 12As club meeting
10-20-09, 01:07 AM
#8076
Mr. RPM
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In an ideal world, the rotary engine metered oil pump should inject an ashless oil designed to burn in the combustion chamber and use a four-cycle oil in the crankcase for the eccentric shaft, rotor bearings and thrust bearings. For the street, Mazda simplified the OE system to use just one oil, that being a typical four-cycle oil for both the e-shaft as well as the combustion chamber. Royal Purple recommends using our standard 2-Cycle TCW III if the metered oil pump is still enabled. The two-cycle oil being added to the fuel tank is in addition to what Mazda designed to inject and acts as a supplement or insurance. Depending upon which engine, the level of modifications (street port, Bridgeport, peripheral port, nitrous turbocharged) and application, the typical mix ratio could vary from 200:1 to 800:1.
Also this is good stuff
Idemitsu premix
Idemitsu Racing Rotary Fuel Lube (Premix)
(Synthetic Blend) $5.00 a quart / $53.95 a case of 12qts (better value!)
* Designed For Use In Gasoline Engines Only
* Improved Sealing Performance
* Provides Additional Wear Protection For Apex Seals, Side Seals, etc.
* Keeps Fuel Injectors Clean For Reduced Maintenance
* Minimizes Exhaust Port Clogging
* Reduces Friction
* Application: 1/2 oz. Per 1 Gallon of Gasoline
A special blend of base oils reduces deposits and subsequent exhaust port clogging. As a result, your rotary will maintain the power at which it was designed.
Special detergent/dispersant additives keep you fuel injectors clean to reduce maintenance.
Provides additional lubrication for apex and side seals to increase seal life and increase efficiency of engine.
Special additives allow for better sealing of the chamber, creating greater efficiency and more power.
Also this is good stuff
Idemitsu premix
Idemitsu Racing Rotary Fuel Lube (Premix)
(Synthetic Blend) $5.00 a quart / $53.95 a case of 12qts (better value!)
* Designed For Use In Gasoline Engines Only
* Improved Sealing Performance
* Provides Additional Wear Protection For Apex Seals, Side Seals, etc.
* Keeps Fuel Injectors Clean For Reduced Maintenance
* Minimizes Exhaust Port Clogging
* Reduces Friction
* Application: 1/2 oz. Per 1 Gallon of Gasoline
A special blend of base oils reduces deposits and subsequent exhaust port clogging. As a result, your rotary will maintain the power at which it was designed.
Special detergent/dispersant additives keep you fuel injectors clean to reduce maintenance.
Provides additional lubrication for apex and side seals to increase seal life and increase efficiency of engine.
Special additives allow for better sealing of the chamber, creating greater efficiency and more power.
10-20-09, 01:25 AM
#8077
In an ideal world, the rotary engine metered oil pump should inject an ashless oil designed to burn in the combustion chamber and use a four-cycle oil in the crankcase for the eccentric shaft, rotor bearings and thrust bearings. For the street, Mazda simplified the OE system to use just one oil, that being a typical four-cycle oil for both the e-shaft as well as the combustion chamber. Royal Purple recommends using our standard 2-Cycle TCW III if the metered oil pump is still enabled. The two-cycle oil being added to the fuel tank is in addition to what Mazda designed to inject and acts as a supplement or insurance. Depending upon which engine, the level of modifications (street port, Bridgeport, peripheral port, nitrous turbocharged) and application, the typical mix ratio could vary from 200:1 to 800:1.
Also this is good stuff
Idemitsu premix
Idemitsu Racing Rotary Fuel Lube (Premix)
(Synthetic Blend) $5.00 a quart / $53.95 a case of 12qts (better value!)
* Designed For Use In Gasoline Engines Only
* Improved Sealing Performance
* Provides Additional Wear Protection For Apex Seals, Side Seals, etc.
* Keeps Fuel Injectors Clean For Reduced Maintenance
* Minimizes Exhaust Port Clogging
* Reduces Friction
* Application: 1/2 oz. Per 1 Gallon of Gasoline
A special blend of base oils reduces deposits and subsequent exhaust port clogging. As a result, your rotary will maintain the power at which it was designed.
Special detergent/dispersant additives keep you fuel injectors clean to reduce maintenance.
Provides additional lubrication for apex and side seals to increase seal life and increase efficiency of engine.
Special additives allow for better sealing of the chamber, creating greater efficiency and more power.
Also this is good stuff
Idemitsu premix
Idemitsu Racing Rotary Fuel Lube (Premix)
(Synthetic Blend) $5.00 a quart / $53.95 a case of 12qts (better value!)
* Designed For Use In Gasoline Engines Only
* Improved Sealing Performance
* Provides Additional Wear Protection For Apex Seals, Side Seals, etc.
* Keeps Fuel Injectors Clean For Reduced Maintenance
* Minimizes Exhaust Port Clogging
* Reduces Friction
* Application: 1/2 oz. Per 1 Gallon of Gasoline
A special blend of base oils reduces deposits and subsequent exhaust port clogging. As a result, your rotary will maintain the power at which it was designed.
Special detergent/dispersant additives keep you fuel injectors clean to reduce maintenance.
Provides additional lubrication for apex and side seals to increase seal life and increase efficiency of engine.
Special additives allow for better sealing of the chamber, creating greater efficiency and more power.
I actually have 7 quarts of the Racing Engine oil I've been saving for a fully running RX-7. Hopefully I'll get to use it soon.
10-20-09, 02:33 AM
#8079
Lettuce be cereal
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Oh and Quad Collin also convinced me to premix even though I have a working OMP and I do it every time now too. I'd rather keep my engine in working order and have a safety net incase something goes wrong.
10-20-09, 07:53 AM
#8080
If everyone who shows up is good for getting their hands dirty there is absolutely no reason the car can not be on the ground drivable by the end of the weekend. Hell, by the end of Sat if you have all the parts by that time.
I will consider us a failure if it is not done simply due to labor.
-billy
10-20-09, 08:37 AM
#8081
Michael, PLEASE post those pictures. I'm very interested to see how you have everything hooked up. Also, those little nipples on the front and rear housing that are almost right under the top part of the intake manifold, what did you do with them?[ I'm pretty sure I should just block them off, but I just want to double check.
Quad
Quad
10-20-09, 08:52 AM
#8082
Thanks for the pictures Michael, did you have to modify the stick at all? It's MUCH shorter than mine. And I'll get some pictures of what I'm talking about and post them tonight when I get home (or tomorrow morning if it's too late to take pictures when I get home).
10-20-09, 09:09 AM
#8083
no modifications. it's how it comes from RB. check their site or call them. u might can get whatever ur missing from them. if u have a piece of sheet metal u could probably fab up the piece for the carb that the rod attaches too, then just mod the rod u have to work.
10-20-09, 09:13 AM
#8084
The rod on my car is way too long to even modify I think. I don't know. I might just pre-mix until I can get someone more pro to check it out. I'll call RB and see what's up.
10-20-09, 09:39 AM
#8087
Im gone for a couple of days and you guys burn thru 5 pages! loler!~ Quad the OMP linkage was stuffed into the bolt hole on the water pump and was full on all the time,I checked it a million times to make sure it worked and I made sure it was still on everytime I opened the hood. I think the se has a diffrent type of OMP so you might have to do something a little different. GL with the swap, the 600 will be so much easier to work on and troubleshoot than the EFI for a novice rotorhead, Thats why I like carbs!
10-20-09, 10:29 AM
#8089
Sleeper but still slow
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If everyone who shows up is good for getting their hands dirty there is absolutely no reason the car can not be on the ground drivable by the end of the weekend. Hell, by the end of Sat if you have all the parts by that time.
I will consider us a failure if it is not done simply due to labor.
-billy
I will consider us a failure if it is not done simply due to labor.
-billy
10-20-09, 02:03 PM
#8092
Kevin personally showed me how his OMP was setup. (Karl was asking what he'd have to do if he ran a holley and what he should do with his omp)He had the OMP lines drilled and tapped into the manifold, and he had the little rod that measures throttle position, hard wired into the "full throttle" position, so it would be producing the most ammount of oil the OMP can flow at all times (the rod was snaked up tot he waterpump, and the end bent and fit into an unused bolt hole).So I know it was hooked up when sold to you, and the car not meant to use premix.
Hope this helps, maybe it'll trigger a "oh yeah, now that you mention it, the setup looked like that" kinda thing for you and Ben. If not, maybe it came undone?
Hope this helps, maybe it'll trigger a "oh yeah, now that you mention it, the setup looked like that" kinda thing for you and Ben. If not, maybe it came undone?
and quad, your 12a OMP arm should fit on your 13b OMP so we can just modify that one since it's not way too long like the SE's.
10-20-09, 02:25 PM
#8093
Sleeper but still slow
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thank you so much for your expert advice, Mr. Rowe. but i am right there with ya. yes, it was in the bolt hole on the water pump housing left by the lack of air pump, and yes, it was in the on position. i do not doubt that kevin checked it and it was working, as kevin has been working on 12a's for a good long time and knows what he's doing, but when we checked it, it was NOT in the full open position. this isnt to say that it wasnt working when said kevin sold the car to other kevin but driving styles vary between the kevins of this world - hence the reason the 12a probably blew his rear half. when i checked it, it was only about half open and the pump went twice as high after being pulled out of the hole so what im thinking is that it was great for first kevins driving style as he was just cruising around in it because it was an old 12a and he was just being gentle on it. it would be fine with this driving style because at around half throttle, it is getting the equal ratio of oil for the half throttle position, but if it stays in that position and the new kevin drives it shifting at full throttle, not knowing that it is permanently stuck in the half throttle position, he is only getting half the oil he needs for the amount of fuel he is dumping. this may be a very elementary concept to have to describe in such detail, but i feel is was necessary to explain why it was ok for kevin one, but not for kevin two without error on either kevins part. this is why i agree with colin that premixing is a good idea with or without a working OMP. coming from the 2nd gen background with the electronic OMP of tthe s5's, i have always been a little bit overly cautious.
and quad, your 12a OMP arm should fit on your 13b OMP so we can just modify that one since it's not way too long like the SE's.
and quad, your 12a OMP arm should fit on your 13b OMP so we can just modify that one since it's not way too long like the SE's.
10-20-09, 02:43 PM
#8094
The way that first sentence is typed I can't tell if it is sarcasm or not but I wasn't saying you guys were wrong, just that's how the setup was when I saw it, and Quad Kevin said that you guys found out it "wasn't hooked up at all". If it wasn't sarcasm I just missread it, it's the internet, so sometimes it's hard to gauge intentions.
10-20-09, 06:07 PM
#8095
I wonder if the oil was ever checked, like maybe it was ran low because there were 2 minor oil leaks I told him about, 1 , the OMP gasket, and 2 under the oil cooler, also I dont think the OMP is to blame I got on it everytime I drove it, like I said if there was anything on that car that was checked it was that OMP linkage to make sure the jerryrigitry was functioning properly.ALSO IIRC Billy told me to do it that way, argue with him! lol!
10-20-09, 06:27 PM
#8096
Yea, I didn't realize with it being in the bolt hole that it was hooked up. And Ben is right, I thought it would need to be somehow attached to the Holley to get oil. I checked the oil maybe a week before it popped, and it wasn't chock full, but it was good. I mean, I only had the thing for like 2 weeks before it blew, and only refilled the tank maybe 3 times? So it shouldn't have burnt through that much that quickly (leak or not).
Who knows. I'm thinking I mayhaps should have checked the oil more often, and just replaced that damn OMP gasket.
Who knows. I'm thinking I mayhaps should have checked the oil more often, and just replaced that damn OMP gasket.
10-20-09, 07:49 PM
#8098
The way that first sentence is typed I can't tell if it is sarcasm or not but I wasn't saying you guys were wrong, just that's how the setup was when I saw it, and Quad Kevin said that you guys found out it "wasn't hooked up at all". If it wasn't sarcasm I just missread it, it's the internet, so sometimes it's hard to gauge intentions.
10-20-09, 08:51 PM
#8099
Sleeper but still slow
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I forgot, you have an SE block likeI do now. YEah, those are oil injectors, you don't need to hook up any more oil lines, just the rod now, those will inject oil directly into the housings for you, no need to mix inside of the carburetor. I feel stupid, you can BARELY see them in my pic but my hookup is the same.