Rtek Will not connect
08-30-11, 02:24 PM
#1
Will not connect
Anyone have a working cable/palm combination just suddenly disconnect and never reconnect? If so..did it end up being a bad cable?
I have two Palms A Tungsten-C and a M515. Both have worked in the past for long periods of time.
I have not updated or changed the palm or rx7 logger software ever because once i had a working cable it worked without issue on both palms.
I had not connected to the ECU in quite a while...months. Then this past weekend i needed to make changes in the ECU so i pulled out the palms and the cable and connected to the ECU and started to make fuel and timing map changes. After about 10 min of total use and periodically giving me table size errors it disconnected and will not reconnect.
Anyone experience this? Any insight?
I have two Palms A Tungsten-C and a M515. Both have worked in the past for long periods of time.
I have not updated or changed the palm or rx7 logger software ever because once i had a working cable it worked without issue on both palms.
I had not connected to the ECU in quite a while...months. Then this past weekend i needed to make changes in the ECU so i pulled out the palms and the cable and connected to the ECU and started to make fuel and timing map changes. After about 10 min of total use and periodically giving me table size errors it disconnected and will not reconnect.
Anyone experience this? Any insight?
08-30-11, 06:37 PM
#2
Hmm, tough call.
First, you should always update to the latest software.
I would check the connectors. unplug and reconnect the hotsync cable to the ECU (DB9). Make sure the contacts on the bottom of the Palm are not tarnished.
Hit the reset button on the back. This will reset the communication hardware.
First, you should always update to the latest software.
I would check the connectors. unplug and reconnect the hotsync cable to the ECU (DB9). Make sure the contacts on the bottom of the Palm are not tarnished.
Hit the reset button on the back. This will reset the communication hardware.
08-30-11, 07:11 PM
#3
I tried unplugging and cleaning connectors. Plus tried, as i said, with two different palms.
In the past i had trouble finding a cable that would work, after buying ebay ones and generic china branded ones from other sources i ended up buying one from you. Its the only one that ever worked...until now...
Could this be an issue inside the ECU? Ive never opened it up and it has never been shocked, or gotten wet at all...car still starts and runs on the maps that it has...
In the past i had trouble finding a cable that would work, after buying ebay ones and generic china branded ones from other sources i ended up buying one from you. Its the only one that ever worked...until now...
Could this be an issue inside the ECU? Ive never opened it up and it has never been shocked, or gotten wet at all...car still starts and runs on the maps that it has...
08-30-11, 07:31 PM
#6
Having two Palms, especially two different Palm models with the same hotsync name is not recommended.
You said one worked for a bit then stopped. Did you immediately try the other? Or did you hotsync the 'bad' one, then hotsync the other one before you tried it?
What I'm trying to determine is if something could have gotten corrupt, and then you hotsync'd that corruption to the other Palm. Hotsyncing corrupt files over is common. People will reset their palm, then hotsync to load everything back on, and all that does is load the corrupt files right back on the Palm.
In order to clear corruption, you have to delete the RX7 logger off the Palm. Then hotsync once. The hotsync is what actually deletes the files. Once you hotsync, THEN you can use the Palm install tool to load the RX7 logger up again, which you'll need to hotsync once again after using the install tool. At that point it's a "fresh" install.
But hotsyncing two palms with the same name confuses the hotsync manager and can cause problems. I suggest giving them two different names.
You said one worked for a bit then stopped. Did you immediately try the other? Or did you hotsync the 'bad' one, then hotsync the other one before you tried it?
What I'm trying to determine is if something could have gotten corrupt, and then you hotsync'd that corruption to the other Palm. Hotsyncing corrupt files over is common. People will reset their palm, then hotsync to load everything back on, and all that does is load the corrupt files right back on the Palm.
In order to clear corruption, you have to delete the RX7 logger off the Palm. Then hotsync once. The hotsync is what actually deletes the files. Once you hotsync, THEN you can use the Palm install tool to load the RX7 logger up again, which you'll need to hotsync once again after using the install tool. At that point it's a "fresh" install.
But hotsyncing two palms with the same name confuses the hotsync manager and can cause problems. I suggest giving them two different names.
08-30-11, 07:40 PM
#7
I've never had a cable go bad except where there was visible physical damage (in this case, to one of the two retainer pins that's supposed to maintain a secure fit/connection).
I did, however, have this annoying software problem:
https://www.rx7club.com/rtek-forum-168/logging-multiple-parameters-966626/
It necessitated reloading maps into the ECU while I struggled to find a workaround.
One similarity to your problem is that two Palm devices experienced the same issue (bad params from ECU corrupted both(??)). My initial solution: reset the ECU and do a hard reset on the Palm (backup first, if needed). Yes, it's a PITA to reload everything with Palm Desktop, which is why I now use other methods:
(a) use the infrared Beam feature to install software from my backup Palm: RX7Logger, Roscoe Explorer, and a registered version of FileMan.
(b) copy from an SD card that contains all the necessary goodies.
Finally, I keep a known good saved state with the Palm OS Emulator. It's like having a third working Palm that's always setup correctly.
^ Edit: just fyi, I did not hotsync to cross-corrupt the other Palm in my case. It was something that the devices saw in the ECU which resulted in the problem on both.
I did, however, have this annoying software problem:
https://www.rx7club.com/rtek-forum-168/logging-multiple-parameters-966626/
It necessitated reloading maps into the ECU while I struggled to find a workaround.
One similarity to your problem is that two Palm devices experienced the same issue (bad params from ECU corrupted both(??)). My initial solution: reset the ECU and do a hard reset on the Palm (backup first, if needed). Yes, it's a PITA to reload everything with Palm Desktop, which is why I now use other methods:
(a) use the infrared Beam feature to install software from my backup Palm: RX7Logger, Roscoe Explorer, and a registered version of FileMan.
(b) copy from an SD card that contains all the necessary goodies.
Finally, I keep a known good saved state with the Palm OS Emulator. It's like having a third working Palm that's always setup correctly.
^ Edit: just fyi, I did not hotsync to cross-corrupt the other Palm in my case. It was something that the devices saw in the ECU which resulted in the problem on both.
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08-31-11, 12:00 AM
#8
It seems i may have created my own problem then. I believe i hot synced both due to them both having lost all mem from the long period of time since i last was working with the ECU (dead batteries). They sat and when i started them they did not have the RX-7 logger software. So when the first one disconnected. I did try the 2nd one. I cant recall if i used them in the reverse order...but i guess that would make sense as to the source of my issue...
08-31-11, 01:20 AM
#9
Ok i was able achive the "fresh install" on one of the palms. I put the other away to avoid issues for now. I hard reset the palm i am working with m515. Then i deleted the user in palm desktop and created a new user. From there i reinstalled the RX7 logger software and checked to see if it would connect again..
Is there a way to reset the ECU without connecting to it? I did disconnect the battery, this didnt work.
I did upgrade to the latest software as well. Still no connection period.
Is there a way to reset the ECU without connecting to it? I did disconnect the battery, this didnt work.
I did upgrade to the latest software as well. Still no connection period.
08-31-11, 02:10 AM
#10
Now I'm starting to believe there is something wrong with your cable. When you hotsync with your PC, are you using the PC's serial port (or USB-to-serial adapter) and the cradle? If so, try synching using the cable instead. From a hardware device standpoint, the serial cradle is indistinguishable from the cable. It should synch fine with both. You may need to quit and restart hotsync manager between attempts.
If that does work, you'll need to start troubleshooting the physical connection between the Palm and the RTek. Try probing the pins on the RTek. At the bottom left of the trapezoidal connector (called pin 5) is the ground and the other pins are used for various data functions. You can also monitor the connection by using a null modem cable between the RTek and your PC and a port monitor such as Hyperterm or PuTTY. I've never done this but, if presumably if you see something (even if it's just a stream of garbage characters), it confirms that the RTek is attempting to communicate.
If that does work, you'll need to start troubleshooting the physical connection between the Palm and the RTek. Try probing the pins on the RTek. At the bottom left of the trapezoidal connector (called pin 5) is the ground and the other pins are used for various data functions. You can also monitor the connection by using a null modem cable between the RTek and your PC and a port monitor such as Hyperterm or PuTTY. I've never done this but, if presumably if you see something (even if it's just a stream of garbage characters), it confirms that the RTek is attempting to communicate.
08-31-11, 08:57 AM
#11
I have a USB cradle for hotsync. I dont think i even have a computer with a serial port anymore...
I'm trying to source a cable or 3...4...whatever. We leave for the NASA national championships on monday. I guess i should have tried this sooner or had a backup cable and rtek ECU. Just had no reason to believe it wouldnt work, once i had a working cable before it was solid...
I'm trying to source a cable or 3...4...whatever. We leave for the NASA national championships on monday. I guess i should have tried this sooner or had a backup cable and rtek ECU. Just had no reason to believe it wouldnt work, once i had a working cable before it was solid...
09-01-11, 08:29 AM
#16
Update after messing with it more last night. I got my first replacement cable of a couple i ordered.
I tried the cable and it did not connect at all. I decided to check the continuity on the ECU cable. After some messing around and cleaning the contacts on the 9pins i was able to get it connected. The connection was rather flaky and after a short time (1-2 min) it disconnected again completely. After disconnecting the serial cable from the ECU cable and cycling the power on the ECU itself it was able to connect again for a short time. This went on about 4-5 times and each time i had to cycle the ECU power and disconnect and reconnect the cable to get a few min of connection. As i further cleaned the contacts it seemed to stabilize some but its still rather flaky.
The contacts never looked tarnished, rusted or dirty, but it took some serious attention with electronic cleaner, compressed air and a scrub pad on the pins to improve the situation.
In hindsight this is a racecar. The cable is just out in the elements and i did not have any kind of cap or protector on the serial connector. I am guessing i have a fair bit of oxidation or other crud built up on the pins. Im going to keep working with it but may have to replace the ecu side cable...
I tried the cable and it did not connect at all. I decided to check the continuity on the ECU cable. After some messing around and cleaning the contacts on the 9pins i was able to get it connected. The connection was rather flaky and after a short time (1-2 min) it disconnected again completely. After disconnecting the serial cable from the ECU cable and cycling the power on the ECU itself it was able to connect again for a short time. This went on about 4-5 times and each time i had to cycle the ECU power and disconnect and reconnect the cable to get a few min of connection. As i further cleaned the contacts it seemed to stabilize some but its still rather flaky.
The contacts never looked tarnished, rusted or dirty, but it took some serious attention with electronic cleaner, compressed air and a scrub pad on the pins to improve the situation.
In hindsight this is a racecar. The cable is just out in the elements and i did not have any kind of cap or protector on the serial connector. I am guessing i have a fair bit of oxidation or other crud built up on the pins. Im going to keep working with it but may have to replace the ecu side cable...
09-13-11, 01:27 PM
#18
Partially...
It still does not stay connected indefinitely. I have to unplug, power cycle the ECU, then replug the serial cable back into the ECU. Then i get maybe 5-10 min before it dumps out again. Luckily it seems like when i do have a connection the changes i make are written immediately to the ECU as they should be and they stick so...for now it is functional....
It still does not stay connected indefinitely. I have to unplug, power cycle the ECU, then replug the serial cable back into the ECU. Then i get maybe 5-10 min before it dumps out again. Luckily it seems like when i do have a connection the changes i make are written immediately to the ECU as they should be and they stick so...for now it is functional....
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