suganuma

my motor is blown
as of now i am starting to compile a list of things to do after i pull it.

i'm trying to gather a list of things to get the engine builder to do as far as internal engine work. i am familiar with the different types of porting and i plan on going with a large street port - considering a partial bridge, but probably not in the sake of drivability (unless someone recommends it highly and can discuss how it drives, etc)

looking for things like: oil modifications, lightened rotors, etc

if youve tried anything, or heard through hearsay that its good, then list it, and for the sake of those just reading and searching give a brief description of the benefits of the modification if you can.

THANKS

Damnfuct

there's not really much you can do to a rotary engine, considering it only has about 5 moving parts/group (like apex seals)..

i guess you could put bigger seals in, but they dont' seal as well and the added intertia would make them float at a lower rpm..

you could put in 3 pc, 2pc or 1 pc seals..
3 seal better, 1 are better for power i believe (don't seal as well on the street i hear, not as good torque/mileage)

you could try carbon seals for better sealing (ha! if you don't know already, they don't last too long).

if you could get a hold of lighter rotors, you'd be on your way to reducing inertial loads on the eccentric shaft, and you might be able to touch a higher redline (consider lighter apex seals to see that, or else you get that damn floating again), and if you're planning on running up at 10,000 rpm, you'd probably want a bigger port than a street or a mild bridge. probably a heavy bridge or a p-port even?

as always, anyone.. correct me if i'm wrong

Damnfuct

Ah! almost forgot, need corner seals too.. don't want to throw one of those puppies,

harden the gear teeth on the side housing,too

suganuma

it will be a street car, but it will hit the track mostly in autocross and road race....with the occassional drag thrown in

for the most part it will be a street car, but i really dont care if it gets wild tahts why i threw in the possibility of a partial bridge....

i_piss_on_hondas

I jsut depends on what you want out of it and what kind of induction sytem your going to run... are you going turbo or supercharger??? how long do you want the motor to last??? how high are you going to spin it??? There arnt alot of aftermarket internal parts for the rotarys BUT you can take all the good parts from different years of motors... a aftermarket set of seals is DEFANATLY a good idea on ANY rebuild...

suganuma

ok
dont start with all this depends on this and that and what not....

obviously i have a 93 im running a turbo and under my sig it says CLICK FOR MODS....sorry to be a bitch, just frustrated by this forum.

if you have all these ideas then just list them, thats all im asking.......DOWN with the shadiness...

R Xplicit

look at the mods and 'safties' that are listed on rob golden's site, @ pineappleracing.com...if you are not already familiar with it....

he does great work, from what i hear. he is very helpful on the phone, and will answer any q's that you have. the corner and apex seals are definately something to think about.

did you blow you motor, and **** up a seal gap. then you may have to go with 3mm seals, and then the rotors have to be milled out like mine did. but then the argument of 'doesn't that compromise the integrity of the rotor?' and so on. this was a decision i recently made when havein pettit rebuild my motor.

you can have your eccentric shaft 'knife-edged-and-balanced' as well as have the option of lighter rotors. this would all help reduce your rotating mass and help the longivety of the motor. or so i am told.

i think that the info on the pineapple site and an hour long conversation with rob himself can help you make up your mind on what you want to do....

-just a thought...

louis

suganuma

i plan on probably having rob rebuild the motor if i can work out the shipping details.

ive read the things on his site, but most of them ive heard of. just trying to get some more ideas of things that y'all have heard of or tried. if it comes down to it, ill probably just hand over the block and tell him to go nuts...

mmaragos

Have Rob mod your 13B-REW into a "26B". He can do it. He he.

I don't know about lighter rotors. I have read that this can reduce torque, I think they must have been referring to lower end torque. Again, Rob would probably have a good idea what kind of effect this would have on your torque. You might want to add that to your list of questions for him. It would allow you to spin your engine faster...it might shift your torque curve up in RPM.

twister

Hi, I use lighted rotors approx 3.7kg in my circuit car, also a 2 piece eccentric-shaft. Gets rid of crank flex to help increase hp and also (the main thing for me) increase reliability. With the lightened rotors & 2 piece e-shaft it sure helps the motor spin up and up quick! Torque is not a problem, (I run a 13B bridgeport, non-turbo).

Node

iTrader: (1)

twister: could you be so kind as to toss us a list of your "internal mods" and your redline?

E6KT2

I second Node.

HWO

Mate you are tugging yourself

factory 3 piece 2mm apex seals are basically THE best you can get hold of. short of spending big $$$$$$$$$$$ you wont find anything better.
unless you are planning on making over 1000HP from your 13B, the only reason they'll break is from poor tuning

Node

iTrader: (1)

Preach On!!!

twister

Hi, I use SV Rotors (non turbo), 2mm carbon seals, I have had the rotors lightened (they are about 3.7kg), a two piece crank (that is about 1.2kg lighter than a standard one', fully balanced as a total spinning unit, Chrome Moly flywheel (about 10lbs), balanced with the counterweight, rotors, e-shaft etc

The porting is a large bridgeport, and I run a microtech injectio system, not direct throttle body yet, still via a weber sort of manifold.

I have the redline set at about 9,600 but on the dyno it keeps on increasing the hp right up in-excess of 12k, so when I need it I can keep on pushing it up higher as I need it in a race. The dyno is done at the rear wheels, i.e. rwhp, producing about 290hp

Node

iTrader: (1)

Thats sweet twister! So what do you think your real redline is? And why not use it? Too much stress on the engine, or just not enough of a power gain to bother?

bdybuilder

Another mod you can do is to the oil jet thermostat. So that it has the cooling jets on all of the time and keep the engine running cooler...

twister

Real redline, depends what you mean? Do you mean when will it go bang?

Also of course internal mods with bigger oil pump, water jackets opened up for more flow, rotor oil lines also opened up, baffles in the sump etc etc

The reason I set it at that is for long term realiability of the engine etc, I gues I cannto afford to get rebuild to often and as I am producing about 250 hp at 9'600 rpms that is pretty cool. yes the powerband does keep on going up but I guess I worry about the seals etc.
In racing I find it is the total package that wins overall, i.e. the right brakes, transmission, torsen suspension etc, overall if you have the right package that is going to hang together that is what counts. My biggest problem in recent years has been the right gearset, but I now have that solved so all is sweet.

Node

iTrader: (1)

Didn't you mention previously you were running a GURU straight cut tranny?
Nice race car you seem to have, any pictures of it?

twister

Yes I do run a Guru Tranny (it has the latest 5 dog tooth profile cuts). Yes I do have some photo's, let me find a couple of good ones and I will post them here.

Cheers.

fastrotaries

Have you considered, cryogenic Freezing of key parts? What about, ceramic coating of the rotor housing? Greatly reduces friction. Also ceramic coating of the intake manifold .....but then that's outside the motor and so on. There are alot of shortcuts you can take. Some people say it's a waste..most are too conventional.

Node

iTrader: (1)

I don't know if I would trust ceramic coating of the rotor housing.
Have you done this, or is that just theory?
It would probably raise compression, which would be good in some cases.
It COULD also chip off being far more destructive than carbon buildup.
But this is also only in theory.

twister

Hi, I have on my 13B bridgeport wth excellent success. I will see if I can get Rohan to give some more technical information.