Premiumriceonly

iTrader: (5)

I have read up on the threads about running premix and I decided it was something I'd like to do. The other threads cleared up most of my questions but I still have a few unanswered

I have an n/a s5 and I was told the CEL will go off if the oil metering pump is disconnected. Any suggestions or fixes?

And what do you guys use to measure the oil and put it in?

A few of my friends have used basically a beer bong to put it in.
Thanks

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

Just leave the stock metering oil pump in place and continue to run the car as Mazda designed.

As you indicated, if you remove the pump the ECU will throw the car into limp mode. There is no fix for this.

Either you have to leave the pump connected to the harness and just shove it out of the way after removing it from the engine, or just run the pump as designed.

Another option is to convert to a full standalone EMS, but I doubt that's really an option.

Premiumriceonly

iTrader: (5)

What do most of the guys runnin premix do with the pump? I've had bad experiences w limp mode and don't wanna deal with that

I do wanna disconnect it because I suspect it might be going bad and in no way do I have the cash for a rebuild.

SmogSUX

iTrader: (12)

Plenty of guys have run the pump and premix. Without the pump connected people usually run about 1 oz premix / 1 gallon of gas..with the omp connected I'm sure you'd need less than that though.

Mez

you could get one of these if you don't want your omp to keep injecting engine oil

http://www.rotaryaviation.com/oil_in...p_adaptors.htm

http://jhbperformance.com/products.php

BomberMan

iTrader: (4)

Aaron knows his ****.

Like he sez leave it alone. I believe Idemitsu reccommends premixing at 1/2 oz per gallon (if you feel like being **** and running both OMP and premix). Personally I run a standalone EMS with no OMP and premix at 1 oz per gallon.

SmogSUX

iTrader: (12)

I'm somewhat leery about the omp injecting 2 stroke...2stroke was designed to be mixed with gasoline wasn't it? So if it's being injected will it have enough time to actually mix with the fuel that's being atomized and combusted? hmm...

btw ems + 1oz/gallon here wooT

Premiumriceonly

iTrader: (5)

thanks for the info guys. heres my problem tho
my oil level doesnt seem to be dropping like its supposed to, lrading me to believe that the omp might be failing. so if i run premix at 1 oz a gallon, and if the omp still works, ill have way too much oil in the engine
if i put less and my omp DOES fail, my engine isnt getting proper lubrication and bam, blown

i guess id rather smoke a little than have a blown engine

prolly will leave the omp in tho

Premiumriceonly

iTrader: (5)

what do guys do on s5s? they throw a CEL if the pumps removed. and i dont wanna leave the OMP hooked up and hangin there?

gracer7-rx7

iTrader: (16)

Oil injection is load/rpm driven. It could easily be that you just aren't able to see it. I know I could never really see a drop in oil levels from oil injection alone unless it was at the 3k mile oil change interval.

Leave the OMP alone. Premix if you want but over oiling can cause carbon buildup so don't overdue it. Maybe 4 ounces per fill up.

Premiumriceonly

iTrader: (5)

thats true but when the time comes when the omp fails ill end up not adding ENOUGH lubrication and cause damage to the engine

gracer7-rx7

iTrader: (16)

OMPs rarely fail. When they do, the ECU generally puts the car in limp mode.

To be blatantly honest with you, you don't have enough knowledge to make that determination on your own. If you are that worried about it, whey not have a good rotary shop take a look at it.

Premiumriceonly

iTrader: (5)

That's not what 90% of people on here have to say
But thanks for being blatantly honest

MAD MR RX7

i just use like an old spray bottle that has measurements on the side of it. i do 120ml of 2 stroke oil to 60 litres of gas, i use this one from shell, theres heaps of other better ones but they cost abit more. its alot better doing a mix by urself as the oil that the motor sprays into the motor is the burnt oil from the motor and all the burnt carbon stuff from the oil. thats alright but then why would you want dirty oil to lube the seals right. hope this helps

Premiumriceonly

iTrader: (5)

Thanks man
first helpful thing I've heard

2Lucky2tha7

iTrader: (3)

Personally, in your case, I would suggest leaving the omp in place and using 1/2 oz. per gallon of 2-stroke premix in the tank. I've been running premix @ 1oz per gallon for about 3 yrs. now in my '91. I started off by replacing the oil injector "nozzles" with bolts (cut to proper length of course) along with covering up the front cover on the engine and shoving the omp next to the charcoal canister. After doing this for over a year, I eventually replaced the stock ecu with a megasquirt. Ever since then I have been premixing. If I could have done my rebuild over again, I would have used an s4 front cover in place of my s5 and gotten an s4 omp along with the accompanying parts for my throttle body to operate it as well as the RA OMP adaptor which allows you to run premix from a separate container. Why you may ask? Because I am forced to have fuel injected on decel (I can't turn on the overrun fuel cut in my megasquirt maps) and therefore causes surging on decel --mostly under 3500 rpms. It's extremely annoying to me. When I pulled apart my last engine due to low compression, I immediately saw what decelerating without fuel did to it as I could see by all the massive grooving in the rotor housings. Typically when I decelerated, it would range anywhere about 3-6 seconds. I guess the question would remain as to how long you can decelerate until the film of premix gets scraped/burned away when running premix only and no OMP. I unfortunately can't go back because my omp passage ways in my front cover are literally filled with RTV which makes it permanent (unless I replace the front cover of course.)
Just figured I'd share from experience.

2Lucky2tha7

iTrader: (3)

Something I forgot:
RA sells not only the adaptor but an adjuster as well. In your circumstance, you can buy the 3rd gen omp adaptor (the later model 89-91 2nd gens and the 3rd gens have the same bolt pattern for the omp) as well as the adjuster. You will no longer need the stock omp this way and can keep it plugged in and off to the side. The adjuster will allow for it to inject oil from the separate outside container at a "fixed" ratio and injects more or less according to rpm. If my front cover wasn't "blocked off"and if I knew about it before I finished my last rebuild, then I would have bought these 2 parts a long time ago.

twinsinside

iTrader: (34)

Personally I'd recommend listening to the guys that have a lot of experience in this area. Look up Aaron's posts, he knows his stuff.

If your pump were to fail, you'd go in limp mode and know immediately.

If your pump is failing, they're very cheap to get used ones. New ones are stupid expensive that is true.

Most likely, if there is a problem with your OMP system, it is not your pump. There could be a problem with your nozzles or the OMP oil lines. They are plastic and get brittle and can crack. You can get stainless steel ones for about the same price as the stock plastic ones if that is your problem.

The OMP puts the oil directly on your apex seals, premix doesn't put the oil directly where it's needed the most.

Ironically disabling your OMP may induce the problem you are trying to avoid.

Premiumriceonly

iTrader: (5)

huh maybe i will look into that adapter with the external reservoir 2lucky
the price from RA is only about 90 bucks so its not gonna rape my wallet
thanks for the input man

2Lucky2tha7

iTrader: (3)

Lastly, to make a long story short:
From the factory, the s5 electric omp does not inject as much oil into the engine as the s4 mechanical ones do. An unfortunate flaw on Mazda's part which was the result of emissions standards, etc. --(I can't remember all the details). I completely forget the difference in oil/ fuel ratios (best way to put it), but it's quite a difference between the s4 and s5. I found out during a phone conversation I had almost 4 years ago with someone (I can't remember who) that raced rx7's for years with Jim Downing (for those who know of him). Basically, the main thing I can remember is that the lack of lubrication from the omp's (especially the s5's) were the biggest weak-point of the rotary. The advice I remember was "either run a mechanical omp and almost double the feed, add premix (about 1/2 oz per gallon), or run straight premix at 1oz per gallon with no omp." That's why I mentioned using the RA adjuster as well as the adaptor. You'll notice how more s5 engines have destroyed themselves in shorter order than the s4's.