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New to Rotary; Upgrading Radiator on my FD, looking for Part/Brand recommendations
Alright guys still learning this so not going to be the best post, display wise, but I will do my best.
Quick Intro: I've been reading up on the forums and have learned that poor oil maintenance and poor cooling are the main causes of failures for our beloved Rotary engines. That being said I just purchased my first FD and it has a stock (not sure if original from 25 years ago, doubt it) radiator. Because of snow and some small repairs and upgrade, I have only driven her about 20 mins 1-2 miles; In that time I didn't see any overheating or cooling issues but obviously not enough time to judge it as safe. The FD has been converted to single turbo, with an FMIC, and the Radiator looks old so I decided to just upgrade the Radiator to prevent any issues and to have better overall cooling performance. I looked into the Radiator brand recommendations here already and decided to go with the KOYO N FLO radiator. FD is going to be street/highway driven but pushed; might go to the track in the future. I'm in Colorado Springs so we definitely don't have high heat weather issues, but I'd rather be on the safe side
Now the reason I made this thread is for the related parts, what is recommended to be replaced, and what brands to go with. Also any suggestions and tips regarding installation would be appreciated, although I found a nice thread that Banzai Racing made for KOYO installation so I'm not completely in the dark. https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-generati...-tips-1107155/
First thing I would like to ask is if the recommended replacement parts are any different for our Dorito engines vs Regular cars and piston engine? I know when replacing the radiator on a regular car you want to replace/check these parts:
Thermostat (W/ Gasket obviously)
Hoses (& Clamps obviously)
Water pump **Is it recommended to replace these regardless if they are damaged or not on rotary engines
Antifreeze(obviously)
Radiator Cap (& Cap for ATS in our case)
Radiator fan assembly (for the purpose of the upgraded KOYO RAD)
Anything else that I should look at or replace?
Now I would like to see if I can get brand recommendations for the parts, the main concern for me is the Thermostat. I plan on running a regular temp 180F thermostat. In the thread, FD3S big fat cooling thread: https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-generati...thread-571088/ It recommends the OEM Mazda thermostat, but that thread was made back in 2006. Looking into it; I have seen a few threads dated between 2009-2014 saying Mazda changed their thermostats and now they are really faulty and have been having issues, but I haven't been able to find something a little more recent. Can anyone speak from recent experience on this? Is there another brand I should go with instead of the OEM?
For the Hoses what is recommended? Should I stick strictly with OEM ,go with something cheaper from the parts store like Gates/Dayco etc, or do I spend the extra dough and go with the Silicone performance hoses?
Water pump: If I do change it what is the go-to recommended brand for this? Strictly OEM, is there a quality replacement going around for less, or do I go for a performance name brand one? I know from experience with regular engines to avoid the china ones at the parts stores so I would especially avoid that for my FD.
Radiator Caps & ATS cap: What should I go with for the Radiator Cap at the Thermostat housing, brand and PSI? Third for the ATS is there a standard cap they all use or is that depending on the ATS that I have, mine has been replaced with an aluminum one, also what PSI for the ATS cap? Part #s would be appreciated.
Antifreeze, after reading up on it I see best is to stick with the OEM FL22, I know my local Mazda sells the FL22 prediluted, not sure if they have the concentrate. My question here is about a thread I read about Ford selling the same exact coolant just relabeled for Ford part #VC-10-A but at a lower cost, can anyone confirm this? Also is there other recommendations for Antifreeze or is the FL22 the standard go-to?
For an installation tip, do we use silicone in any of the cooling system parts, or are they solid with the gaskets?
Finally, what do you guys think of keeping the stock fan assembly with the KOYO RAD N-FLO, will I be fine or should I go with something aftermarket/performance?
I included a couple pics so you can see my set up, not the best detail to focus on the Radiator but they're the only ones I have saved in my system. I'll take some better pics and upload if needed for installation tips and suggestions. I know it's a lot of questions here, so I don't expect every one of them to be answered, but I would appreciate any questions answered here. Thanks in advance to everyone!
P.S.
I've seen quite a few times mentioned in threads a guy named Roy or Ray that works at a Mazda dealer and can ship parts, seems like he's the guru when it comes to OEM parts, any chance someone knows if he's still in the business and I can get his contact info?
Last edited by JohnsJDM,Julie; 03-02-18 at 02:25 AM.
Reason: Posted one of my questions in error
*FL-22 is coolant that doesn’t have silicates or borates. IIRC the Zerex Asian coolant meets those specs and is available at most chain parts stores. IMO it’s as important to change it regularly...maybe bi-annually.
*Change the water pump if it makes noise or starts to weep...just like any other pump. I wouldn’t change it otherwise. But it should come with a gasket when/if the time comes. OEM only IMO.
*New caps, belts and hoses are fine for a baseline and a good idea. OEM .9 bar cap.
*Nothing better than the OEM fan/shroud assembly. Keep it.
*OEM t-stat, with jiggle-pin...has the gasket.
*Dual oil coolers if you don’t already have them.
*Upholstery foam to plug any gaps around the radiator face is cheap and effective.
*Consider a simple water injection system for addition cooling in the future. It also has the added benefits of reducing carbon deposits and knock control.
P.S.
I've seen quite a few times mentioned in threads a guy named Roy or Ray that works at a Mazda dealer and can ship parts, seems like he's the guru when it comes to OEM parts, any chance someone knows if he's still in the business and I can get his contact info?
Ray Crowe. He used to work a local Mazda parts counter, but is now solo. He can still get good deals, but he has no control over shipping. That said, his knowledge is more valuable than his prices. His email is Crowe.Ray@aol.com
I would go OEM for the hoses. IRP and Mazmart sell upgraded pumps, but they probably aren't needed if you aren't tracking your car.
Also, make sure you have a temp gauge that isn't stock
Edit: Not sure Ray can source JDM parts if you need those
*FL-22 is coolant that doesn’t have silicates or borates. IIRC the Zerex Asian coolant meets those specs and is available at most chain parts stores. IMO it’s as important to change it regularly...maybe bi-annually.
*Change the water pump if it makes noise or starts to weep...just like any other pump. I wouldn’t change it otherwise. But it should come with a gasket when/if the time comes. OEM only IMO.
*New caps, belts and hoses are fine for a baseline and a good idea. OEM .9 bar cap.
*Nothing better than the OEM fan/shroud assembly. Keep it.
*OEM t-stat, with jiggle-pin...has the gasket.
*Dual oil coolers if you don’t already have them.
*Upholstery foam to plug any gaps around the radiator face is cheap and effective.
*Consider a simple water injection system for addition cooling in the future. It also has the added benefits of reducing carbon deposits and knock control.
Awesome thank you, it looks like OEM is the way to go for most parts!
*I have one big oil cooler; I've seen the 2 small oil cooler set up, is that better than one large one? I'll post a pic when I get a chance so you can see how it's set up.
*Didn't know about putting upholstery foam on the Radiator, I'll look for a thread on that, by any chance do you have photos or links so I can see what material I am looking for and what parts of the Radiator to apply it to?
*Thanks for the water injection recommendation,I am new to Rotaries so I will look for a thread with more info and instructions to set up a water injection system.
Ray Crowe. He used to work a local Mazda parts counter, but is now solo. He can still get good deals, but he has no control over shipping. That said, his knowledge is more valuable than his prices. His email is Crowe.Ray@aol.com
I would go OEM for the hoses. IRP and Mazmart sell upgraded pumps, but they probably aren't needed if you aren't tracking your car.
Also, make sure you have a temp gauge that isn't stock
Edit: Not sure Ray can source JDM parts if you need those
Thanks man I really appreciate it. I hope I can still get a hold of him, his knowledge is what I am looking for, I have seen issues with the new Mazda thermostats so I wanted to ask him about that.
Great, yea I am going to go OEM for most of the parts. I don't plan on tracking the car so you're right; I will most likely stick with OEM for the Water pump if I do need to change it.
Yea I do have a aftermarket Temp gauge that actually marks the temp, not like the stock one.
Thanks again for Rays contact info and all your help!
Awesome thank you, it looks like OEM is the way to go for most parts!
*I have one big oil cooler; I've seen the 2 small oil cooler set up, is that better than one large one? I'll post a pic when I get a chance so you can see how it's set up.
*Didn't know about putting upholstery foam on the Radiator, I'll look for a thread on that, by any chance do you have photos or links so I can see what material I am looking for and what parts of the Radiator to apply it to?
*Thanks for the water injection recommendation,I am new to Rotaries so I will look for a thread with more info and instructions to set up a water injection system.
I suppose it’s fin area that decides effectiveness so one large aftermarket cooler is probably fine. These cars were originally equipped with a single (Touring, PEP, Base) or dual coolers on the ‘R’ models. I think I read somewhere that about 20% of engine cooling is done by the oil.
As for the foam I’m not sure I have a picture. But most fabric stores will carry it. I think I bought a 1/2 yard of 3” thick. Just use big shears or an electric knife to cut it into appropriate size pieces to stuff into any gaps around the radiator or ducting. Looks like The object is to keep as high pressure as possible on the radiator face. Probably not as straightforward on your car as mine but there you go.
There’s an Auxillary Injection section on the forum with several good stickys. It’s ALOT of info that can be a little daunting if you’re a small brain like me with no technical background. Maybe for that reason I’m a proponent of the simple boost-activated systems. I have a how-to thread in that section if you care to search at some point. But there are many ways to go based on your goals and budget.
I suppose it’s fin area that decides effectiveness so one large aftermarket cooler is probably fine. These cars were originally equipped with a single (Touring, PEP, Base) or dual coolers on the ‘R’ models. I think I read somewhere that about 20% of engine cooling is done by the oil.
As for the foam I’m not sure I have a picture. But most fabric stores will carry it. I think I bought a 1/2 yard of 3” thick. Just use big shears or an electric knife to cut it into appropriate size pieces to stuff into any gaps around the radiator or ducting. Looks like The object is to keep as high pressure as possible on the radiator face. Probably not as straightforward on your car as mine but there you go.
There’s an Auxillary Injection section on the forum with several good stickys. It’s ALOT of info that can be a little daunting if you’re a small brain like me with no technical background. Maybe for that reason I’m a proponent of the simple boost-activated systems. I have a how-to thread in that section if you care to search at some point. But there are many ways to go based on your goals and budget.
I was able to take a pic and Yea it's a pretty big oil cooler so I think I'll be fine, but I will keep an eye on the oil temp. My FD is a type R, so it could have came with dual set up but it could've been modified by the previous owner.
Ok I'll try to find a pic so I can get a better idea of where to stuff it, but thanks I at least know what material and size I'm looking for.
Yea I thought it would take some time of researching to fully understand that, I'll look through the forums and I'll also look for the how-to thread you created.
I was able to take a pic and Yea it's a pretty big oil cooler so I think I'll be fine, but I will keep an eye on the oil temp. My FD is a type R, so it could have came with dual set up but it could've been modified by the previous owner.
Ok I'll try to find a pic so I can get a better idea of where to stuff it, but thanks I at least know what material and size I'm looking for.
Yea I thought it would take some time of researching to fully understand that, I'll look through the forums and I'll also look for the how-to thread you created.
Thanks again for your help brotha!
If that is a picture oif the oil cooler, im afraid you are wrong From what i can tell its the A/C condenser. The OEM oil cooler placement and air intakes are here:
*Didn't know about putting upholstery foam on the Radiator, I'll look for a thread on that, by any chance do you have photos or links so I can see what material I am looking for and what parts of the Radiator to apply it to?
Wow thanks man this Information is gold! This is perfect, thank you for taking your time to post this brotha!
Haha man the sales manager that I bought the car from told me that was the oil cooler but I feel like such an idiot lol, I just bought her and its my first FD, first rotary and turbo for that matter so I'm still learning where everything is. Thanks for clearing that up, I'm going to look if I have the 2 oil coolers now.
I checked out your thread and man first thing, congratulations you have a beautiful FD!! and you are doing everything so clean and detailed, keep it up man I'm really impressed and love the near stock 99 spec look I will be following you. I see what you did with the Raditator and where you put the insulation foam again perfect man I really appreciate all your help!!
03-01-18, 04:40 AM
From what i can tell its the A/C condenser. The OEM oil cooler placement and air intakes are here:
