My N/A Performance Project (Idea)
11-01-09, 09:54 AM
#1
My N/A Performance Project (Idea)
Well, I've finally had enough of the turbo set-up on my FC so I've decided to go N/A, and because this is a track only car I wanted to make as much HP as my intake and exhaust will let me. So, I wanted to run some ideas past you guy so I can see if I'm headed in the right direction.
First off I have a S5TII engine to start with, so I plan to rebuild with S5 N/A rotors, Full Bridgeport intake, race port exhaust, and carbon apex seals from Racing Beat. I have a friend that builds exhaust manifolds and will be doing something similar to the RB header but with equal length primaries to a 3" single exhaust, something like the rotaryshack header I guess. I have a Haltech E6K to run it all, and Chris Ludwig to tune it. 550cc injectors all around to fuel it, and the stock ignition as well.
Let me know what you think, and let me know what else I need to look into and what do you think for HP? E85 isn't out of the question either and, I like criticism as long as its helpfull.
thanks
First off I have a S5TII engine to start with, so I plan to rebuild with S5 N/A rotors, Full Bridgeport intake, race port exhaust, and carbon apex seals from Racing Beat. I have a friend that builds exhaust manifolds and will be doing something similar to the RB header but with equal length primaries to a 3" single exhaust, something like the rotaryshack header I guess. I have a Haltech E6K to run it all, and Chris Ludwig to tune it. 550cc injectors all around to fuel it, and the stock ignition as well.
Let me know what you think, and let me know what else I need to look into and what do you think for HP? E85 isn't out of the question either and, I like criticism as long as its helpfull.
thanks
11-02-09, 02:34 AM
#3
are you going to use stock intake manifold? if so, you'll be VERY limited...
also, look into oil uprgrades like porting the oil gallies, a pickup, baffle, webber jet in e-shaft, ect... heavy track use at high RPM will need these.
is this for road race/scca style track, or drag strip. the set ups will be very different for each. look into rotor beveling and balancing. lets the ports open earlier and close later due to cuts on the rotor edges. Rx8 rotors come stock with this if you want to search for pics to see what i mean. the amount of things that can be done are endless, what are you trying to do though so we can better help you decide...
also, look into oil uprgrades like porting the oil gallies, a pickup, baffle, webber jet in e-shaft, ect... heavy track use at high RPM will need these.
is this for road race/scca style track, or drag strip. the set ups will be very different for each. look into rotor beveling and balancing. lets the ports open earlier and close later due to cuts on the rotor edges. Rx8 rotors come stock with this if you want to search for pics to see what i mean. the amount of things that can be done are endless, what are you trying to do though so we can better help you decide...
11-02-09, 07:17 PM
#5
are you going to use stock intake manifold? if so, you'll be VERY limited...
also, look into oil uprgrades like porting the oil gallies, a pickup, baffle, webber jet in e-shaft, ect... heavy track use at high RPM will need these.
is this for road race/scca style track, or drag strip. the set ups will be very different for each. look into rotor beveling and balancing. lets the ports open earlier and close later due to cuts on the rotor edges. Rx8 rotors come stock with this if you want to search for pics to see what i mean. the amount of things that can be done are endless, what are you trying to do though so we can better help you decide...
also, look into oil uprgrades like porting the oil gallies, a pickup, baffle, webber jet in e-shaft, ect... heavy track use at high RPM will need these.
is this for road race/scca style track, or drag strip. the set ups will be very different for each. look into rotor beveling and balancing. lets the ports open earlier and close later due to cuts on the rotor edges. Rx8 rotors come stock with this if you want to search for pics to see what i mean. the amount of things that can be done are endless, what are you trying to do though so we can better help you decide...
This car is for track days with NASA and other open track LLC's. My goal is to make decent power so that I'm not passed by the SpecE30 guys or the PTD and PTE cars. I basically what an engine i can beat the hell out of to the tune of 180-200 whp. I know this power is easily aquired with a turbo, even a stock turbo at low boost, but I hate having to keep an eye on the boost while i'm on track.
Can you point me in the right direction, will racing beat have something like this?
11-02-09, 11:17 PM
#6
if you dont mind using a carb, webbers with a racing beat IDA manifold with minimal port work will get you over 200whp...
you can achieve over 200 with stock manifolds, but i would still go with the webber set-up.
by the way, are you staying with a 6-port and 6 port manifolds? you should think about using a 4 port block with 9.7 rotors. plenty of people use 4 port plates with a street port and get around 210-230 whp on stock ported manifolds. no need for a bridge or PP if your only looking to get 200 area...
you can achieve over 200 with stock manifolds, but i would still go with the webber set-up.
by the way, are you staying with a 6-port and 6 port manifolds? you should think about using a 4 port block with 9.7 rotors. plenty of people use 4 port plates with a street port and get around 210-230 whp on stock ported manifolds. no need for a bridge or PP if your only looking to get 200 area...
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11-02-09, 11:29 PM
#8
by the way, are you staying with a 6-port and 6 port manifolds? you should think about using a 4 port block with 9.7 rotors. plenty of people use 4 port plates with a street port and get around 210-230 whp on stock ported manifolds. no need for a bridge or PP if your only looking to get 200 area...
11-02-09, 11:31 PM
#9
if you're only looking for 180 to 200 out of a bridge, i'd have to ask why bother? you said you don't want to monitor boost, but when all is said and done, i'd have to think extracting 200 out of a T2 setup has got to yield a better torque curve than doing so with an N/A bridge. plus you already have a jump on the parts you'll need. it's just what i'd do.
anyway, it's your car. you can get and IDA-type EFI setup from several places between here and Australia. i went with a TWM throttle and a Weber manifold from Mazdatrix, but as i said, you have other options.
anyway, it's your car. you can get and IDA-type EFI setup from several places between here and Australia. i went with a TWM throttle and a Weber manifold from Mazdatrix, but as i said, you have other options.
11-03-09, 06:47 AM
#11
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I think he may be saying that 180 - 200 whp is the minimum he wants to get but im sure hes not going to complain if he gets more. And whats unreliable about a bridgeport, if its done right theres no reason he should have any reliability issues.
11-03-09, 06:31 PM
#14
if you're only looking for 180 to 200 out of a bridge, i'd have to ask why bother? you said you don't want to monitor boost, but when all is said and done, i'd have to think extracting 200 out of a T2 setup has got to yield a better torque curve than doing so with an N/A bridge. plus you already have a jump on the parts you'll need. it's just what i'd do.
Plus in my fourth year of HPDE's I've began to not like my turbo set up because of the lack of throttle responce and turbo lag. I've spent a couple weekends driving a Spec E30 and had a blast all be it slower, I felt faster in that car because when i stepped on it, the engine was there, no waiting. I figured i could get that feeling or better from my car with a different motor configuration.
11-04-09, 07:39 AM
#17
My turbo is a bit of a mutt. the compressor is a 62-1 wheel cut into a T04E compressor housing housing with a water and oil cooled CHRA and a P-trim turbine wheel with a .81A/R housing. THe manifold is an HKS cast unit with a 40mm HKS wastegate, nothing special but it was good to the tune of 335whp at 12psi, and on 110 Octane and 21psi it felt like at least 380whp, i never did dyno it on racegas.
11-06-09, 10:53 AM
#18
Scott Howard
I think you have the right idea. I'm getting 230-236whp with timing between 22-24* with 91 premix. I have a 4 port bridgeport with a stock 3rd gen manifold and Motec FI. The car makes peak Hp at 8000rpm because the intake is less than ideal, but I have a good usable power range. I've been told 260whp might be possible by switching to a larger short runner intake.
Good luck on your build. What NASA region do you run?
Good luck on your build. What NASA region do you run?
11-07-09, 07:02 PM
#19
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I know exactly what your saying with the turbo setup and its still a possibility, and it may be the cheapest and easiest way to get back on track for less money in the long run. I just really liked the idea of running around the track with a rock solid (no worries) engine.
Plus in my fourth year of HPDE's I've began to not like my turbo set up because of the lack of throttle responce and turbo lag. I've spent a couple weekends driving a Spec E30 and had a blast all be it slower, I felt faster in that car because when i stepped on it, the engine was there, no waiting. I figured i could get that feeling or better from my car with a different motor configuration.
Plus in my fourth year of HPDE's I've began to not like my turbo set up because of the lack of throttle responce and turbo lag. I've spent a couple weekends driving a Spec E30 and had a blast all be it slower, I felt faster in that car because when i stepped on it, the engine was there, no waiting. I figured i could get that feeling or better from my car with a different motor configuration.
......not to mention E30s are fun lil cars to throw around =]
11-11-09, 05:10 PM
#20
I think you have the right idea. I'm getting 230-236whp with timing between 22-24* with 91 premix. I have a 4 port bridgeport with a stock 3rd gen manifold and Motec FI. The car makes peak Hp at 8000rpm because the intake is less than ideal, but I have a good usable power range. I've been told 260whp might be possible by switching to a larger short runner intake.
Good luck on your build. What NASA region do you run?
Good luck on your build. What NASA region do you run?
I'm very interested in buying one if I decide to go wheel to wheel racing.
11-25-09, 02:54 PM
#21
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There is a guy in the Classifieds under race parts selling a 13B manifold and Mikuni carb. Plenty for about 200 whp. Even a Holley works!
gd
12-11-09, 04:49 PM
#22
Hey, My plan is a N/A Large Street Port in my GTUs. Currently have just a Spare 6 Port Block no real manfolds (have the 6pi Exhaust thats all on the spare motor) i have a Complete (blown, Low Compression) S5 N/A in my GTUs right now. Is there possibly a way to Port the NA and Keep the Stock ECU with Larger TII Injectors? Adjust the Timing and at least get by til i can afford a ECU?
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