Lit

well i have had a going lean problem.... i tracked it down after 2 weeks of trouble shooting my fuel system to the secondaries.

when i tested the spray pattern they passed the visual check. cone shaped and even... well i preplaced them anyway.

problem solved! it fixed it.

Well here is the weird part:

i replaced the bad injectors 2 days ago and now this pair are doing the same thing.

i am 100% sure replacing them fixed it. we went out and street tuned the car and it was great... then today it has slowly killed the new set of 1600s.
it started going leaner under boost then tuned for the day before..... by 9pm this evening it was back to going super duper lean as soon as it passed the staging point. 17:1 a/f



no i had to add ALOT of fuel to tune for 12psi... im thinking that maybe its frying the injectors due to high miliseconds.... and im running high miliseconds of injector time to compensate for the fpr not doing its job... maybe? jesus i wish i have a fuel pressure gauge i could see while im boosting.

sleeperfc

man that was my post!!! im at a friends. poo. /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ my problems.

Bad2ndgen

Its more likely the injector drivers that are heating up... What are your duty cycles like?

sleeperfc

umm i dunno. i didnt look at it when i was tuning. i know i have fuel for 500whp so i didnt even check it.

this sucks.

what do you mean the drivers are heating up? i mean..... like they are burning out... or what.


i can get another injector driver? i think i saw something in the haltech tuning maps about ectra injector drivers or something. so ummm im so lost.

Bad2ndgen

If you are running 100% duty cycle for extended periods of time you can burn out the drivers...

sleeperfc

well that wouldnt explain how i burnt out the first pair. that map was setup for 8psi. not using all that much fuel at all.

or how putting a new pair fixed the problem... for 2 days.

Wankel7

maybe it is something with your wiring at the injectors. Since you did move those wires around to swap the injectors.

I would try this....

Swap your injector plugs around. Put your secondary plugs on your primary injectors. And see if it runs. That would troubleshoot the injector drivers and the wiring.

James

sleeperfc

well i think its the ecu. im gonna check a couple last things... then im sending it off to let them play rugby with it.

any idea on turn around time for a e6k?

RETed

They normally hang onto it for 1 to 2 weeks.
This was the old management though, and I haven't had any experience since they changed owners.


-Ted

Claudio RX-7

iTrader: (1)

Two things come to mind with this scenario, first, i would ask how clean is your fuel tank, how old is you fuel filter, i have seen something similar like this, where the tank is so dirty the filter just cant clean out the fuel enough and the injectors get so dirty they flow A LOT less than what they should, thus, forcing you to add more mS to the base fuel map.

The other thing i see is that you might have a voltage problem and you arent powering your fuel system acorrdingly. Have you checked the voltage readings when this happens? If voltage drops bellow 12-11v you've got aproblem.

But, i would take your injectors (dont throw the bad ones away) to get cleaned and balanced on a fuel injector cleaning machine (like RC Eng. does) they can verify if they are so dirty that their flow rate might be compromised.

sleeperfc

well the filter has been replaced the same time i replaced the pump. that was my first steps to try and figure out the problem.

when it does lean out i watched the volt gauge in my turbotimer and it dose not show a drop in volts.... i have taken datalongs and they do not show a drop in volts at the haltech.

I tested the injector clips and they show an even 12v or so with the key on and the car not running. they are all powered from the same source so it seems like the primarys would feel it too.


im getting to my wits end here.... i dont think i cloggeda new pair of injectors in 2 days. Im going to make 100% sure my fuel pressure is doing what it needs to with my own eyes... then after that.. the only thing left is to ship the haltech off.
$75 shipping one way!
plus what ever they charge for the work.
then $75 back.
So this ius gonna cost me $300+ to do.

Claudio RX-7

iTrader: (1)

What kind of plugs and what kind of boost levels are you running? could you email me your map and one of those datalogs that you know the miss happened?

Let me know,

sleeperfc

i have had a few people look at the map and logs. there is nothing out of place...

ill take another datalog when i get my fuel pressure gauge rigged up to where i can see it.

I will take any help i can get... i dont have $300 to send this thing off.


the simple fact that putting in a new pair fo 1600s fixed it, even for 10 min or what ever cuts out alot of ideas of what could be doing it. i need to test the 1600s for resistance and see if they are way off or something. they still spray and have a good even cone shape... but maybe they are fried and the resistance is way off now.

ill make sure to post all new info as it comes in and let you guys check it out one more time before i ship this thing off.

a7r

I can only imagine the 1600s would be fried, if you're driving them with too much current causing them to heat up. I'd hook up an oscilloscope at the injector, and take a look at the waveform it's being driven by. Use Ohm's law, and you'll be able to figure out the power consumption of the injector.

Remember V=IR, and P=IV.

sleeperfc

but your missing the point.

the injectors were slowly giving less and less fuel.... i turned up the tuning after to compensate.. or an attempt to anyway.

the first pair that died or what ever they are doing were never abused with high MS or duty cycle. i was only running 8psi and the tuning map was made by bdc. I have plenty of fuel for the 270hp it was making at 8psi... soooo why did they die the same way the second pair did?

Claudio RX-7

iTrader: (1)

That further supports my theory, they do that when they start to get clogged and that is exactly what happens. If you messure their resistance with the ohm meter and they are messuring what they should, they arent fried and just need cleaning.

sleeperfc

even if only a few days old they could become clogged that fast? and not only clogged.... i mean they still show a even cone shaped spray pattern.

but your right i need to test the resistance.

What in the world could cause an injector to become gummed up in a day and reduce the flow rate?

im using premix... same stuff other people use with no problem. called costal from autozone. its tcw3 and i always run 1oz per gallon of fuel. The fuel filter has been replaced after the first pair of injectors "went out" and before the new pair were installed.


hmm more stuff to think about.

a7r

Yah, I don't think you're understanding what I'm getting at. I'm not talking about how much time the injector is on, I'm talking about how much current is going through the injector while it's on. Most/all ECUs capable of operating with low-impedance injectors give high initial current to open the injector, and drop to a lower current after the opening has occured (usually by using a PWM strategy). If you didn't do this, then an injector that had 2 ohms of impedance would (at least initially) dissipate almost 100 watts at 14 volts.

What I'm saying you might be frying your injectors over time, and if it were me looking at the problem I'd start with checking fuel flow, and then I'd hook up an oscilloscope.

Cheers.