stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

so story is that i bought computer/harness from mr ludwig. fabulous btw. not a single complaint.

im not at all saavy with these computers so i hired a guy to tune my car. i brought it in barely running from a base map i put on and got back a slightly better running car.

this car is mostly track with very very little road driving. maybe just to car wash or something.

i run on the track in vegas and am living in salt lake. the biggest problem i am having is that up here, it runs fine for what i have. but in vegas, it bogs and sputters as soon as i get to third gear.

the dyno sheets show that im making 360hp at 6500rpm with a 10.5ish afr.(numbers may be slightly off, only going by memory).

i can post my dyno sheets with the map if requested

my theory is that once i drop in to lower elevations, the afr gets so rich that the car is no longer able to run.

i tried talking to the tune shop to get it resolved but apparently they are mad that i am not satisfied with the tune and want nothing to do with me. they are also the only game in town.

my question and help is this.

if i were to upload my map, would someone be willing to go through the entire thing and clean it up where it needs it? i would pay a nominal fee for this.

i understand that i need dyno time to completely optimize the map and plan on doing that when in vegas but dont want to drop another 500$ for a questionable tune and want to minimize the time needed on the dyno. id like something that may not be perfect but will not blow up my car and let it run reasonably well.

all issues i have:
really hard to start when cold. it kind of just slowly chugs to life after 20-30 seconds of cranking
will not start at all if coolant temp is above 75c or so
i think o2 correction is too great. completely flooding out and impossible to keep running even long enough to load on a trailer when my o2 senor buggered and died. problem solved when i replaced senor but i dont want that problem again.

finally, how would i post the map on here

thanks for any help. i really need someone to hold my hand with this.

specs on engine
20b with t76 running on 9lb wg spring(no boost controller)
haltech ps2k
innovate lc-1 wired into haltech
3" dp to dual 2.5 tips.
stock ports

550cc pri/1600cc sec fuel injectors @42psi base on bosch 044 pump

beefhole

iTrader: (29)

Post the map first. Figure it out!

ZIP the map file and save it
Go to advanced mode when replying, and click "manage attachments". Then pick the map ZIP file, and upload it. It will be here for all of us to see.

C. Ludwig

iTrader: (27)

We do support what we sell. Email me.
ludwigmotorsports@insightbb.com

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

attached the tune that is on the car now

dyno graph reads
min tq 130
max tq 317
avg 249
min hp 64
max hp 361
avg hp226
afr min 9.81
max 11.34
avg 10.50

thanks for all the help guys. if you need more info or anything, ill email you chris. really appreciate it.

beefhole

iTrader: (29)

I'm not an expert, but I've looked at many maps before. I can see your coolant temp correction looks way too low compared to everything I've ever downloaded. Most are zero by ~180 degrees F, yours are already zero at 100! That could effect starting as you need extra fuel (and that map is adding a percentage) when the engine is cold. Are you sure the car wasn't dying because it was going too lean? A cold engine when lean will die out instantly, and it doesn't have to be by that much.

The base timing is a little weird under vacuum, maybe someone else can chime in on that.

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

i dont know. it may be too lean

i know when it finally is running its belching fuel smoke out the back and the oil loads up with fuel fast. it also idles at around 2k rpm rock solid. all throttle adjustments are as closed as they can be. not very much vacuum to leak from but i still didnt find any leaks.

and if i give it any throttle when cranking, it kills off any progress made during that attempt.

beefhole

iTrader: (29)

I think you should double check the timing... always.

If it's idling at 2000, that's terrible. And it looks like there is a ton of fuel in those maps, like 3MS under vacuum. The fuel maps don't look smooth at all either.

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

timing is dead on. i checked it about 20 times. i guess checking it one more wont hurt.

RENESISFD

iTrader: (13)

Does the car still run if you put your hand over the throttle body?

Are you using an IAC?

I had an LIM leak so bad that with the throttle body closed the car was still idling at 1400 RPM.

You check to see where the leaks are coming from? Perhaps around the injectors or the LIM?

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

ill try blocking off the tb today. no iac. i sprayed the injectors and lim and everywhere else i could think of with starter fluid and no change in rpm

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

i pulled my ic pipe off to get to the throttle body.
started the car up and put my hand over the silicon elbow right in front of the throttle body.
it sucked my hand into the elbow and collapsed it; the car died. still had enough vacuum that it took another 10 seconds for enough to be released to get my hand free.

C. Ludwig

iTrader: (27)

re: idle You have an issue with an air leak or throttle mis-adjusted. No amount of timing will cause the engine to idle that high.

If you have no air leaks passed the throttle body, then the throttle blades are being held open or the air bleed is cranked wide open. Disconnect the throttle cable and see what happens. Also check the throttle stops and dash pot adjustment (if you still have it).

Looked at your map. Fuel is pretty jacked. Looks like they started working on it and just gave up. Timing is decent. Compensation maps are funky.

arghx

iTrader: (3)

Use a boost/vacuum leak pressure tester with an air compressor to verify no air leaks in the system. Until you're completely sure that's fixed you'll never get the fuel right.

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

i completely unscrewed the dashpot and nothing.

on the tb screws, which way should they by? the top and the one underneath are completely maxed but im not sure if i went the right way on them. also my idle air control is still on the car but not plugged in. would that create a leak?

ive tried with no throttle cable; still high idle.

ill dig into it more tomorrow

thanks everyone for your help and suggestions. couldnt do this without you

beefhole

iTrader: (29)

If the screws are maxed out, turn them the other way, see what happens. Righty-raise, lefty-lower (the idle).

C. Ludwig

iTrader: (27)

Not sure on the 20B throttle body, but the air bleeds on all the others are righty = lower. Guess beefhole is talking about the throttle stops though.

C. Ludwig

iTrader: (27)

This.

Still think its an issue with throttle stops/cables and or air bleeds though. Has to be a heck of a big leak to idle at 2k.

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

yeah i am going to try and max them out the other way tonight and see where it gets me.

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

ok spent the last few days working on the idle and it is now sorted.

i stripped the throttle body and made a block off plate for the iac. i re sealed the lim to the block, uim to lim, tb to uim and put it all together. it took some fiddling but now my idle is nice and low and smooth. sounds like a normal car now.

C. Ludwig

iTrader: (27)

Now you just need to get the fuel trimmed out and the compensation maps squared away and you'll be good to go. I'll send you a map this week with good compensation maps.

What's the elevation difference between Vegas and where the car was originally tuned? The MAP sensor should account for any difference, but things never seem to work as well as they should.

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

Im (salt lake) at about 4200ft. Vegas is 2100 I think.

thanks. You guys have no idea how much this helps me

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

another issue that i ran into with this newfound throttle that you guys may know how to correct. when i press the gas pedal with the car at idle, it sort of cuts out then recovers then revs. the harder i hit the gas the worse it is and if im not careful it will kill the engine completely. also the inverse is happening. if im at 2, 3, 4k rpm and press in the clutch or let it idle down it will drop below where idle is set and then recover.

im sure this cant be an all too rare occurrence so again, any help you guys can provide would be wonderful.

thanks again.

beefhole

iTrader: (29)

Does it bog with too much fuel you mean?

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

i dont think its too much fuel, almost seems like starvation till it catches up with itself.

beefhole

iTrader: (29)

Then it's hesitating? You made it sound like the revs would drop and try to come back. That's bogging.

Work on the throttle pump maps.