Remapping factory ECU
02-27-10, 09:48 PM
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Remapping factory ECU
Ok, so I have idea, more of a fact finding mission...
Does anyone know (FACTS) who makes the software and hardware to read (crack) the factory ECU N370 (or any rx7 ECU for that matter)?
***Please note I do not want to buy a chipped/ mapped computer, names of retailers are not helpful***
With all the info on the net I am supprised that this is not out there (or at least I have not found it).
Thanks
Does anyone know (FACTS) who makes the software and hardware to read (crack) the factory ECU N370 (or any rx7 ECU for that matter)?
***Please note I do not want to buy a chipped/ mapped computer, names of retailers are not helpful***
With all the info on the net I am supprised that this is not out there (or at least I have not found it).
Thanks
02-28-10, 09:50 AM
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Thanks for the links.
Although the links are exactly what I am talking about, they are using the exact opposite approach. I am not looking to re invent the wheel. IE write code build eprom jumpers from scratch
I am looking to find out what hardware and firmware was used buy the many companies that used to remap /re-chip factory ECU’s. This is old technology (20yrs+) someone has to know what I am looking for.
Pan Speed
Knight sport
Re-Amemiya
Although the links are exactly what I am talking about, they are using the exact opposite approach. I am not looking to re invent the wheel. IE write code build eprom jumpers from scratch
I am looking to find out what hardware and firmware was used buy the many companies that used to remap /re-chip factory ECU’s. This is old technology (20yrs+) someone has to know what I am looking for.
Pan Speed
Knight sport
Re-Amemiya
02-28-10, 10:33 AM
#4
I don't know of any place state-side that ever had equipment to flash the stock ECU. From what I understand, all the US based remapped ECU's were/are remapped chips purchased from Japan and the ECU's are just modified here in the US for the daughter-board attachment.
Several people in the US over the years have tried to figure out how to do it, but no one has done it yet (at least not on this forum). hwnd has probably gotten the further than anyone I've seen but he stopped.
Several people in the US over the years have tried to figure out how to do it, but no one has done it yet (at least not on this forum). hwnd has probably gotten the further than anyone I've seen but he stopped.
02-28-10, 01:51 PM
#5
Thanks for the links.
Although the links are exactly what I am talking about, they are using the exact opposite approach. I am not looking to re invent the wheel. IE write code build eprom jumpers from scratch
I am looking to find out what hardware and firmware was used buy the many companies that used to remap /re-chip factory ECU’s. This is old technology (20yrs+) someone has to know what I am looking for.
Pan Speed
Knight sport
Re-Amemiya
Although the links are exactly what I am talking about, they are using the exact opposite approach. I am not looking to re invent the wheel. IE write code build eprom jumpers from scratch
I am looking to find out what hardware and firmware was used buy the many companies that used to remap /re-chip factory ECU’s. This is old technology (20yrs+) someone has to know what I am looking for.
Pan Speed
Knight sport
Re-Amemiya
At least... that is what I am reading....
Expecting one to be available... and free... really?
02-28-10, 02:13 PM
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www.moates.net i use the moates Burn1 chip burner , you can read and write chips for most factory ecu's
there's no programs or anything i couldn't find help identifying the values, other than information on probetalk (ecu's are the same set up and code)
the oldschool jdm people just knew how to read hex code, its not hard to learn, i wasnt certain if i was actually looking at the right maps and didnt wanna try switchin to much and blow my motor,
if i knew all the addresses i could do some decent tuning with just the chip burner
i had a decent collection of .Bins but i lost them when i reformatted, i have them save on a disk somewhere
i had stock n350 ,stock n370, stock n374, knightsport, blitz , Toms racing (came with my motor)
there's no programs or anything i couldn't find help identifying the values, other than information on probetalk (ecu's are the same set up and code)
the oldschool jdm people just knew how to read hex code, its not hard to learn, i wasnt certain if i was actually looking at the right maps and didnt wanna try switchin to much and blow my motor,
if i knew all the addresses i could do some decent tuning with just the chip burner
i had a decent collection of .Bins but i lost them when i reformatted, i have them save on a disk somewhere
i had stock n350 ,stock n370, stock n374, knightsport, blitz , Toms racing (came with my motor)
02-28-10, 10:32 PM
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I am not looking to flash the computer, I want to see what the factory settings are. It’s easy to make power but it’s harder to get the car to behave (with after market EMS). That and there are some tables that I think only the factory has the "right" answer to.
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02-28-10, 10:43 PM
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www.moates.net i use the moates Burn1 chip burner , you can read and write chips for most factory ecu's
there's no programs or anything i couldn't find help identifying the values, other than information on probetalk (ecu's are the same set up and code)
the oldschool jdm people just knew how to read hex code, its not hard to learn, i wasnt certain if i was actually looking at the right maps and didnt wanna try switchin to much and blow my motor,
if i knew all the addresses i could do some decent tuning with just the chip burner
i had a decent collection of .Bins but i lost them when i reformatted, i have them save on a disk somewhere
i had stock n350 ,stock n370, stock n374, knightsport, blitz , Toms racing (came with my motor)
there's no programs or anything i couldn't find help identifying the values, other than information on probetalk (ecu's are the same set up and code)
the oldschool jdm people just knew how to read hex code, its not hard to learn, i wasnt certain if i was actually looking at the right maps and didnt wanna try switchin to much and blow my motor,
if i knew all the addresses i could do some decent tuning with just the chip burner
i had a decent collection of .Bins but i lost them when i reformatted, i have them save on a disk somewhere
i had stock n350 ,stock n370, stock n374, knightsport, blitz , Toms racing (came with my motor)
Thanks for the insite, I have to check that out (visit ProbeTalK).
03-01-10, 03:43 PM
#10
uh.. here is the long version of the short answer:
a) no one will be able to beat mazda's factory calibration for a factory 13B.
they had a lot of guys in white lab coats with fancy tools like engine dyno's to get it right and really smart people to tune these engines (much more than your copy/paste tuners)
b) you will not be able to "extract" a stock calibration without understanding 1970's / 1980's 8bit motorola assembly (rather 8bit disassembly) further more you need to understand that there are 3 processors in the FD ecu (one of which runs in external memory mode) which means you need two disassemblers (or at least two opcode lists) to even convert/disassemble the ROMs
c) you need to be really good at circuit tracing... why? how the hell else will you know what i/o an injector or OMP output is on? trust me, the disassembled code doesn't say "fuel map - 3 miles ahead" or "Injector offset, next left". This is above your typical Visual Basic (read: copy/paste) developer.
d) even if you figured out all the needed information (global adder maps, etc) you probably wouldn't think twice about giving that information away. because then, my friend, you'll be sitting on a pile of money.
what would a stock-tunable-single turbo ecu sell for? ..a hell of a lot less than the PFC and it'll damn sure be PNP with no OMP or floating ignition problems.
so in short, yes, you can do it - i did but got lazy and decided to move on to other stuff.
the amount of time and effort i currently have in this project far exceeds weeks and a few months but longer. I've spend more than $1k on a piece of software to aid in disassembling the 8bit code (I still had to write the disassembler module/proc for IDA as it were) - and this is WAY beyond installing a turbo or PFC - way beyond as in hunting down '80s opcode / mnemonics for those old micro-controllers.
go ahead and bash me for not sharing this but I honestly asked for help long time ago - got nothing but cats looking for milk (free hand out), wait, one guy offered monetary support (thank you Rich) but it wasn't needed since I didn't plan to go too far.
I did extract the ignition maps and fuel maps (among other maps) but felt those were enough to solve the age old "factory split?" threads.
anyhow, i wish you the best of luck but I think you're better suited to buy a legit ecu and paid a professional to tune it (read: not `steve kahn` aka copy/paste).
..just my opinions, nothing more.
a) no one will be able to beat mazda's factory calibration for a factory 13B.
they had a lot of guys in white lab coats with fancy tools like engine dyno's to get it right and really smart people to tune these engines (much more than your copy/paste tuners)
b) you will not be able to "extract" a stock calibration without understanding 1970's / 1980's 8bit motorola assembly (rather 8bit disassembly) further more you need to understand that there are 3 processors in the FD ecu (one of which runs in external memory mode) which means you need two disassemblers (or at least two opcode lists) to even convert/disassemble the ROMs
c) you need to be really good at circuit tracing... why? how the hell else will you know what i/o an injector or OMP output is on? trust me, the disassembled code doesn't say "fuel map - 3 miles ahead" or "Injector offset, next left". This is above your typical Visual Basic (read: copy/paste) developer.
d) even if you figured out all the needed information (global adder maps, etc) you probably wouldn't think twice about giving that information away. because then, my friend, you'll be sitting on a pile of money.
what would a stock-tunable-single turbo ecu sell for? ..a hell of a lot less than the PFC and it'll damn sure be PNP with no OMP or floating ignition problems.
so in short, yes, you can do it - i did but got lazy and decided to move on to other stuff.
the amount of time and effort i currently have in this project far exceeds weeks and a few months but longer. I've spend more than $1k on a piece of software to aid in disassembling the 8bit code (I still had to write the disassembler module/proc for IDA as it were) - and this is WAY beyond installing a turbo or PFC - way beyond as in hunting down '80s opcode / mnemonics for those old micro-controllers.
go ahead and bash me for not sharing this but I honestly asked for help long time ago - got nothing but cats looking for milk (free hand out), wait, one guy offered monetary support (thank you Rich) but it wasn't needed since I didn't plan to go too far.
I did extract the ignition maps and fuel maps (among other maps) but felt those were enough to solve the age old "factory split?" threads.
anyhow, i wish you the best of luck but I think you're better suited to buy a legit ecu and paid a professional to tune it (read: not `steve kahn` aka copy/paste).
..just my opinions, nothing more.
03-01-10, 03:48 PM
#11
oh, for those nay-sayers.. this is what your crude disassembled output would look like the first few rounds (while you figured your i/o's correctly):
Code:
0060be c1aa add b, #0xaa 0060c0 9480 subc a, $0x80 0060c2 6c push a 0060c3 5c mov ocr, a 0060c4 51 dec b 0060c5 463b bne 0x6102 0060c7 c3b4 and b, #0xb4 0060c9 a69b ld d, y + 0x1b 0060cb 9188 mul a, $0x88 0060cd 817a mul a, #0x7a 0060cf 74c3 neg $0xc3 0060d1 b4a69b subc a, 0xa69b 0060d4 9188 mul a, $0x88 0060d6 817a mul a, #0x7a 0060d8 74a2 neg $0xa2 0060da 73 reti 0060db 4200 bgt 0x60dd
03-01-10, 04:17 PM
#12
I agree with hwnd. I myself spent one entire summary decoding a data aqusition system. It was written in machine code down to the bit/byte/nibble level. I got tired looking at binary-coded-hex code. I do have to make one comment though, I did this all in Visual Basic. VB can be just as powerful depending on the coder.
03-01-10, 10:50 PM
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What you have accomplished is quite a feat, but now you seem quite bitter at people on this forum for their lack of input (help) in the initial stages have you ever considered most people on this forum may not have you computer savvy and that the lack of input may have not been intentional (maybe they had no insight to offer).
I concede you are right the only things worth doing are for personal financial gain.
(*Mental note* charge my son for teaching him abc’s; I did not invent abc’s but I translated it to him so I should be compensated)
Personally (I could be wrong) I think you missed your big dollar window on a car that was produced almost !!!!TWENTY YEARS AGO!!! I am not even sure if half of the cars are still on the road or will ever see the road again… Spotting a third gen is like spotting a Unicorn I see more 100k+ exotics than RX7’s on a daily basis. Maybe you need to concentrate on making a time machine. So you can sell your computer codes when they were relevant. Moreover if you put the factory information on any new EMS once one unit is sold everyone has it anyway (it’s called the information age for a reason)…
BTW how many nephrologists do you see on here asking for help to reverse engineer a dialysis procedures?
The world leaps forward light years each day because people share information on the internet. I have heard your input and respect your feelings (don’t understand them, but respect them none the less). Please reserve this thread for people who are willing to actually share information…
(Thank God this is not a cure for Diabetes (or something) or people would continue to die until you figure out how to turn a “BIG” profit).
03-01-10, 11:30 PM
#16
this is your first warning and final warning.. ..your stab at me regarding the diabetes / profit remark is completely of color and I will suspend your online activities here (for a short period) if you keep it up. Thats a very cruel thing to say (even to me).
With that out of the way... I've had 6 or 7 FD's here in the past year, four the year before that. I dont exactly think of them as a unicorn but to each his own.
So what exactly would you purpose I do with this information thats seemingly worthless due to its 20 year age? ...well if I understand your remark - I shouldn't do anything with it because it's 20 years old and FD3S cars aren't too common anymore.
Well little do you know, there are quite a bit of FD's around here and I've very sure that at the tune of $300 per modded ECU - they would be a hot ticket item for sure. Hell dont believe me? Look at the going rate for that junky PowerFC and you'd still need a DL cable to even make it worth while (at an additional cost).
Hot rodding these ROM's has a good deal of attraction to it but yanno.. It'll never see the light of day from me - I'm just too lazy and I honestly believe it'll not be worth while (customer service, software development, bug fixes, i/c boards, etc).
...however, I think it's rather funny you say this
I am not looking to flash the computer, I want to see what the factory settings are. It’s easy to make power but it’s harder to get the car to behave (with after market EMS). That and there are some tables that I think only the factory has the "right" answer to.
Although the links are exactly what I am talking about, they are using the exact opposite approach. I am not looking to re invent the wheel. IE write code build eprom jumpers from scratch
I am looking to find out what hardware and firmware was used buy the many companies that used to remap /re-chip factory ECU’s. This is old technology (20yrs+) someone has to know what I am looking for.
I am looking to find out what hardware and firmware was used buy the many companies that used to remap /re-chip factory ECU’s. This is old technology (20yrs+) someone has to know what I am looking for.
The funny part is - you've only got a single part of the puzzle. Collect all the modded ROM's you want and you'll notice - same addresses are modified (different values but the addresses remain the same). Why is that? because it's a little harder than extracting the ROM data and opening it in hex view.
So you said it yourself, you want to extract the base calibration and apply it to a standalone, right?
...but it’s harder to get the car to behave (with after market EMS).
(*Mental note* charge my son for teaching him abc’s; I did not invent abc’s but I translated it to him so I should be compensated)
BTW how many nephrologists do you see on here asking for help to reverse engineer a dialysis procedures?
03-02-10, 07:47 AM
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this is your first warning and final warning.. ..your stab at me regarding the diabetes / profit remark is completely of color and I will suspend your online activities here (for a short period) if you keep it up. Thats a very cruel thing to say (even to me).
With that out of the way... I've had 6 or 7 FD's here in the past year, four the year before that. I dont exactly think of them as a unicorn but to each his own.
So what exactly would you purpose I do with this information thats seemingly worthless due to its 20 year age? ...well if I understand your remark - I shouldn't do anything with it because it's 20 years old and FD3S cars aren't too common anymore.
Well little do you know, there are quite a bit of FD's around here and I've very sure that at the tune of $300 per modded ECU - they would be a hot ticket item for sure. Hell dont believe me? Look at the going rate for that junky PowerFC and you'd still need a DL cable to even make it worth while (at an additional cost).
Hot rodding these ROM's has a good deal of attraction to it but yanno.. It'll never see the light of day from me - I'm just too lazy and I honestly believe it'll not be worth while (customer service, software development, bug fixes, i/c boards, etc).
...however, I think it's rather funny you say this
and you went on...
Here is my issues with that - here you are asking for a hand out. Ever wonder why there isn't a lot of information out there? ...because it's F'ing hard to extract and make useful for dullards like yourself. If this 20 year old technology "so like way old and junk" you ought to be able to figure out that the chips inside are semi-custom/semi-one off units. Then you'd figure out how to extract the info from those said chips. Okay fine, woohoo ya extracted the rom from he 27c256 (27c512 in the modded ecu's case) - big deal, now turn that into something useful.
The funny part is - you've only got a single part of the puzzle. Collect all the modded ROM's you want and you'll notice - same addresses are modified (different values but the addresses remain the same). Why is that? because it's a little harder than extracting the ROM data and opening it in hex view.
So you said it yourself, you want to extract the base calibration and apply it to a standalone, right?
...well hire a professional tuner and job / problem solved.
you're an idiot
..probably because this forum is all about rotary engines, you idiot.
With that out of the way... I've had 6 or 7 FD's here in the past year, four the year before that. I dont exactly think of them as a unicorn but to each his own.
So what exactly would you purpose I do with this information thats seemingly worthless due to its 20 year age? ...well if I understand your remark - I shouldn't do anything with it because it's 20 years old and FD3S cars aren't too common anymore.
Well little do you know, there are quite a bit of FD's around here and I've very sure that at the tune of $300 per modded ECU - they would be a hot ticket item for sure. Hell dont believe me? Look at the going rate for that junky PowerFC and you'd still need a DL cable to even make it worth while (at an additional cost).
Hot rodding these ROM's has a good deal of attraction to it but yanno.. It'll never see the light of day from me - I'm just too lazy and I honestly believe it'll not be worth while (customer service, software development, bug fixes, i/c boards, etc).
...however, I think it's rather funny you say this
and you went on...
Here is my issues with that - here you are asking for a hand out. Ever wonder why there isn't a lot of information out there? ...because it's F'ing hard to extract and make useful for dullards like yourself. If this 20 year old technology "so like way old and junk" you ought to be able to figure out that the chips inside are semi-custom/semi-one off units. Then you'd figure out how to extract the info from those said chips. Okay fine, woohoo ya extracted the rom from he 27c256 (27c512 in the modded ecu's case) - big deal, now turn that into something useful.
The funny part is - you've only got a single part of the puzzle. Collect all the modded ROM's you want and you'll notice - same addresses are modified (different values but the addresses remain the same). Why is that? because it's a little harder than extracting the ROM data and opening it in hex view.
So you said it yourself, you want to extract the base calibration and apply it to a standalone, right?
...well hire a professional tuner and job / problem solved.
you're an idiot
..probably because this forum is all about rotary engines, you idiot.
1st off you cant warn me about anything more than the weather??? Off color I restate it!!!
Suspend me keep the site. If this is what this site is about, keep it!
The Forum **** has spoken.... You will be suspended for Free Speech
No, what’s cruel is people who have the power to change things but don’t because off selfishness...
The fact that you have or had Rx7's means nothing what about the rest of the general population??
I never asked you for you "personal discoveries" I agreed with you about tuning principles (but your too blind to see that). However, I did ask you what the other computer tuner companies used to flash their chips and you were too much of a ***** to divulge that. I did not realize you consider their technology a "personal discovery" also. I guess you’re worried someone might beat you to the pot of gold???
Finally, the cold hard fact is if we were standing face to face you would not be name calling, so hide behind you computer screen.
Next time you are in S. Florida let me know and we can find out…
You can close my account....
03-02-10, 01:01 PM
#18
synergy7 -
if i may (and please don't take this as an attack on you or my taking sides, because i know hwnd just as much as i know you), however, just hear me out for a minute. i kind of laughed a minute when i read the last few exchanges, and you seem to string arguments together like my girlfriend does. again, i don't mean it as an attack or insult - she's actually quite an intelligent woman/person and i have the utmost respect for her. i say it simply because when we disagree, as people often do, she strings irrelevant arguments together in an attempt to make a case for why she should get what she wants, and i saw some of that in your argument/rebuttal.
i never understood where you (and so many others) got the notion that simply because this is a public forum, that people are obligated to divulge information they have. i agree, it's a novel idea, and that it does help us all as a "community" if such information sharing takes place, but the simple fact is no one has an obligation to anyone here. it may hurt, it may be an inconvenience, but it's a fact. we all have some special talents, some of choose to share, some of choose to sell and some of us choose to do nothing. that's life.
the argument about your child and the ABC's is invalid, because you are responsible for teaching him/her because it's your (and the government's) child. you can't expect compensation. however, if some total stranger expected you to impart the ABC's for their child simply because you know your ABC's and they don't, then it kind of becomes a similar situation to this, not the same, but more similar. i'm sure you'd expect some concessions or compensation in such a case.
if hwnd spent his time deciphering the code, then it's totally on him to impart whatever information he gleans or not. if he does, great for whomever is interested, if he doesn't, then it doesn't make him selfish or a bad person. it would be like saying the builder of El Demente or Sakura being on the forum and people expecting them to share all the info that went into building and tuning.
the ECUs are out there and available to anyone with a few bucks, you have the option of getting the information for yourself, just like hwnd did. for example, i spent many, MANY months trying to gather information on semi-peripherals and at the time, i found a picture of one in a Japanese ad, and a few photos and general details on GtoRx7 and Judge Ito's cars. granted, i never asked either of them for help, but if i had, i knew full well that "expecting" them to help me was unreasonable and expecting them to help me for free was just bloody ludicrous. instead, i went out did a whole bunch of independent studies and then got my hands dirty. i'm making slow progress, but i will finish someday and even though there is some more info out there now (compared to when i started searching), it's still very meagre. i may choose to share everything i find in my journey, i may not. either way, i hope people wouldn't deem me selfish, if i happen to choose the latter route.
you seem to be somewhat versed in the healthcare/medical issues, and i am in that field, as well. so i can tell you that this same thing does happen and it happens all the time. drug companies sit on clinical trial information ALL THE TIME and they will sit on it for as long as it takes copyrights and guaranteed profits to manifest themselves, while people continue to ail and die. it's sort of unfair to compare a private individual/party with limited resources (i have no knowledge of his finances, but i would imagine compared to a pharmaceutical company ....)
i'm just saying if he chooses not help, merely suggesting that he refrain from posting anything else should have sufficed, and then you force him to look like an *** if he persists. however, giving your opinions on how he conducts himself with the information he has, no matter how enititled to that opinion you are, opens the door to even further wasting of your (and anyone interested in your topic) time by the arguing, threats and name-calling.
does what i say make any sense? hopefully it does, if not sorry for yet one more useless post. either way, it's probably my last post in here simply because i have nothing to offer on the topic and i have no burning interest in modified ECUs. i just thought maybe a pair of objective eyes might help you see. either way, good luck finding what you seek.
if i may (and please don't take this as an attack on you or my taking sides, because i know hwnd just as much as i know you), however, just hear me out for a minute. i kind of laughed a minute when i read the last few exchanges, and you seem to string arguments together like my girlfriend does. again, i don't mean it as an attack or insult - she's actually quite an intelligent woman/person and i have the utmost respect for her. i say it simply because when we disagree, as people often do, she strings irrelevant arguments together in an attempt to make a case for why she should get what she wants, and i saw some of that in your argument/rebuttal.
i never understood where you (and so many others) got the notion that simply because this is a public forum, that people are obligated to divulge information they have. i agree, it's a novel idea, and that it does help us all as a "community" if such information sharing takes place, but the simple fact is no one has an obligation to anyone here. it may hurt, it may be an inconvenience, but it's a fact. we all have some special talents, some of choose to share, some of choose to sell and some of us choose to do nothing. that's life.
the argument about your child and the ABC's is invalid, because you are responsible for teaching him/her because it's your (and the government's) child. you can't expect compensation. however, if some total stranger expected you to impart the ABC's for their child simply because you know your ABC's and they don't, then it kind of becomes a similar situation to this, not the same, but more similar. i'm sure you'd expect some concessions or compensation in such a case.
if hwnd spent his time deciphering the code, then it's totally on him to impart whatever information he gleans or not. if he does, great for whomever is interested, if he doesn't, then it doesn't make him selfish or a bad person. it would be like saying the builder of El Demente or Sakura being on the forum and people expecting them to share all the info that went into building and tuning.
the ECUs are out there and available to anyone with a few bucks, you have the option of getting the information for yourself, just like hwnd did. for example, i spent many, MANY months trying to gather information on semi-peripherals and at the time, i found a picture of one in a Japanese ad, and a few photos and general details on GtoRx7 and Judge Ito's cars. granted, i never asked either of them for help, but if i had, i knew full well that "expecting" them to help me was unreasonable and expecting them to help me for free was just bloody ludicrous. instead, i went out did a whole bunch of independent studies and then got my hands dirty. i'm making slow progress, but i will finish someday and even though there is some more info out there now (compared to when i started searching), it's still very meagre. i may choose to share everything i find in my journey, i may not. either way, i hope people wouldn't deem me selfish, if i happen to choose the latter route.
you seem to be somewhat versed in the healthcare/medical issues, and i am in that field, as well. so i can tell you that this same thing does happen and it happens all the time. drug companies sit on clinical trial information ALL THE TIME and they will sit on it for as long as it takes copyrights and guaranteed profits to manifest themselves, while people continue to ail and die. it's sort of unfair to compare a private individual/party with limited resources (i have no knowledge of his finances, but i would imagine compared to a pharmaceutical company ....)
i'm just saying if he chooses not help, merely suggesting that he refrain from posting anything else should have sufficed, and then you force him to look like an *** if he persists. however, giving your opinions on how he conducts himself with the information he has, no matter how enititled to that opinion you are, opens the door to even further wasting of your (and anyone interested in your topic) time by the arguing, threats and name-calling.
does what i say make any sense? hopefully it does, if not sorry for yet one more useless post. either way, it's probably my last post in here simply because i have nothing to offer on the topic and i have no burning interest in modified ECUs. i just thought maybe a pair of objective eyes might help you see. either way, good luck finding what you seek.
03-02-10, 01:29 PM
#19
synerygy7 -
if i may (and please don't take this as an attack on you or my taking sides, because i know hwnd just as much as i know you), however, just hear me out for a minute. i kind of laughed a minute when i read the last few exchanges, and you seem to string arguments together like my girlfriend does. again, i don't mean it as an attack or insult - she's actually quite an intelligent woman/person and i have the utmost respect for her. i say it simply because when we disagree, as people often do, she strings irrelevant arguments together in an attempt to make a case for why she should get what she wants, and i saw some of that in your argument/rebuttal.
i never understood where you (and so many others) got the notion that simply because this is a public forum, that people are obligated to divulge information they have. i agree, it's a novel idea, and that it does help us all as a "community" if such information sharing takes place, but the simple fact is no one has an obligation to anyone here. it may hurt, it may be an inconvenience, but it's a fact. we all have some special talents, some of choose to share, some of choose to sell and some of us choose to do nothing. that's life.
the argument about your child and the ABC's is invalid, because you are responsible for teaching him/her because it's your (and the government's) child. you can't expect compensation. however, if some total stranger expected you to impart the ABC's for their child simply because you know your ABC's and they don't, then it kind of becomes a similar situation to this, not the same, but more similar. i'm sure you'd expect some concessions or compensation in such a case.
if hwnd spent his time deciphering the code, then it's totally on him to impart whatever information he gleans or not. if he does, great for whomever is interested, if he doesn't, then it doesn't make him selfish or a bad person. it would be like saying the builder of El Demente or Sakura being on the forum and people expecting them to share all the info that went into building and tuning.
the ECUs are out there and available to anyone with a few bucks, you have the option of getting the information for yourself, just like hwnd did. for example, i spent many, MANY months trying to gather information on semi-peripherals and at the time, i found a picture of one in a Japanese ad, and a few photos and general details on GtoRx7 and Judge Ito's cars. granted, i never asked either of them for help, but if i had, i knew full well that "expecting" them to help me was unreasonable and expecting them to help me for free was just bloody ludicrous. instead, i went out did a whole bunch of independent studies and then got my hands dirty. i'm making slow progress, but i will finish someday and even though there is some more info out there now (compared to when i started searching), it's still very meagre. i may choose to share everything i find in my journey, i may not. either way, i hope people wouldn't deem me selfish, if i happen to choose the latter route.
you seem to be somewhat versed in the healthcare/medical issues, and i am in that field, as well. so i can tell you that this same thing does happen and it happens all the time. drug companies sit on clinical trial information ALL THE TIME and they will sit on it for as long as it takes copyrights and guaranteed profits to manifest themselves, while people continue to ail and die. it's sort of unfair to compare a private individual/party with limited resources (i have no knowledge of his finances, but i would imagine compared to a pharmaceutical company ....)
i'm just saying if he chooses not help, merely suggesting that he refrain from posting anything else should have sufficed, and then you force him to look like an *** if he persists. however, giving your opinions on how he conducts himself with the information he has, no matter how enititled to that opinion you are, opens the door to even further wasting of your (and anyone interested in your topic) time by the arguing, threats and name-calling.
does what i say make any sense? hopefully it does, if not sorry for yet one more useless post. either way, it's probably my last post in here simply because i have nothing to offer on the topic and i have no burning interest in modified ECUs. i just thought maybe a pair of objective eyes might help you see. either way, good luck finding what you seek.
if i may (and please don't take this as an attack on you or my taking sides, because i know hwnd just as much as i know you), however, just hear me out for a minute. i kind of laughed a minute when i read the last few exchanges, and you seem to string arguments together like my girlfriend does. again, i don't mean it as an attack or insult - she's actually quite an intelligent woman/person and i have the utmost respect for her. i say it simply because when we disagree, as people often do, she strings irrelevant arguments together in an attempt to make a case for why she should get what she wants, and i saw some of that in your argument/rebuttal.
i never understood where you (and so many others) got the notion that simply because this is a public forum, that people are obligated to divulge information they have. i agree, it's a novel idea, and that it does help us all as a "community" if such information sharing takes place, but the simple fact is no one has an obligation to anyone here. it may hurt, it may be an inconvenience, but it's a fact. we all have some special talents, some of choose to share, some of choose to sell and some of us choose to do nothing. that's life.
the argument about your child and the ABC's is invalid, because you are responsible for teaching him/her because it's your (and the government's) child. you can't expect compensation. however, if some total stranger expected you to impart the ABC's for their child simply because you know your ABC's and they don't, then it kind of becomes a similar situation to this, not the same, but more similar. i'm sure you'd expect some concessions or compensation in such a case.
if hwnd spent his time deciphering the code, then it's totally on him to impart whatever information he gleans or not. if he does, great for whomever is interested, if he doesn't, then it doesn't make him selfish or a bad person. it would be like saying the builder of El Demente or Sakura being on the forum and people expecting them to share all the info that went into building and tuning.
the ECUs are out there and available to anyone with a few bucks, you have the option of getting the information for yourself, just like hwnd did. for example, i spent many, MANY months trying to gather information on semi-peripherals and at the time, i found a picture of one in a Japanese ad, and a few photos and general details on GtoRx7 and Judge Ito's cars. granted, i never asked either of them for help, but if i had, i knew full well that "expecting" them to help me was unreasonable and expecting them to help me for free was just bloody ludicrous. instead, i went out did a whole bunch of independent studies and then got my hands dirty. i'm making slow progress, but i will finish someday and even though there is some more info out there now (compared to when i started searching), it's still very meagre. i may choose to share everything i find in my journey, i may not. either way, i hope people wouldn't deem me selfish, if i happen to choose the latter route.
you seem to be somewhat versed in the healthcare/medical issues, and i am in that field, as well. so i can tell you that this same thing does happen and it happens all the time. drug companies sit on clinical trial information ALL THE TIME and they will sit on it for as long as it takes copyrights and guaranteed profits to manifest themselves, while people continue to ail and die. it's sort of unfair to compare a private individual/party with limited resources (i have no knowledge of his finances, but i would imagine compared to a pharmaceutical company ....)
i'm just saying if he chooses not help, merely suggesting that he refrain from posting anything else should have sufficed, and then you force him to look like an *** if he persists. however, giving your opinions on how he conducts himself with the information he has, no matter how enititled to that opinion you are, opens the door to even further wasting of your (and anyone interested in your topic) time by the arguing, threats and name-calling.
does what i say make any sense? hopefully it does, if not sorry for yet one more useless post. either way, it's probably my last post in here simply because i have nothing to offer on the topic and i have no burning interest in modified ECUs. i just thought maybe a pair of objective eyes might help you see. either way, good luck finding what you seek.
My hat is off to you! Thats probably one of the better posts I've read in a while.
03-03-10, 07:21 PM
#20
This is all very interesting stuff (aside from the stupid arguments). I read the other threads and found them interesting too. I just wonder... does anyone really know what the factory S4 BAC valve settings are off the stock ECU!? 
I've had quite the tuning adventure on my haltech!
I've had quite the tuning adventure on my haltech!
03-10-10, 03:12 PM
#21
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... as people often do, she strings irrelevant arguments together in an attempt to make a case for why she should get what she wants, and i saw some of that in your argument/rebuttal.
i never understood where you (and so many others) got the notion that simply because this is a public forum, that people are obligated to divulge information they have. i agree, it's a novel idea, and that it does help us all as a "community" if such information sharing takes place, but the simple fact is no one has an obligation to anyone here. it may hurt, it may be an inconvenience, but it's a fact. we all have some special talents, some of choose to share, some of choose to sell and some of us choose to do nothing. that's life.
the argument about your child and the ABC's is invalid, because you are responsible for teaching him/her because it's your (and the government's) child. you can't expect compensation. however, if some total stranger expected you to impart the ABC's for their child simply because you know your ABC's and they don't, then it kind of becomes a similar situation to this, not the same, but more similar. i'm sure you'd expect some concessions or compensation in such a case.
Second, I never said ANYONE HAD to share anything, however I did say it make no sence to tell people you have ALL of the answers if you refuse to share... Why even open your mouth about it???
Third, the ABC comment was just to make a point your reading too far into it I.E. every deed needs to be rewarded
Moving on...
I have been busy with other projects, but I came across this about a week ago (surprisingly quickly). This is a step by step guide to do how what we discussed ( this guy didi it back in 2002 on a FD ECU)
USE Google to Translate: http://kaele.com/~kashima/car/rx7.html
No Translation needed: http://www.pemicro.com/products/products_find.cfm
03-10-10, 05:22 PM
#22
so in short, yes, you can do it - i did but got lazy and decided to move on to other stuff.
the amount of time and effort i currently have in this project far exceeds weeks and a few months but longer. I've spend more than $1k on a piece of software to aid in disassembling the 8bit code (I still had to write the disassembler module/proc for IDA as it were) - and this is WAY beyond installing a turbo or PFC - way beyond as in hunting down '80s opcode / mnemonics for those old micro-controllers.
the amount of time and effort i currently have in this project far exceeds weeks and a few months but longer. I've spend more than $1k on a piece of software to aid in disassembling the 8bit code (I still had to write the disassembler module/proc for IDA as it were) - and this is WAY beyond installing a turbo or PFC - way beyond as in hunting down '80s opcode / mnemonics for those old micro-controllers.
So would this be like An rtek7 for FD's? What, if i may, is the diffrence between the fc's ecu and the FD's? As far as complexity.. I have no intent, nore ability to do what You've done. i'm just wanting to decide in what Ecu for my 300 power mark will be, with driveability as near factory quailty as possible.
03-10-10, 06:40 PM
#23
First, everything I said is relevant.
Second, I never said ANYONE HAD to share anything, however I did say it make no sence to tell people you have ALL of the answers if you refuse to share... Why even open your mouth about it???
Third, the ABC comment was just to make a point your reading too far into it I.E. every deed needs to be rewarded
Moving on...
I have been busy with other projects, but I came across this about a week ago (surprisingly quickly). This is a step by step guide to do how what we discussed ( this guy didi it back in 2002 on a FD ECU)
USE Google to Translate: http://kaele.com/~kashima/car/rx7.html
No Translation needed: http://www.pemicro.com/products/products_find.cfm
Second, I never said ANYONE HAD to share anything, however I did say it make no sence to tell people you have ALL of the answers if you refuse to share... Why even open your mouth about it???
Third, the ABC comment was just to make a point your reading too far into it I.E. every deed needs to be rewarded
Moving on...
I have been busy with other projects, but I came across this about a week ago (surprisingly quickly). This is a step by step guide to do how what we discussed ( this guy didi it back in 2002 on a FD ECU)
USE Google to Translate: http://kaele.com/~kashima/car/rx7.html
No Translation needed: http://www.pemicro.com/products/products_find.cfm
There is another group who is still messing with the 16bit ECU's (only the flashable ECU's which Kashi touched on briefly) and do not release software or anything - just retuned ECU's
To make any real progress... you're going to need to reverse engineer the two processors and the external memory chips. it's a lot of work for what you end up with.
now a smart fella would build a (or buy) data logger for the stock mazda/ford (hint) port on the FD3S.. they're out there. it would be a simple way to build your own profiles on ign, fuel, sensors, etc just by logging.
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