Then why the rush to start this mass enforcement if nothing can be done to resolve the issue? Why not wait until things are setup properly?

 

In order for any policy regarding advertising to be fair and effective you must come up with a rule that will limit every forum member in a similar fashion. I'm sure some computer guy could come up with a very handy way to accomplish this without punishing the best sellers on this forum.

Also I'd say witch hunt IS a correct assessment of what's currently taking place
I've been selling for atleast 7 years and have sold less and less over the last couple of years and I've never been approached about being a vendor until now. Most of my sales are attributed to selling used up track cars that I paid 20k plus for and that's no way to make a living

 

For those of you keeping score at home, I'd like to note that some very key, very interesting information has been removed from my last post.

Basically this information was contained in a PM that I received that directly disputed what one of the mods has posted here regarding lack of orders to hunt down sellers and advertisers.

Perhaps I can say that much without getting it removed, or perhaps that also crosses the line in the "new rx7club regime".

It sucks to make valid and factual points only to have them covered up by those who cannot sway the debate in their direction based on the merit of their statements alone.

 

very informative thread..

:AA:

 

We will never be the same again....will we?

 

As a paying sponsor of this forum I believe that companies that provide/sell a service/parts should pay for advertising on this forum. If you want to carry your Company Name in your Sig then pay for the billboard. We hardly ever sell used parts anymore and rarely even post in the "For sale" section but I still do not have an issue with sponsoring the forum.

Kevin your company and reputation were built on this forum (& others) not the other way around. Same story with me, so when Ryan contacted us a year or 2 ago asking for advertising money, we said "no problem". It is part of the cost of running a business, you write it off as an expense. Long and the short of it, you are a company owner with a engine rebuild and powder coating service, not an individual selling parts from his/her parts car.

As for others it is not so cut and dry, Fritz for example sells lots of parts but is not a business and does not pretend to be one. Should he have to pay for posting? I personally do not think he should. If you proclaim yourself to be a business to establish greater credibility then you should have to pay, maybe that would cut down on some of the scammers (example: Luketech motorsports)

I am not trying to start a fight, just helping to establish who should and should not be paying for advertising. If you own or are here to promote a company's service or parts then sponsor the forum, it is your target audience. Kevin you cannot put yourself in the same category as Fritz for example, you own a company he does not.

These are just my opinions, and mean nothing in the grand scheme of things. The Rx7club forum is a business and it's only revenue comes from advertising, it cost money to run a business, so if it is not making enough they close it down, just like any other company. We all suffer if it goes away.

 

I am still looking for the "rules". Is there a SOP for the classifieds? I want to see a "you cant post x amount of items in a month". I dont advertise or own a business but have been told to stop posting. I think I have kept many many people involved in this forum and have saved a few cars from being butt raped for an "el es juan". I assume I got flagged for selling a hand full of parts all at once.

I dont have a problem paying a very small amount for starting a thread if I was given a subforum to post in.

 

my post for parting a few rx7s in a year and posting in the se section only part trying to help out a few people was deleted.i was told i had to pay....well i mainly sell on ebay so i dont really care ill just sell on ebay i make 3 times as much for parts there anyways.

as far as my real opinion on the whole thing is its like this.everything good usually comes to a end like a forum were the little people can do there selling etc and enjoy helping others with motor builds and hard to find parts....but see when you get people that own a website and money becomes the only thing they care about and they dont understand how hard it is to find rx7 parts etc.well this is what happens.

but oh well thats my 2 cents.and im sure ill hear back from the forum moderators well you have to pay for this or that .but im just saying sonner or later everyone will have to pay 39.00 bucks a month

 

I am on Vacation right now and have a TON of info to add to this discussion.. Dont have time to post it all now but will do so later this week.. ( if this thread is not deleted by then).. I was probally one of the 1st people/Vendors they went after and shut down.. My ads where all pulled except one and I was imformed that I was breaking the rules.. So I went over the rules, went back to the F.S. section and found tons of other members... Vendors/registered users/Moderators breaking the same rule which had just been enforced with me.. The VENDOR MODERATOR and a Certain ADMIN MOD and I had some choice words with each other... I made some comments and comparisons that did not go over well... the the back and forth PM's got rather heated...

Long story short I am no longer a Vendor here and I will not post any items for sale in the Classified section.. I will only be responding to WTB's.. I have alot more to tell/talk about and will do so later this week..

Merry Christmas?

 

actually with the last crash we have been trying to make a lot of enforcements. Such as threads like the BAW and other crap threads that slow the servers and clog the board and searches. Off topic threads that crap up the servers are certainly an issue that is being looked at as well, but it seems people understand that and don't consider that enforcement a personal attack.

A general clean up of the board is needed regardless of if people think it is needed. The current mods see that.

I don't think that anyone is trying to run off anyone...
but if you get your panties in a bunch because a few rules are being enforced that were not being enforced 6 months ago or a year ago... well that is your problem.
and lets face it Kevin. Someone will always fill the void. If people leave it will be their loss.

Just look at how many people are in your biz right now... how many new people pop up each year claiming to undercut you or atkins or pineapple.

I certainly would not like to see any member leave... but if you do over something as pissy as this (and as you can see from the true paying vendors replies- this whole compliant is pissy) well again, it would be your loss.


actually real clear on that in the classifieds rules...:

 

ok I also sell a lot on E-bay too as most not all users on any forum are looking for a deal and some are looking for somthing for free and as a business that is something I cant afford..
being a paying vendor\sponsor of this forum I dont have a problem as that is a write off and is a cost of business in my mind..

On selling on this forum in certon sections I have known for years that it was not alowed and that is why I did not post much as a for sale thread of my own.. I would however answer thoes asking on WTB.
the old format told us this in big bold letters on the home page This new fromat does not say that anywhere on the home page..

Just like with the E-bay links are not allowed in any post and I have known this for years too. Am I guilty of doing this anyway Yes and when it was in the announcement section that is is not allowed I took it as a reminder..

Dan

 

What a lot of PPL may not realize is that a forum of this size costs alot of money in both storage and bandwidth to keep this going, with the speed that we all love seeing. Ryan was having problems trying to keep the upgrades and speed going on the budget that he had. He started this as a love and it grew beyond his dreams. So to keep this going he sold it to a bigger company that has lots of backing. But they can not afford to support other PPLs businesses. So in all fairness they need our support to keep this on the up and up, and allow forum members the internet space to hang out,

My suggestions would be to come up with a pay as you go deal. Maybe monthly or by the number of ads that you want.

PPL like Landers is a plus to the community, and he has built his business and rep here. And he is willing to help just about everyone. I know that as a small business, supporting his family, money can be tight. My thoughts would be to come up with something that would fit your budget and help support the forums at the same time would be cost effective. Your target PPL are here! I really dont think anyone is trying to chase away members. I know that your time is money, and that time is appreciated by all, (or just about) here on the forums.

If the Owners and Mods could come up with a smaller package it might be helpful to all.

just my 2 cents worth! ;-)
Kathy

 

I'm sorry but by the below listed information posted in your classified threads it sure looks like you are in "Business".

Anyone Need There Rx-7 Worked On In Easter Nc?
IF THERE IS ANYONE IN EASTERN NC AROUNDTHAT NEEDS THERE RX-7 WORKED ON I RUN A SHOP IN WASHINGTON NC I WORK ON RX-7 CARS ONLY AND HAVE BEEN FOR THE PAST 8 YEARS I BUILD MOTORS AND DO JUST ABOUT ANYTHING YOU NEED DONE TO A RX-7.IF YOUR NEAR ME AND NEED SOME WORK DONR OR WANT TO HAVE A RX-7 BUILT MAYBE I CAN HELP YOU OUT.JUST PM ME OR EMAIL ME IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS COOLCARS44@PEOPLEPC.COM I ALSO TOW CARS SO IF YOUR A LITTLE FURTHER AWAY I CAN HELP MOVE WHAT YOU GOT IF IM WORKING ON YOUR 7.

Anyone Need A Motor Built? Or There Rx7 Worked On?im In Eastern Nc (https://www.rx7club.com/images/misc/multipage.gif 1 2)
coolcars44

 

We'll said sir, yet I still dont think the mods/admins understand this principle because rx7doctor is like a robot when it comes to quoting the gay forum rules. Also why do you care so much? Your not getting paid, no special benefits, nothing. Maybe all you guys should have a little kumbaya and discuss whats better for the forum and users that arent dealers and just selling parts off there car. Believe it or not, we enjoy working on our cars, hence the selling. If you guys can stomach the fact that your "requesting" money from a NON-PROFIT "organiztion, cool. Basically we will be losing money completely due to selling parts on this forum. Do you think its far for us to pay to be a member from this forum? Maybe you should ask everyone to pay and see how many people come back. . So who are the real crooks? Now its time for me to post some parts forsale because I jsut got done tearing down my long block for my single section. Can I expect it to get deleted, probably......

 

OK, cool.. So what business to I operate??

 

Can Everyone try to make this more positive instead of a bitch session? If we dont have ideas then things will stay the same. All they are asking is that if you want to advertise, pay for it, if not they can allways remove the for sale sections. So come up with some ideas.

my 2 cents

 

If they were more open minded this wouldnt be an issue

 

So Ideas???? Give them options to change! These PPL own several Car Clubs and has pulls with the MFG. It can be a help in the long run, but only if you want to help the change for a positive! ;-)

 

Actually, even the PAYING ADVERTISERS are NOT ALLOWED TO SELL IN THE CLASSIFIEDS. You pay all that money monthly and still are confined to the little area at the very top that not as many people go into on a regular basis...certainly not when looking for used parts.

The way I see it, there need to be several "tiers" of seller:

1) base package for a small monthly or yearly fee that lets you post in the classifieds only, with perhaps a one line link or sentence in your sig indicating what you do (no banner in sig). Say 25-50 bucks per month.

2) larger package for the more established guys that lets you run a link/banner in your sig/have more sig text than normal users, and have your name as a "sponsor" of one of the forum sections (such as regional, etc.). You still get access to sell in the classifieds as well. Say $75-100 per month.

3) largest package for the big timers that gives you your own section/subforum at the top as well as all of the above listed benefits (sig and ability to post in classifieds). Say, I dunno, $100-200 a month?

Note that ALL PAYING SPONSORS should have access to sell in the classifieds as they wish, otherwise it is a waste of money.

This would allow more people to participate and overall the forum would make more money and the community would benefit because of more outlets for parts and services.

IF a sponsorship structure like this were adopted I would have no problem paying the forum. However, when I make 2 grand or less some months, it'd be hard to justify giving this forum $200-400 (the old advertising rates under Ryan) PER MONTH wouldn't it now? Sure there are months where I make a lot more than that, but on average I make the same amount of money or less that many of you guys make at your regular 9-5 dayjobs.

The rotary business is not exactly lucrative. The rx7 business is slowly dying off IMO, I have seen a slow decline in the number of requests for work, quality of parts being sold and price of parts being sold. These cars are getting older, the owners are getting younger, and a lot of them are being parted out and junked so the demand gets lower with time.

Also, Chris, it is unfair of you to say that I built my business on this forum. Back when I used to sell used parts solely, back in 1999-2003, that *might* have been the case. Since I started building engines in 02, it has been my WEBSITE that has drawn in almost all the business. Sure, this forum helped the cause because everyone already knew me from my sales of parts, but my engine business stands on its own without this forum. Just like you, if this forum takes down your sig and banner today, your website will continue getting hits on a daily basis for years to come simply by word of mouth among individuals on and off of this forum.

You'd be SURPRISED how many people I deal with who have no clue that this forum is even here. They wind up needing parts for their car to make it run again and I ask them if they are registered on rx7club, to come here and look for someone selling their parts, and they say no. It is literally about half and half for me; half the people are on this forum, half could give 2 ***** about car forums and just found my website by browising links on the net, search engines, etc.

I do a lot of local and regional work from word of mouth. "My cousin's brother's dog's uncle had one of these cars and you built his motor, I just bought an rx7 so he told me to come to you...".

 

None. Nobody has ever been able to do it, and still cannot, and probably never will, unless I get out of the game myself.

I fully expect any paying vendors to support the forum admins and such rather than the other side. Because they have been sitting there shelling out tons of money to the forum the whole time, and this 'enforcement" can only serve them whether or not it is fair to the other 99.9% here.

let me tell you a little story. A couple or 3 years ago I was a forum sponsor, complete with banner and all. There were no options as far as advertising, you either did, or you didn't. IF you did, you got a subforum, a banner, and (apparently at the time) the ability to post in the classifieds unrestricted. At the time Ryan wanted $400 per month for this, which to me is about as much as a car payment on a nice new vehicle or the better part of a house payment in this part of the country. Anyway, I think he "graciously" gave me a couple months as a "trial" for $250/mo instead of full price, so I paid up front for that.

It took 2 or 3 months for the banner to be placed after my hounding, and since the banners rotate, I didn't see it immediately when it was finally posted. So I never knew when the 2 months actually started. I figured, well, since Ryan is so concerned about the big bucks, he will let me know when the 2 months are up and we will try to work out a solid long term deal.

Well, that never happened. The banner ran for a while, then was taken down at some point and nothing was ever said to me again. I figure, why should I have to chase him down to hand over money to him? Communication was impossible, and apparently still is.

In threads where Ryan mentioned that the forum was having hardware issues I constantly offered to sponsor or donate money outright (and I did a couple of times send donations) and never got any reply about it. Just continual bitching about the problems, but doing nothing to fix them.

So you'll forgive me if I don't bow down at the thought of forum sponsorship and trying to get things done through the forum administration.

 

Without getting off on another huge tangent...... We have never had a problem posting for sale items up or even launching new products from the "For Sale" section as a Forum Vendor, we do not have a vendor sub-forum because we opted not to have one. This is/was an option when we started sponsoring the forum, I really did not want the headaches of moderating my own sub-forum.


Merry Christmas to all, and to all......

 

By the wording of a PM I was given, even paying advertisers are not allowed to post in the classifieds by rule. Both djseven and japan2la were shut down for doing exactly that in spite of the fact that they are both paying advertisers. I have not seen you post anything for sale in a little while, since the witch hunt began, so this is probably why nothing has been said. I would lay money on it that if you made a couple of FS posts right now you'd receive a PM from a 'vendor moderator".

Thanks for your participation in this thread.

 

OK I want to say one thing...

THIS IS REDICULOUS..... I have sold MANY THINGS on here in the last year to MANY people... did I pay fees NO.... was I making any REAL money doing this NO... Was I at time cutting even or in the hole on a deal YES.... Did I do it to make alot of money or for an alternate source of income NO.... I did it because if I had 2-3 deals go down a week that would put a bag of pampers in my house for my 3 kids.... It may give me an extra 10-15.00 to fill my gas tank for 4 days so I can make my 20 mile drive each way to my REAL 8-5:30 job..

I am not a business... I am DAVID HENSLER.... thats it I work at an Import car parts store that SPECIALIZES in Mercedes Benz, Acura, VW, Lexus, JAG, Honda, Mazda.. you know IMPORTS.... but how many of your corner store parts stores sell parts for our cars??? NOT MANY... and the parts that they do sell is stuff we sell like plugs, wires, filters, belts, clutch slave and master cylinders, brake parts, clutches etc.... What am I doing.. I am buying these parts from my job and selling them to you guys... I get them for a lower price because I WORK 10hours a day to sell these parts to the public... I have to pay my work (which they make money and profit from me) in order to sell these parts.... and I offer them most the time at a very low price TO HELP EVERYONE... the buyer and myself. Like I said in the year I have been selling stuff I have profited under 1000.00 divide that by 12 months that is LESS then 100.00 PROFIT a month... Think about this..

I have 3 kids (4yr old, 2yr old, and 4mo old).. I have a wife who is a stay at home mom..

I work 8:00-5:30 M-F and every other Saturday 8-3p just to pay my rent, bills, gas in our cars, take care of my family ETC.... This year at my job I made LESS then 30K

Then after a long hard day at work I go home ignore my family for 3-4 hours to try and make an extra 20.00 a WEEK selling people on this forum EVERY DAY ITEMS...

I had my selling privelages and my sig removed... I was told I could no longer operate like I was and in the last 2 months since this has happened I have profited 41.58

I come on the forum.. I offer advise I post pictures of techinical stuff I help others with problems on their cars and I have the ability to help others with parts to they may need and now I cant do that.... I offer all the support I have and spend all the time I do on this forum away from my family.. and this is the pay back I get from this "CLUB"

BULL ****.... that is EXACTLY what it is... This forum has proved one thing in the last couple months..... If they cant get there hands in everyone pocket they have no care or worry or NEED for them...

What about those who are higher up.. mods, admins, etc.. do you guys DONATE CASH to the forum... ALL OF YOU... I highly doubt it.. most the time all you guys do is DONATE your opinion... whch normally says

"read the FAQ"
or
"REPOST"
or
"Your stupid"
OR
"SEARCH"

WTF... if I wanted to be bashed or see others bashed by the suposide "LEADERS" of a forum I would go to a 10yr old and under club....

I'm tired of the politics and plain ole bullshit here....

What ever happen to having a froum where everyone is out to help everyone... to keep the CARS alive and to ENJOY the game....


David Hensler
Spooled up Racing
4333 Cordes NW
Comstock Park , MI 49321
616-389-3270
SpooledupRacing@comcast.net

If anyone needs ANYTHING, parts, help or just want to talk.. hit me up I will ALWAYS be here for those who care about the GAME AND THE CARS AND THE FRIENDSHIPS we build!!! Cause in the end thats the ONLY DAMN THING THAT MATTERS!!!!

 

why dont they just charge for each post you want to post like f.s. add or part out car add.

this would one keep the thread post to a minimum.also this would be kinda like what ebay does .so say like 50cent for each f.s. thread.really who cant afford 50cent -75cent a thread?

im just trying to throw out some ideas.and what they could do on here is just bill you monthy on what ya post up as far as thread starters.NOT WTB threads

 

Globalization?

Guess thats all whats happening. 'Evil forum' has to come to its real name for all of us - at some point.