mefarri

iTrader: (2)

Just try and find the online weights for the bare long blocks. Should be easy to find. People forget there's a lot of iron in the rotary.

RCCAZ 1

iTrader: (10)

So, do you use electromotive just because it's the lowest cost solution for 4 rotor operation? I believe that Koseki (owner of Scoot in Japan) controls his NA 4 rotor using 2 Power FCs. Not sure how he phases them, but last I checked that's what he was using.

Weightwise then, a 4 rotor is pretty close to the stock turbocharged FD REW engine?

Thanks again Logan! Keep up the excellent work!

GtoRx7.

iTrader: (12)

Electromotive is actually one of the more expensive standalones, but we use them due to their highly accurate timing systems. Plus we have had a long standing relationship with them. Power FC isnt exactly the most accurate at high rpm or fast engine acceleration.

Correct a n/a 4-rotor done with typical methods will weigh the same as the twin turbo 13b.

David Hayes

iTrader: (6)

Logan, been following this thread for some time and thought I'd weigh in on the conversation.

First, beautiful work on both the NA 3 rotor and now the 4 rotor. Can't wait to see the 4 rotor in person as with the ubiquitous nature (somewhat joking here) of 3 rotor builds, you are setting the standard again with the 4 rotor. Nothing like that amount of NA power and the sound of the engine will be great (sorry Gordon ).

As the owner of a single turbo 3 rotor, I'd respectfully disagree with your comments about the tightness of the package. To me, the engine and turbo looks like it was meant to fit in the bay. When I see an NA 3 rotor, it looks way too empty. And with the difference in torque and power potential over an NA motor, for me it's the way to go. There are not that many pure drivers like Gordon that prefer the NA 3 rotor route and I've driven his car and the response and power was really nice. Most guys want power and it clearly can be had in gobs with the addition of a turbo and with today's billet versions, you've really got a crap load of instant torque. Seems like a no brainer to me.

Regarding cost, I'm in Gordon's shoes by having spent way too much on the build, with a lot of it coming from having to rework what wasn't done correctly the first time. Yes, RCCAZ, you can control the cost of a 3 rotor build by doing proper planning upfront and it is my experience that a well sorted out single turbo 3 rotor can be done professionally for around $35 - 40K. Really shouldn't cost more than that if you add up all the necessary components and labor needed for the swap. This will get you a nicely mechanically functioning conversion but no additional stuff like body work or interior pieces. These items can and usually do easily drive the build cost over $50K.

mefarri

iTrader: (2)

Wow you really don't know what you're talking about when it comes to LS stuff. There are plenty of twin turbo ls powered FDs. All of them fit inside stock frame rails. Do some research next time. Even throwing out the turbo doesn't make an NA 3 or 4 rotor cost effective compared to an ls swap. You can buy bolt on parts and build a 400+ ci pump gas ls motor and make damn near if not 600whp all day. For probably 1/4 of your cost. Again, if you're paying for that emotional side of it, fine. But on shear numbers, a rotary will never win.

mefarri

iTrader: (2)

And an na rotary is not more reliable than an ls. Sorry, just not true. They're far more reliable than turbo rotaries ill give you that. But pump the brakes. Also, saying you can't make 700-1000 with a turbo ls in an FD is hilarious. There are probably as many people doing just that as there are people making that with turbo 20b's.

mefarri

iTrader: (2)

Sure. Like I said, I had planned to. But then you posted all that so I replied... Sorry for shedding some facts on the situation. Carry on.

zbrown

This thread is ******* LOL. I feel like i am reading through newb posts on tech

So much that is so damn funny, carry on

ninesixtwo

iTrader: (9)

Funny, I didn't really see any facts in your posts - just more of the typical LS guy bullshit. Get back to your tiny section of the forum and stay out of an otherwise awesome thread.

mefarri

iTrader: (2)

The only thing that wasn't a fact is the reliability statement. Although I think the evidence is pretty overwhelming on my side. Nice try big guy.

For the record, I like this thread a lot. Like I said, I like a good rotary. But don't let your fan boyism cloud your reasoning.

zbrown

Dur dur for the retard,

Look they only fit back by the muffler!!

mefarri

iTrader: (2)

And there's no way he made 911 on pump gas either. Not possible as seen above. And he sure as **** doesn't have less in that whole engine setup than the 4 rotor e shaft costs.

dradon03

iTrader: (2)

All I see is hanging parts, and intercooler tubing which will be crunched going over a dip in the highway.

Logan has done something we should all appreciate. From hypothesis to proof he designed, built and proved his setup and has put miles on it, kudos.

So many people have these delusions of grandeur, just because you can glue Popsicle sticks together that looks like the Eiffel Tower, doesn't make it the Eiffel tower.

Get the car running put 10,000 miles on it and report backed up with dyno numbers and then talk. That goes without mentioning the extra 50 pounds ahead of the front wheels?.....

bufferovrflo

iTrader: (7)

Great thread so far; unfortunate it had to turn into Nasioc childish bickering. Let get some updates to get this greatness back on track please!

zbrown

Lol awesome

Funny that guys that have never had a turbo lsx rx7 bash

I have had and tuned my car with a na rotary, turbo rotary, na lsx, and turbo lsx.......i have experienced them all....... unlike the majority of ignorant hippies spouting here

I like rotaries, just funny as **** when people who have absolutely no clue start talking this and that


I havent touched my forged shortblock since i put it in 4 years ago..... reliability and power sucks

And it has been abused

GtoRx7.

iTrader: (12)

Hey David glad to see you at the party! I should have clarified a little more, the 20b turbo looks excellent in the engine bay. Building and fabricating a 20b turbo however is cramped, tedious and makes you an old man fast. So in short I would own and drive a turbo 20b all day long, but would pay someone else to build/maintain it. Same is true of a all stock FD. I'd drive one, but refuse to work on it unless I'm getting paid lol. In terms of sheer power/weight a turbo 20b is very hard to beat.


Ok so I take the blame for this getting off track, I stated many things that needed rebuttal.

So some ending points- I know much more about LS than your average bear, and I own domestic V8 stuff.




I can tolerate many things, but dont come into my thread and call me a retard. Thanks. Now thanks for posting the picture, it proves what I was saying. Sure you CAN shove two turbos onto the LS in a FD. But I meant a FD that could be driven on public roads without smashing something. An iron block LS with twin turbos..... being a fabricator for a living..... that makes my hands and back hurt looking at it.



SO END OF ALL THAT STUFF I promise only 3-4 rotor updates from this point on!

GtoRx7.

iTrader: (12)

I dont think anyone has said LS motors are unreliable. I certainly havent. I only stated that a n/a rotary is more reliable than one. Its a moot point at that point because they both will outlast the chassis lol.

zbrown

That is why the lord blessed us poor fc guys with a massive bay

Grant M

thats some nice cars there, are they turbo or NA or rotaorised?

the only thing missing from this thread is the guy who has a 13B turbo in his Nova, he must be the hated most out of all the haters!!

looking forward to the updates

mefarri

iTrader: (2)

Jesus. I guess you missed where I said he already made 911whp on pump. It's every bit of a street car too if you retards would do some research. So you're saying you know a decent amount about ls stuff yet pretty much everything you said about turboin one in an FD was patently false. Yea ok.

Ill out the ground clearance on my turbo ls FD up against any turbo FD for that matter.

I've never been in a rotary verse ls argument personally before but it's living up to every stereotype I've heard of before. It's like talking to flat earthers.

allenhah

iTrader: (4)

Matt, you need to calm down.

We respect your V8 build, and it's probably really great, but you gotta stop calling everybody that disagrees with you "retards" and let us follow this great build thread without turning it into a flame war. You're sounding like a troll when you do that.

Please, enjoy your car and have fun with it, but get out of here with all the negativity. That goes for all of us too...let's be adults here.

mefarri

iTrader: (2)

No one is worked up. At least I'm not. All I was saying is don't go saying things can't be done or are "impossible" when they've been done and are continuing to be done by the people you're arguing against. And don't expect to make those statements and then not have someone call bullshit. If you can't cope with that, you're going to have problems. Saying that, I'm done as long as someone doesn't say something else completely off base.

Grant M

Off base?? How about......... Breasts. Natural or enhanced?

I just like cars and engineering and that's what this thread is about so enjoy guys.

GtoRx7.

iTrader: (12)

Thanks Grant! My cougar is getting a 408w stroker just a nice 302 at the moment. Cuda is a joint project of Matt's and mine which is a twin turbo 440, pro-street car. Will be sold for some fun money. The Roadrunner is Matts, and is also getting a 383/440 hybrid build for high rpm

Natural and well shaped. Enhanced however is better than a floppy pair of natural haha. Good change of subject :-)

Grant M

Thanks, I feel it was need to break the tension.

I will swap you my Rx 4 for the cuda. Along with a picture of a pert pair of natural breasts? Now that a bargain

Back on topic. 4 rotor please.