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So with all the spare time I've had on my hands lately, I've been tearing into my FD build project. Very disappointed today after discovering the FMIC install had more hacking involved than the PO let on or that I was able to find during the pre purchase inspection. Hopefully some of you FD vets will take a gander at the pictures below and help me ID any missing parts here... Here's a shot of the driver's side. Notice the cut-out area on the right side, roughly following the hood release cable. Also, I can only find one bolt hole in the area that will support the stock battery tray - I picked up a used one so I could relocate the battery back under the hood where it belongs, looks like I'm missing some brackets to install it? Similar cut-out section on passenger side, though as the next 2 pictures show, these cuts are more savage.
Here's a shot of the front with the bumper removed. The bumper was missing the reinforcement beam, and the plastic air splitter piece. I picked up a used R1 dual oil cooler setup that I'll be installing. Anything else missing here? The aftermarket radiator mount seemed janky - the radiator "pegs" on the bottom set in the factory rubber mount points, but that was about all there was supporting the rad once the FMIC was removed. Here's the R1 oil cooler piping. Looks like I'm missing (or lost in my shop!) the fitting needed to connect one of the hoses to the pass. side cooler. One last picture - I noticed in the FSM that it doesn't say anything about replacing those O-rings in the oil cooler line fittings. Thought that was odd, and I'm inclined to replace them anyway, especially since these are used lines. Anyone know the Mazda part # or size of these rings? Pulling one out might trash them, since they are in there TIGHT.
The air splitter and stuff on the bumper not being installed isn’t that big of a shocker. It would be largely in the way of a FMIC set up. The cuts that were done were rough but were only on angles to the core support that provide no mounting supports. The battery tray bolts to the stock intercooler crossbar IIRC. You don’t have this bar because I’m sure your radiator was probably vertically mounted with your FMIC?
Overall, TBH, nothing too crazy or out of the ordinary IMO.
Some FMIC kits do trim some of that metal, that is typical. It's not structural so you're fine there. I would probably clean up the cuts a little bit, remove the surface rust, and paint it to seal the metal in to prevent future rust.
Stock, the rubber feet on the bottom of the radiator go into the holes in the 2 swaybar mounts. That kit had new holes for the rad to go into, those are bolted to the stock sway bar mounts by drilling 2 holes into the mounts and 2 bolts/nuts. You can get just the swaybar mounts from Mazda if those need to be replaced, it's not uncommon for them to be bent. There are also aftermarket versions out there that are stiffer or better designed.
There is a stamped sheet metal cross brace that goes from the 2 bolt tab that sticks out of each frame rail. Stock, the intercooler, AC lines, airbox, and battery tray bolt to it. The battery tray has 2 bolts that go to the frame rail and 1 going to that cross brace if memory serves.
You got away pretty cleanly for a FMIC install, some remove the main structural bar in the front and I've seen the tabs that brace bolts to removed. My buddy Jon's car was like that, took a LOT of work to fix that.
Also, you can upgrade the horns, look for my thread on Nissan Quest horns. I used to have a Quest and noticed the horns just sounded like a regular horn instead of the high-pitched stock horn. Got some from a junkyard for cheap and they bolt up easily and plug right in. Not totally necessary but easy to do right now.
The air splitter and stuff on the bumper not being installed isn’t that big of a shocker. It would be largely in the way of a FMIC set up. The cuts that were done were rough but were only on angles to the core support that provide no mounting supports. The battery tray bolts to the stock intercooler crossbar IIRC. You don’t have this bar because I’m sure your radiator was probably vertically mounted with your FMIC?
Overall, TBH, nothing too crazy or out of the ordinary IMO.
Matt
Yeah Matt, it is a Megan racing radiator that was mounted in a nearly vertical position, and PO plumbed it with flex hoses. No AST installed. I should be able to reuse the radiator as it's in decent condition. PO tack welded a piece of AL bar stock to the radiator at a thick point up top on the pass. side, and screwed the other end of the bar stock to the same cross bar piece that the bumper bolts up to under the hood. That tack weld has since broken in the few hundred miles I've driven the car.
Originally Posted by DaleClark
Some FMIC kits do trim some of that metal, that is typical. It's not structural so you're fine there. I would probably clean up the cuts a little bit, remove the surface rust, and paint it to seal the metal in to prevent future rust.
Check Dale, was planning on cleaning up & rust proofing that mess. POR15 coating to prevent rust, and a top coat of paint. If I get ambitious, I might repaint the whole engine bay.
Originally Posted by DaleClark
Stock, the rubber feet on the bottom of the radiator go into the holes in the 2 swaybar mounts. That kit had new holes for the rad to go into, those are bolted to the stock sway bar mounts by drilling 2 holes into the mounts and 2 bolts/nuts. You can get just the swaybar mounts from Mazda if those need to be replaced, it's not uncommon for them to be bent. There are also aftermarket versions out there that are stiffer or better designed.
I'll have to double check the sway bar mounts to see if they are bent - it looks like all the bending is in the FMIC brackets that bolt to the stock sway bar mounts. Roughly what angle off of horizontal, (up or down) are the sway bar mount surfaces that seat the radiator pegs/rubber grommets supposed to go?
Originally Posted by DaleClark
There is a stamped sheet metal cross brace that goes from the 2 bolt tab that sticks out of each frame rail. Stock, the intercooler, AC lines, airbox, and battery tray bolt to it. The battery tray has 2 bolts that go to the frame rail and 1 going to that cross brace if memory serves.
That cross brace looks easy to fix then - Either find a used stock piece or just get a section of AL or steel square/rectangular section tubing and DIY fab it. That would solve the battery mount problem, and provide a means to mount a large IC in a SMIC configuration once the radiator orientation goes back to stock.
Originally Posted by DaleClark
You got away pretty cleanly for a FMIC install, some remove the main structural bar in the front and I've seen the tabs that brace bolts to removed. My buddy Jon's car was like that, took a LOT of work to fix that.
Also, you can upgrade the horns, look for my thread on Nissan Quest horns. I used to have a Quest and noticed the horns just sounded like a regular horn instead of the high-pitched stock horn. Got some from a junkyard for cheap and they bolt up easily and plug right in. Not totally necessary but easy to do right now.
Dale
Yup, it could have been a lot worse on the mechanical side. Electrically, I'm finding that some of the front harness wiring is buggered up, but since I'm on a Link ECU/single turbo, and I'm tackling a full ECU rewire anyway, I think I'll be cleaning up the front & engine harnesses too. Hadn't thought about upgrading the horns - they do sound ridiculously wimpy! Might be worth adding to the "while I'm in there..." list.
Originally Posted by j9fd3s
the O rings are N3A1-14-604, i've never seen one, or sold one...
Thanks for the part #. I'm surprised that apparently no one replaces these, being that Mazda generally advises replacement of every applicable sealing component (e.g., O-rings, crush washers, gaskets) whenever an assembly is taken apart.
many of us prefer the batter relocated to the passenger bin
more airflow through the radiator
one less thing to heat soak in the engine bay
better weight distribution
ymmv
many of us prefer the batter relocated to the passenger bin
more airflow through the radiator
one less thing to heat soak in the engine bay
better weight distribution
ymmv
Mine already is, unfortunately it isn't a clean & safe install... Adjacent + & - cables run together, and are routed under the car adjacent to fuel lines. That plus no circuit breaker protection at the battery is a recipe for a time bomb. Plus it's basically a regular size battery in there, which means I can't replace the battery when it eventually dies without taking apart the bins first
Plan A is to move the battery back under the hood, but most likely switch to a Miata sized battery. That would be a lot better for maintenance & servicing, I'd get that bin back for storage and it would probably give me enough room to fit the IC plumbing. It's a single turbo and no cats, so heat soaking under the hood isn't much of a problem. If it doesn't fit the IC plumbing when I start mocking it up, plan B will be to upgrade the PO's rear bin installation to fix all the safety issues and make it more maintainable.
Thanks for the part #. I'm surprised that apparently no one replaces these, being that Mazda generally advises replacement of every applicable sealing component (e.g., O-rings, crush washers, gaskets) whenever an assembly is taken apart.
traditionally with Mazda the $9 o ring is fine, and the $900 thing its on is bad?
Originally Posted by Pete_89T2
...That plus no circuit breaker protection at the battery is a recipe for a time bomb...
the NA and NB Miatae have the battery in the trunk, no circuit breaker. they run both cables together they go in the PPF, so they are well out of the way of anything normal. not saying a circuit breaker isn't a bad idea, but there are plenty of examples of rear batteries without them
traditionally with Mazda the $9 o ring is fine, and the $900 thing its on is bad?
the NA and NB Miatae have the battery in the trunk, no circuit breaker. they run both cables together they go in the PPF, so they are well out of the way of anything normal. not saying a circuit breaker isn't a bad idea, but there are plenty of examples of rear batteries without them
The expensive fitting part looks fine, and the O-rings seem fine too -- replacing the rings is just a preventive maintenance thing. I've gotten so used to replacing sealing components whenever I take something apart it's a habit.
These battery cables dangle down a lot more than I'd like, and the way they cross over the tunnel isn't too smart.... One zip-tie failure and I've got a full battery current unprotected short near fuel lines. And the PO used welding cable that has a softer and less robust insulation on it than proper automotive battery cable, so any chaffing from vibration will wear right thru the insulation pretty easily.
I think you're on the right track, Pete. Personally I'm not a fan of battery relocation - sometimes you HAVE to, but 9 times out of 10 the cars I've seen with relocations have had weird starting/charging issues. That and a rear mount battery is a bitch to get do and deal with to jump start/charge/remove. I understand some IC setups you HAVE to do it, but I'd rather not - the negatives outweigh the positives.
On the oil cooler O-rings I don't think I've EVER seen one leak or be a problem. No idea why, seems like they would. If the O-rings are visually OK I'd run them.
For the cross brace you can make your own. I did a number of years ago, got some aluminum channel from McMaster-Carr, cut to length, drilled holes to mount it to the stock tabs, then did some notching and added some Riv-Nuts to make places to bolt down whatever is needed. With my FMIC it made sense. Once I had it the way I wanted I had it powder coated, it's been working great.
The stock bar is easier to go with and requires a lot less fab work (obviously).
I think you're on the right track, Pete. Personally I'm not a fan of battery relocation - sometimes you HAVE to, but 9 times out of 10 the cars I've seen with relocations have had weird starting/charging issues. That and a rear mount battery is a bitch to get do and deal with to jump start/charge/remove. I understand some IC setups you HAVE to do it, but I'd rather not - the negatives outweigh the positives.
Agree, unless there's a really good reason to relocate the battery, it's not worth all the negatives that go with it.
Originally Posted by DaleClark
On the oil cooler O-rings I don't think I've EVER seen one leak or be a problem. No idea why, seems like they would. If the O-rings are visually OK I'd run them.
The rings do look fine, don't see any visible signs of damage and the fit is tight when assembled - I lubed the fittings with a bit of fresh oil and did a test fit yesterday which went well; now I just need to get a few more of those metal clips to secure them cause I'm missing a few. I'll see if I can cross-ref the Mazda O-ring part # to an actual O-ring size/material spec, and then see if they are available on McMaster-Carr or elsewhere. They probably are.
Originally Posted by DaleClark
For the cross brace you can make your own. I did a number of years ago, got some aluminum channel from McMaster-Carr, cut to length, drilled holes to mount it to the stock tabs, then did some notching and added some Riv-Nuts to make places to bolt down whatever is needed. With my FMIC it made sense. Once I had it the way I wanted I had it powder coated, it's been working great.
The stock bar is easier to go with and requires a lot less fab work (obviously).
Dale
That's exactly what I'm thinking; it's a straight shot, so a pretty easy fab job. Probably won't bother hunting down a stock part for that when it's so easy to fab and fabbing it gives me a bit more design flexibility WRT creating IC mounts with it.
One thing I am still stumped with is radiator/AC condenser mounting. The way the PO had it, the radiator was mostly supported by gravity - sitting almost upright in the 2x peg mounts, with a single tack welded piece of AL stock that was bolted to the bumper support up top. If I revert to stock layout, the rad/condenser will be almost laying down, but what support supports the top or sides of the radiator? Gravity alone won't work well in that kind of configuration.
Were there radiator supports/ears sticking out where those cuts were made? Looking at the thing as it sits now, and not knowing what was there originally, it seems there were no reasons to cut anything to get that FMIC to fit.
If you look on the very far right side of this picture you'll see a black round rubber mount that screws into a tab coming off the frame rail, it has a stud sticking up out of it. That's the stock radiator mount, there's one on each side.
Stock the radiator has the rubber feet on the pegs at the bottom that fit into the holes in the sway bar bracket. The stock radiator has small ear brackets bolted to the upper left and right side. You put the rubber feet into the holes then lean it forward and the brackets go over the studs on that rubber mount. 2 10mm nuts on each mount and it's done.
If you look up some of the Koyo radiator install threads I think there's some pictures of how it installs. With thicker rads like the Koyo you sometimes have to do some minor mods, either trimming or flipping the mounts upside-down to get everything to fit.
Thanks Dale! Just checked and both of those rubber studded mounts are still there Doesn't look like my existing Megan racing rad will drop in as easily as the Koyo, but I think I can make it work.
i just checked the O ring, N3A1-14-604, and Mazda USA supersedes it to the connector, N3G1-14-850A, but it looks like Mazda Japan will still sell you the O ring,
04-25-20, 07:17 PM
Doesn't look like my existing Megan racing rad will drop in as easily as the Koyo, but I think I can make it work.
