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Broken Time Sert...what now?

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Old Apr 18, 2016 | 10:17 PM
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Broken Time Sert...what now?

So I just got my engine back from being rebuilt and put on the exhaust manifold to start mocking things up. In my haste I misread the FSM and torqued to 70ft/lbs. 1 of the 4 studs held. So I talk to my friend who is a Mazda tech and he points me to some m10x1.50 time serts. I got them in today and follow procedure and just did all 4 while I was doing it.

The top 2 held 50ft/lbs, but both bottom holes pulled the new threads out and broke the time serts. Not sure what to do now, any advice?










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Old Apr 18, 2016 | 11:47 PM
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Pretty much all you can do is go up another size.

Unless you know a really good tig welder.
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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 12:15 AM
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What do you mean "time sert"?
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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 12:23 AM
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Heli coil??
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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 12:35 AM
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Originally Posted by SA3R
What do you mean "time sert"?
They work way better than a helicoil

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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 04:04 AM
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There are oversize timeserts, that will still take the 10x1.5. Had one done on cylinder head where the plug hole had been cross-threaded and stripped out twice.

Didn't by chance use a conventional tap?
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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 07:05 AM
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Originally Posted by billyboy
There are oversize timeserts, that will still take the 10x1.5. Had one done on cylinder head where the plug hole had been cross-threaded and stripped out twice.

Didn't by chance use a conventional tap?
Yeah, after some quick research I am going with the big sert to fix it and stay M10x1.5.

Why do people comment if they have no clue on how to fix something...
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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 07:52 AM
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Go with a larger time sert that will accept a m10x1.5 stud. I would install them with red lock tite and let cure overnight. I've used these many times this way to repair stripped out aluminum cylinder heads.
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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 11:15 AM
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From: Wherever the Army Sends Me
Originally Posted by billyboy
There are oversize timeserts, that will still take the 10x1.5. Had one done on cylinder head where the plug hole had been cross-threaded and stripped out twice.

Didn't by chance use a conventional tap?
No, a trusted Mazda tech directed me to time serts as that is what he uses.
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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 11:16 AM
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From: Wherever the Army Sends Me
Originally Posted by IRPerformance
Go with a larger time sert that will accept a m10x1.5 stud. I would install them with red lock tite and let cure overnight. I've used these many times this way to repair stripped out aluminum cylinder heads.
Thanks, that is what I planned on doing.
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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 11:44 AM
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Wow that sucks, 70 lbs is within factory specs. I did mine to that.
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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 12:26 PM
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I thought the FD torque spec for the exhaust studs was somewhere around 34 ft/lbs
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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 12:56 PM
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From: Wherever the Army Sends Me
Originally Posted by Monkman33
I thought the FD torque spec for the exhaust studs was somewhere around 34 ft/lbs
48-56 Ft/lbs IIRC
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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 01:05 PM
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jb weld
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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Show_off
48-56 Ft/lbs IIRC
Look like I need to tighten down my exhaust studs a little more lol
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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 01:56 PM
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Do they make deeper inserts?

The more engagement you can get the stronger it will be.
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Old Apr 19, 2016 | 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Show_off
No, a trusted Mazda tech directed me to time serts as that is what he uses.
Good. I mention it, because someone I lent a kit, replaced the tap in the general tap and die draw after use...a wtf moment if you don't discover that little oversight till later!
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Old Apr 21, 2016 | 08:45 PM
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My BIG SERT kit came in tonight so I drilled, counter sunk, tapped, and insert the sert with loctite tonight...let's hope it holds when I torque it down tomorrow!



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Old Apr 22, 2016 | 06:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Monkman33
I thought the FD torque spec for the exhaust studs was somewhere around 34 ft/lbs
FSM page C-90

65-78 Nm (6.6-8.0 kgf/m, 48-57 Ft/lbs
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Old Apr 22, 2016 | 12:17 PM
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On critical threads a machinist friend taught me to drill a bit under recommended size in a mill/drill press to keep it straight/tight.

Then keep the piece in the clamp and put a lathe point in the drill press and the lathe point in the dimple in the top of the tap handle and work the tap handle and plunge lever together to get really tight threads.
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Old Apr 22, 2016 | 03:30 PM
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She held together at 50ft/lbs! Winning

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Old Apr 22, 2016 | 04:13 PM
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Did you drill them with a hand drill or press/mag drill?

Like the poster above said it was probably slightly oversize holes that caused the first insert to fail, no way around it using a hand drill.

Definitely way better than using a helicoil tho.

I've got a galled stud in my housing i've been contemplating dealing with, I can see what's gonna happen tho, just gonna snap off and then i've gotta drill out an inconel stud not looking forward to it.
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Old Apr 23, 2016 | 08:48 AM
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Since I know you are planning on bringing your car down for tuning once you have it all back together, I am going to let you know right now that the TCA is installed upside down.
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Old Apr 23, 2016 | 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Banzai-Racing
Since I know you are planning on bringing your car down for tuning once you have it all back together, I am going to let you know right now that the TCA is installed upside down.
Chris, thanks! I was racking my brain as to why it didn't look right. I swore the nipple was on the other side close to the engine! Thanks for verifying.

I know you are super busy with tons of your own work, but if you keep an eye on my build thread you'll have a good idea of all the changes that I've made for future reference.
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