So I take it you've never used als seals?

Rotary >Pistons

 

not worth the money IMO, so far. i went with Goopy because the first engine i built had semi worn out 3mm seal slots and replacing them wouldn't have been worthwhile when a simple set of seals sufficed. it took some teeth pulling to get set up as a vendor for the Goopy seals but so far they have not let me down, as well they have similar business goals which is longevity of these engine lines and refurbishing used parts to still work for the long term, even under stressful conditions.

if someone brought an engine and provided or wanted ALS seals i wouldn't tell them no but so far on this site it seems i am pioneering the Goopy seals and one of their few advocates. for the most part my customers are budget builders, so higher dollar parts are a detriment and can cost some jobs to even cheaper builders(while i still believe you can't beat the quality i provide for the price).

where the Atkins/OEM seals failed the Goopy seals picked up the slack. i don't like engines breaking so something's gotta give. tuning/fuel issues almost always kill these turbo engines before they are due and you want something that can take it. as a builder, even if it you're not at fault it eventually looks bad upon you whenever an engine fails(that is my take on it anyways, preventative maintenance from the start, while not trying to sell the moon).


almost every turbo owner eventually wants more power, "a cheap car is not fast and fast car is not cheap". (words from an old friend)

 

I'm having Kevin build my engine with als seals, he's giving me a good price on them.

I just have to take the block out of the car then I'll be dropping both of blocks off and use all the best parts from both towards the build.

Rotary >Pistons

 

i wasn't trying to sell you a rebuild, if you can get it done closer and cheaper then that is good. i'm booked for a while anyways.

 

Its all good , you and Kevin are probably both building engines everyday for a reason-because you're both great builders.



Rotary >Pistons

 

Ok Rotaryevolution I am sold on goopy seals, how in the world can I contact you, have tried phone # and website without luck

 

send me another PM with your number, sometimes i just don't get around to digging through all the spam in my email.

 

RA Super Seals are great IMO i had 30,000 beat the hell out of miles on my S4/S5/S6 rebuild ran the s4 omp no premix and is still running strong 15 psi boost 10000 rpm rev limit self tuned lt10s and even survived a walbro that burnt out and 1 venom 1000 cc injector that died at wot.

 

wonder if there's any chatter if you actually take it to 10k, i personally would never run more than 9k with a metallic seal.

 

Damn that's a lot of abuse, I hope my als seals hold up like those. I'll not have nearly the power you're running.

Rotary >Pistons

 

I've Rockwell tested Mazda apex seals, and looked at them under a metallurgical microscope. They are hard, but they aren't some magical unattainable hardness. I could get H13 to a similar, if not the same hardness. H13 has tremendous thermal resistance, (It holds it's hardness/toughness even when under thermal loads.) Temperature resistance and hardness vs. price is my goal.

 

whats the reason for premix on ra seals

 

goopy group buy RotaryEvolution?

 

i will talk to Jon and see how many sets he has available and what he can do for bulk prices.

 

I'm interested in a set of them seals too, Ben.

HOLLA!!

 

i just called Jon and he has everything except 3mm single piece oversize seal sets. OEM 3rd gen apex spring sets are additional $90(recommended).

pricing would likely be as follows and applies to all series and size seals, shipped price within the US, international orders will be additional. price is for a set for a 2 rotor engine(6 full seals):

up to 10 sets $325
10-25 sets $310
25-50 sets $300
50+ sets $295(minimum price i'm allowed)

this is just a ballpark, i may widen the range as an incentive because i realize 50+ sets may be a long shot. keep in mind these sets do retail for $350 plus shipping($357 within the US) so up to $62 off which is a 17% discount. considering this will be a group buy for 1st/2nd and 3rd gens i honestly think we can get there(surprise me, i told Jon it may be difficult due to the randomness of the DIY rebuild amounts. good thing about apex seals is they have no shelf life though so you can buy them in anticipation of an overhaul).

 

there you go:
https://www.rx7club.com/group-buy-pr...-sets-1028712/

 

since its almost spring, your timing is good

 

I would be interested in a group buy for Goopy seals. I'm shooting for close to 500whp and from what I've read Goopy seems to be the way to go. Also I noticed you recommended their apex seal springs but I already have a complete rebuild minus the apex seals, will this be a problem if I don't use their springs?

 

I researched this a bit, I was actually the op of this thread and my conclusion is for "unbreakable" apex seals goopy and als seem to have the most consistant positive reviews, while ra has more mixed reviews than anything else.

The Atkins and mazda seals have the longest life but have the higher chances to break if there ever is an issue.

In short goopy/als if you don't mind spending the extra money, if you're not willing to spend that extra money and/or don't care about taking a chance at having potential rotor housing wear get ra super seals.

 

I'm definitely going with Goopy, I made that decision a while back even before this thread was started. My question was if its necessary to run the Goopy apex seal springs and if there would be any problems if I used a different seal spring. I'm not worried about housing wear I have 6 sets of good housings just for that. After doing quite a bit of research and talking with reputable rotary engine builders, my opinion is that any seal that isn't OE will wear housings faster or the seal will wear faster, Mazda spent years and quite a lot of cash on R&D with alloys for housings and seals to figure out what will last the longest with the least amount of damage. 90% of aftermarket companies don't have the funding to do that much R&D on their product, they try a few different alloys, test on a few motors, figure out a threshold (usually a much higher power/detonation number over stock) and roll with it. If wear and longevity are a concern I would suggest OE Mazda seals with good housings and keep the car stock.........there are way too many variables once the stock line has been crossed, usually human error but defective parts can also cause problems. I'm a firm believer in the "if you have the money to build it then you better have the money to fix it" theory. The reason I chose Goopy is for detonation and power potential.

 

Thought this might be a good place to post this. Im considering using the goopy 3mm 2 piece in a genuine 12a turbo build. How does one go about using this "file kit" to clearance the slots for the oversize seals? Im assuming if not careful one could easly stuff it up. Not to mention, sounds labour intensive!!

 

i have done a 12a with oversize seals and file kit
it does take a long time.. i reckon i put about 2 hrs into each slot ( include side seals )
but each shave is so minimal only inattention will amount to a stuff up

goopy include a couple of feeler gauges and it is difficult to go wrong if you measure every few minutes

if i was doing another i would probs this time make a jig like a wood triangle to hold the rotor flat and over the edge of a bench to stop it moving around so much

 

thanx Bumps, it was upon your recomendation on ausrotary that Ive dug deeper into the Goopy seal. Seems a good thing atm

 

I believe my motor might of been built using RA super seals , Now concidering I wanted my motor to LAST a long time ,and thats why i'm runing it in very convservative boost . is there any ways to prolong the life of the very very very MINT housings .. that went into this motor.. has anyone tried using MORE premix ? has that yielded results ?