Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

With the front bolts, you need a swivel socket. Also jack the engine up a bit using the transmission.

I always junk the stock bolts and install longer ones as well. The stockers are stupid short and only grab a few threads.

Banzai-Racing

iTrader: (11)

This is why we supply studs and nuts with out oil pan brace kits, we even have them on sale right now to RX7club members, check sig.

NoPistons!

iTrader: (3)

I'd love to get one of those braces but it's somewhat out of budget right now....lol.


Aaron, what size tap will i need and what bolts do i need? I'm pretty sure i have enough cell material to cut my own composite gasket on top of using rtv.

Definately use a screwdriver with socket head to install pan bolts. I've snapped so many off on other cars (garbage ampro torque wrench). I could have saves some money but atleast now i have the tooling to drill, extract and re-tap said f_ck-ups.

incubuseva

iTrader: (13)

Use a torque screwdriver. Something that will tell you how tight you're torquing it to.

NoPistons!

iTrader: (3)

Bump for the bolt size/length/pitch Mr. Cake Sir.

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

They are M6. Like every other small bolt on the car.

boosted1205

iTrader: (9)

I want to add that BANZAI RACING's KIT is WAAAY better that RX7STORE's kit.
BANZAI gives long high strength long studs & nut.
RX7STORE's gives stupid longer bolt which makes no sense as it can't be tightened down like BAZNAIs kit.

As for gasket or no gasket, I use HYLOMAR and gasket.
If cannot find HYLOMAR, user non hardening RTV.
As Aaron said, Mazda uses stupid short bolts. Get some longer bolts and washer.
You need to evenly torque all the bolts and cannot do that without a torque wrench. Go over it a couple times to make sure all are set.
It will never leak after that.

Banzai-Racing

iTrader: (11)

We are the only company that I know of that offers an OPB for the FC.

Jason sells Garco's FD OPB, which you are correct comes with bolts.

boosted1205

iTrader: (9)

Yea, it was for an FD. I was going to order it from you but instead he got it from RX7STORE.
That is a stupid design to use longer bolts which you can't tighten it down and defeats the whole purpose.

Banzai-Racing

iTrader: (11)

I hope you painted it or coated it with something, that one does not have any plating which allows it to rust. There are more things wrong with it but I will leave it at that.....

boosted1205

iTrader: (9)

Yea I noticed it when I had it on the lift the other day.
Oh well. I told him to order it Banzai but he went there. I purchased one from you for another FD and it's waaay better.

vrracing

iTrader: (1)

I did mine with the Banzai brace. Cleaning the holes and locktighting the studs was tedious (even with the engine out of the car) but this is clearly a better way to go, especially with the aluminum parts of the block. As a bonus, if you do have to drop the pan like I did to check my pickup tube, it is a LOT easier putting nuts on studs than it is trying to line up and thread 20 some odd bolts on your back.

I get really paranoid about driving steel into aluminum (as we all should!) so having studs locktighted in means that when I'm tightening the pan I'm not twisting steel in aluminum. Let's see, when else are you twisting steel in aluminum... Oh! A drill! And a drill is what you turn an oil pan bolt into when you over tighten it. And since you don't how many times the DPOs have put those bolts in those holes, the definition of "over-tighten" is undefinable. You know you've reached it when it is too late. Kinda like rotary overheating or detonation!

I used just RTV but I hand-tightened the nuts and then let it sit for an hour. Then I torqued it down. My understanding is that if you torque it right away you're going to squeeze the RTV out and have a lot of metal to metal contact. Also, I personally like to hand tighten it so that the RTV spreads out flat. I worry about letting it set up as a bead because it will cure at different rates so when it gets squished out you'll have chucks of hardened RTV.

nvmyseven

where can you buy the RTV at?

need RX7

iTrader: (4)

Any auto parts store.

Havoc

Any issues with using the blue RTV ? just what the guy in the shop recommended I use.

rnz520

iTrader: (10)

I dont think the blue is high temp, but dont quote me on that. Just stick with the black one, not only is it high temp but it clearly says OIL RESISTANT on the package, which means, its oil resistant.

slick_ep

what does RTV stand for? i need to do this to my fc also.

dawicka2

^^^^ Permatex is the name brand and Room Temperature Vulcanizing (RTV) silicone is what you are buying.

I used no gasket and high temp red permatex on my oil pan, immediately tightening (no set up time), and have had no issues.

john ny

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

like stated before... use "the right stuff" its 5x the price as regular rtv but its 746940 times better. after you use it once you will never buy another tube of regular old **** rtv and as a result you will never have a leaky car.

dawicka2

Damn....guess ive been using "the wrong stuff" (which still works pretty well though)

john ny

openrx

very good info in this thread...

while inspecting the underside and in preparation for replacing the fuel filter and gas line,

and 5th gear/back up light switch, which died about 10 years ago...

i noticed just the slightest beads of oil at the back of the pan, no drips just droplets ON the rear corner of the engine housing and at the transmission housing.

wiped it dry, inspected the engine, oil cooler lines, metering pump lines and so on. everything else was bone dry.

i could see no OTHER source for oil, even the filter platform is dry, including the heater hose under it.

it is clearly engine oil, not transmission oil.

after a day of driving in 90+ weather and no leaks on the garage floor the next morning,

but again just the slightest 'sweating' of oil behind the engine mount at the pan corner.

SO i grabbed the small torque wrench and decided to check all the rear bolts, which haven't been touched since 1988.

most were at 4 ft/lbs, so i gradually tighten them until all to ~8-9 ft/lbs.

THEN, started turning the final, CORNER bolt, which just kept turning, with some resistance (about 8 ft/lbs) but no end point.

so apparently this one nut/bolt is stripped or nearly so.

does this mean i can try a LONGER M6 at that one place and it will grab deeper threads?

how much longer and how far IN can a long M6 go? do the threadings OPEN into the engine oil cavity or are they blind/closed ends?

i realize that if the gasket is soaked or compromised the leak may continue till the pan is removed, cleaned and properly sealed...

which i'll do soon.

and i'd consider using either the washers or this fine looking bonzai perimeter pan brace...

but am i gonna have to RE tap that hole?

are there any other options for ONE (or maybe 2) bolts holes that have been over tightened ?

i suppose it all could just be ignored, but i hate knowing that the pan gasket is oozing, and suspect it can only get worse.

thanks
henry

ohayou88

iTrader: (7)

WORD... "The right stuff" is awesome. I use this for oil pan, water pump, thermostat housing, diff covers, oil return from turbo. never had a leak. It seems to resist torque alot better and doesn't squeeze out. when you squeeze it out the tube its thick and not watery like the regular rtv.

you can buy in a a can, or the one for a caulking gun. I bought the smallest one. and that sealed my engine in the rebuild, oil pan, water pump, t-stat, oil return gasket, front cover, and coolant feed gasket. so for about 11 bucks i sealed the entire engine and still had enough left to do another front cover for my buddies engine.

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

Maybe. The rear iron has only about 1/4" worth of threads, but the rotor housings and front cover have about 3/8" of threads. A longer bolt bay help.


As far as I remember, all of the oil pan studs lead to open air on the other end except those of the front cover and irons. If you are concerned, thread them in by hand first and trim if necessary.

Running a M6 tap through may help, but if the threads are damaged, then you need to repair them. A HeliCoil insert is a good choice in this case.

openrx

thanks, very helpful info.

henry