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The only thing stock that is that large would probably be a diesel truck turbo. I don't know of any that will work with the CHRA, so I'm pretty pessimistic about that. The next best option would be to use a Holset turbo if you're looking for a junkyard option, but then you're bought in to getting an aftermarket manifold (or make your own) along with a wastegate and down pipe.
Ahh, gotcha. Here's another one, if I bought the wheel only, what all is involved in machining the HT-18 housing to slip over the new compressor? I'm aware it would vary depending on what compressor I get, etc. I'm more so wondering, is it a straight cylindrical bore, or is it curve & require some 3D milling and such? Also, what kind of clearance between the housing & the wheel is required?
I did find this:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/garrett-T3-T04B-turbo-compressor-cover-wheel-back-plate-honda-nissan-mazda-dodge-/131061110675?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1e83d9d793&vxp=mtr
Still no data on your question. I'm looking in to it, but I don't think the answer is yes.
Ahh, gotcha. Here's another one, if I bought the wheel only, what all is involved in machining the HT-18 housing to slip over the new compressor? I'm aware it would vary depending on what compressor I get, etc. I'm more so wondering, is it a straight cylindrical bore, or is it curve & require some 3D milling and such? Also, what kind of clearance between the housing & the wheel is required?
I can tell you an S-trim in a stock housing needs a new profile cut. It's not simply 'opening up the bore'.
I seem to remember someone saying that the V-trim only requires a larger bore, but I can't quote a source.
When I did mine, there was about 1mm of total clearance between the compressor and the T04B backing plate. I copied that for the bore sizing.
The hard part is determining clearances when you do the profile cut. There's no way to measure the clearance after assembly. It can be accurately done using a CNC lathe, but it'll probably be cheaper and flow better to buy a T04B housing.
It seems like it should but there are a lot of unknown variables. It could be a big shaft T3/T4 CHRA, in which case I don't think it'll work. And that compressor housing looks mighty big. I'm not certain it won't work buuuuuttt I wouldn't go for it.
T04B25 U-Trim .60 A/R Compressor Side
TA34 Turbine
S5 Turbine Housing and Mani w/ Slightly Ported WG
These logs are from street driving. The first one is a blast from 1st gear through 3rd, you can see the air temps sky rocket so water injection is next on the list for me.
And you can see here how lugging it from low RPM in 3rd gear it builds 5psi by 2,500 RPM, and you can see it stable off after that. I think once I tune the boost table I'll be able to keep that boost rising steady.
I assumed that Bumpstarts T04B25 and Ta34 combo was a really great combo and went down the rabbit hole looking for the holy grail, a supercore with that compressor and that turbine, and came up empty, but i did learn me some stuff.
the T04B25 turbo, 409770-5019, fits a Navastar combine or something, with engine DT466 among others. its a little bit of a shame, because the exhaust side is really close to optimal, its a T04 turbine wheel, P Trim in a 1.15 divided housing.
the compressor is 54/70mm (409179-0024),
with a compressor housing that is 3" inlet and 2" outlet (408274-0224). it uses a dynamic seal instead of the carbon seal of the stock Hitachi, backplate is 408045-0034. the compressor wheel was easy to find, but the compressor housing is rare and expensive, so you're still better off with the whole turbo. if you could get a compressor housing, the CHRA is cheap! 408105-0156. it is oil only, 430027-0025 bearing housing. the water cooled one looks to be 430027-0036
the turbine wheel is a little trickier. they did an odd thing, its from a John Deere tractor, and its a T4 turbo with T3 wheels in it, which is kind of a hybrid the wrong way... but you can buy it separate, 451311-0002 or what looks to be a newer number, 451314-0002.
so basically you can buy the turbine wheel, and the turbo, and put the two together and have something that would just bolt in.
the other thing i found was that since these are diesel truck turbos and not performance turbos, they come up in different places, and i found two good ones.
if you have a part number https://www.turbointernational.com/ is great. not only do they have specs, but it will link to the whole assembly, and you can get those specs too
the second place is 1976- Navistar Industrial, Truck T04B25 Turbo 313102 which actually has a catalog for the trucks with sizes and part numbers of stuff.
Has anyone tried the Mamba TA34 off of ebay? it's labled as a high flow 9 blade turbine wheel verses I believe stock TA34 is 11 blade. Should be a lighter wheel with reduced backpressure. Thoughts ?Thinking it would be a good match for either a U-trim or V trim compressor wheel.
link. 9 Blade High Flow Performance Turbo Turbine Shaft Wheel Garrett TA34 (54.4/65) | eBay
Very interesting find. My thought would be it might perform better at higher flow rates, than the 11 blade TA34. Being that it's two blades short though, I can imagine it wont want to come on as early as an 11 blade, but like you mentioned there is a weight savings, so it could be beneficial overall.
I remember a post once by BlueTII and he put the stock hitachi turbine wheel back on temporarily in his p-trim machined hybrid and noted that it spooled up pretty decently even with the huge mismatch. Thinking it would be a good match for a similarly sized compressor wheel (U or V trim to4b)with the added benefit of the reduced backpressure on the top end with litte to no difference spooling.
I remember a post once by BlueTII and he put the stock hitachi turbine wheel back on temporarily in his p-trim machined hybrid and noted that it spooled up pretty decently even with the huge mismatch. Thinking it would be a good match for a similarly sized compressor wheel (U or V trim to4b)with the added benefit of the reduced backpressure on the top end with litte to no difference spooling.
The TA34 wheel is a Stage 2 T3 wheel. if you bored the turbine housing for a Stage 3 T3 wheel, there are a ton of T3/T4 turbos that would drop in, maybe that is the easy way.
buying a T04B25 turbo and TA34 wheel is kind of expensive, and then you still need to build it. maybe buying a T3/T4 turbo and boring out the housing is easier?
Yes true...that's a good point on a fresh hybrid turbo project start. For me though I have a navistar turbo that I bought cheap years ago that is a T04b (U-trim wheel/0.60 compressor cover/ large p-trim turbine ) that a hybrid can be assembled from without paying for extra machining / shipping back and fourth . AT this point I was just planning on a mild cheaper hybrid turbo upgrade on a fun street car that is rarely driven with these gouging gas prices .The cheapest solution would be to just slap on the t04b compressor and cover with rebuild kit/balance and call it a day.
I just went down this path beginning of the year. Perhaps I got nostalgic or just wanted to see what I could put together; here is where I ended up:
Kept my oem S5 hotside- ported the wastegates, resurfaced, and bored out the turbine hole.
TC4304 Turbo, Alt. part#466495-0003
-This turbine assembly was for a “Detroit Diesel”. Ditched the hotside provided. This was a garrett oem reman of some kind, even had the original garrett tag #7171120
-The turbine wheel inducer dimension was slightly larger than the (64/53.5) TA34 (#451314-0002)
The supplied wheel appeared to be the #451314-0003 wheel. (TA34 series wheels have the same shaft dimensions as oem s5)
-Came with a .70 A/R compressor housing (that -barely- contacts the UIM of a jdm S5)
After searching many catalogs, this matches what I think was the old T04B H-Trim housing (garrett #408173-0630). The contact is a small section at the top, and will only need some mm of trimming.
-the compressor wheel measured to be the garrett #4098262-0015 wheel
-the CHRA was a garrett type- that appeared to be #445074-0012. Visually near identical to the OEM hitachi, as far as ports go. Coolant and oil ports.
-the matching backplate should be #408045-0012 according to catalogues
-The CHRA 100% fits directly into the OEM S5 hotside. No modification. Even threw in the oem s5 wheel shaft to check.
-the turbine wheel however slightly contacts- the bore of the hotside needs to be machined some 0.03228in to keep the oem gap between the bore and the turbine blades. As measured, YMMV.
-this was a reman unit, so I paid a few hundred bucks for it- stripped it, cleaned it, and had good ol GPOP Shop VSR balance it. So total cost is $500-800, again YMMV.
Ideally i would have sourced the much referenced TA34, and by that i mean the bumpstart #451314-0002: DOUBLE CHECK those eBay listings, as the -0003 is ALSO listed as a TA34- they are identical, minus the inducer dimension (-0002 is a direct fit to the s5 hotside, the -0003 is NOT)
Came across GCG turbos from the infamous FD Hitachi 3KAI oem replacement/upgraded twins. They are a Japanese/Aussie co. That supplies the 3kai…
well, in their catalog they actually have a cool looking FC turbo- that appears to have exactly what I pieced together, as far as turbine/compressor wheel dimensions go.
If you match this turbo setup, this may be very close to one very expensive and uncommon GCG FC turbocharger
Last edited by fc3s-ty; 08-24-22 at 03:30 PM.
Reason: Added part #
-The turbine wheel inducer dimension was slightly larger than the (64/53.5) TA34 (#451314-0002)
The supplied wheel appeared to be the #451314-0003 wheel. (TA34 series wheels have the same shaft dimensions as oem s5)
Ideally i would have sourced the much referenced TA34, and by that i mean the bumpstart #451314-0002: DOUBLE CHECK those eBay listings, as the -0003 is ALSO listed as a TA34- they are identical, minus the inducer dimension (-0002 is a direct fit to the s5 hotside, the -0003 is NOT)
Those ebay chinese TA-34's are listed as -0002 but the exducer is listed as 54.4mm ...a garrett reference I came across listed the -0002 as 53.9mm exducers. so these may have the same problem. Good info thanks for adding.
11-27-13, 04:27 PM
