Water Injection What Is The Best Kit
06-23-06, 03:06 AM
#126
MP T-70 = Fun
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Charlotte and WCU
Posts: 1,049
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by coolingmist
Running with our without a controller is beneficial, but we believe that with a controller is far better in any situation. regardless of the state of tune without a controller its just guess work with the spray, you may have too much or too little. Another thing to consider is without a controller you dont have the ability to spray the system at low boost, because the system will have too much flow and have massive hesitation.
I can say without any doubt that non-controller kits work, its just a question of what works "better".
David
I can say without any doubt that non-controller kits work, its just a question of what works "better".
David
well i wasent planning on the spray comming on till about 12psi anyway.
I dont see why the car would lag or bogg or hesitate or anything if the a/r is tuned/adjusted for the spray from 12psi to full boost (20psi or safe egt limit, which ever comes first.)
guess ill have to play with it....
* ok another question, this one is about your pumps. Can they handle 100% alcohol? i saw they were on sale but id like to know before i buy one.
06-23-06, 05:39 AM
#127
Rotary Enthusiast
Originally Posted by GooRoo
I don't still have a question.... I wanted to know if you could make a 2d map based on the boost and 0-5V input (which I want to wire to RPM) so that I can recreate a speed-density system, but spraying the water/alcohol mix instead of fuel. You said that I could, I just need to figure out how to get RPM to 0-5V and then I need a new flash/software from you.
I view this all as several stages (for rx7 or speed density systems):
1) Single pressure turn on, no flow variability
2) Multiple pressure capability, flow varies with single control (boost/maf etc)
3) 2D Map of pressure vs RPM to vary flow
4) Precision injectors controlled by 2D map, plus aux inputs to deal with multiple factors (temps/load etc) essentially a whole new ECU for WI/AI
From the 'factory' both the Varicool and Alkycontrol systems (as advertised) I think are high level 2 systems. I'm just looking to get my Varicool to level 3, a consistent gas to water/alcohol ratio across all pressure and rpm ranges.
I'm not sure what else you thought I was asking GoRacer?
I view this all as several stages (for rx7 or speed density systems):
1) Single pressure turn on, no flow variability
2) Multiple pressure capability, flow varies with single control (boost/maf etc)
3) 2D Map of pressure vs RPM to vary flow
4) Precision injectors controlled by 2D map, plus aux inputs to deal with multiple factors (temps/load etc) essentially a whole new ECU for WI/AI
From the 'factory' both the Varicool and Alkycontrol systems (as advertised) I think are high level 2 systems. I'm just looking to get my Varicool to level 3, a consistent gas to water/alcohol ratio across all pressure and rpm ranges.
I'm not sure what else you thought I was asking GoRacer?
06-23-06, 06:55 AM
#128
Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
Posts: 27
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
How much HP are the cars requiring/wanting level3/4 making?
I say built a complete new fuel system, separate stainless steel injectors.. like the ones used for E85, use an OEM E85 pump, stainless filter, stainless steel tubing/lines/fittings.. and run it of an AEM with wide band feedback. Then switch the system on/off with the AEM controlling both your primary and secondary injectors.
Would be perfect.. if you could afford it
I say built a complete new fuel system, separate stainless steel injectors.. like the ones used for E85, use an OEM E85 pump, stainless filter, stainless steel tubing/lines/fittings.. and run it of an AEM with wide band feedback. Then switch the system on/off with the AEM controlling both your primary and secondary injectors.
Would be perfect.. if you could afford it
06-23-06, 07:31 AM
#129
Banned. I got OWNED!!!
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 296
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by TT_Rex_7
For those that don't know, 1.2 gallons per minute is ~4,542 cc per minute.
BTW, how do you feel about my idea of having a water/alcohol injector in each runner, right at the port on the motor?
-Alex
BTW, how do you feel about my idea of having a water/alcohol injector in each runner, right at the port on the motor?
-Alex
Alex, we do supply a kit to do that. There are several things to keep in mind.
1) simplicity is best. I does tend to complicate things. The more fittings, tees you have the more that can go wroing.
2) make sure your checkvalve that you use is super reliable. If you install the nozzles in an area that has vacuum and the checkvalve or solenoid fails, your engine will fill with water.
3) A controller style kit will be necessary because you will have too much flow if its not a controller.
4) Having said all of that, I am very interested in the idea on a rotary. Stainless steel hose should be considered due to the heat on the manifold.
Thanks.
06-23-06, 07:34 AM
#130
Banned. I got OWNED!!!
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 296
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The car will not bog if its done right, I guess what Im trying say is that its more tricky to get it right without a controller. if you have it set up right, yes it will not bog.
Yes, our pumps can handle 100% alcohol. There is a disclamer on it telling you to use it at your own risk that shurflo will not be held liable and they they dont recommend anything more than 50/50.
In terms of compatiblitity, you can run alcohol, water, what ever you want.
Thanks!
Yes, our pumps can handle 100% alcohol. There is a disclamer on it telling you to use it at your own risk that shurflo will not be held liable and they they dont recommend anything more than 50/50.
In terms of compatiblitity, you can run alcohol, water, what ever you want.
Thanks!
Originally Posted by sleeperfc
well i wasent planning on the spray comming on till about 12psi anyway.
I dont see why the car would lag or bogg or hesitate or anything if the a/r is tuned/adjusted for the spray from 12psi to full boost (20psi or safe egt limit, which ever comes first.)
guess ill have to play with it....
* ok another question, this one is about your pumps. Can they handle 100% alcohol? i saw they were on sale but id like to know before i buy one.
I dont see why the car would lag or bogg or hesitate or anything if the a/r is tuned/adjusted for the spray from 12psi to full boost (20psi or safe egt limit, which ever comes first.)
guess ill have to play with it....
* ok another question, this one is about your pumps. Can they handle 100% alcohol? i saw they were on sale but id like to know before i buy one.
06-23-06, 07:54 AM
#131
Racing Rotary Since 1983
iTrader: (6)
at the conclusion of my research project on AI (Dec 05) i had settled on 100% methanol for MY objectives as well as locating 4 injector nozzles near the top/inside of the LIM.
if you locate the nozzles in the greddy elbow like most you end up supercooling the big aluminum UIM. that's all lost energy. do you want the energy in the combustion chamber or the manifold?
i have posted many times on this concept. almost no one in the industry or the various boards was supportive to the concept.
the jets (4) will have to be really small and can get plugged. you have to run a solenoid as you are plumbing into vacuum (past the throttle plate) and you could fill your motor w alcohol and get hydrostatic lock, the alcohol needs some manifold time to "flash"...
i am developing my ever evolving twin TO4 setup that has 25% more turbine area than a GT42... 84 lbs/minute of compressors, two FC3000s, two MSD 8253 coils, running 2 (feel sorry for them) sparkplugs, a boost sensitive J&S Knock Retard, i could go on....
and now adding the key final component: Alcohol.
i am riding enough learning curves. that was a key reason why, after reading all 60 plus pages of threads on turbobuick, including over 6000 posts from Julio, that i went w Alkycontrol.
no learning curve. the learning curve has already been done, you can read it all over on the buick site. and in every instance we are talking about "TUNING UP" for max hp on demand w alcohol. everybody races and the story is front and center for all to see.
buy it. install it. turn it on. call ever-available Julio w any tuning questions.
i am a racer (22 seasons). he is a racer.
next year will be a different story. unless i am missing something, and i will listen to Julio, i will no doubt be doing a LIM (that's lower intake manifold Julio) system.
i predict that 06 will be a breakout year for AI based on achieved results.
howard coleman
if you locate the nozzles in the greddy elbow like most you end up supercooling the big aluminum UIM. that's all lost energy. do you want the energy in the combustion chamber or the manifold?
i have posted many times on this concept. almost no one in the industry or the various boards was supportive to the concept.
the jets (4) will have to be really small and can get plugged. you have to run a solenoid as you are plumbing into vacuum (past the throttle plate) and you could fill your motor w alcohol and get hydrostatic lock, the alcohol needs some manifold time to "flash"...
i am developing my ever evolving twin TO4 setup that has 25% more turbine area than a GT42... 84 lbs/minute of compressors, two FC3000s, two MSD 8253 coils, running 2 (feel sorry for them) sparkplugs, a boost sensitive J&S Knock Retard, i could go on....
and now adding the key final component: Alcohol.
i am riding enough learning curves. that was a key reason why, after reading all 60 plus pages of threads on turbobuick, including over 6000 posts from Julio, that i went w Alkycontrol.
no learning curve. the learning curve has already been done, you can read it all over on the buick site. and in every instance we are talking about "TUNING UP" for max hp on demand w alcohol. everybody races and the story is front and center for all to see.
buy it. install it. turn it on. call ever-available Julio w any tuning questions.
i am a racer (22 seasons). he is a racer.
next year will be a different story. unless i am missing something, and i will listen to Julio, i will no doubt be doing a LIM (that's lower intake manifold Julio) system.
i predict that 06 will be a breakout year for AI based on achieved results.
howard coleman
Last edited by Howard Coleman; 06-23-06 at 07:56 AM.
06-23-06, 08:31 AM
#132
Racing Rotary Since 1983
iTrader: (6)
Coolingmist
4) Having said all of that, I am very interested in the idea on a rotary.
"very interested?"
Jan 21 06
i posted the following question on the Coolingmist Tech Forum:
jet placement: cool combustion, not the manifold?
i run a 13 brew rotary that utilizes the typical intake manifolding. that would be an approx 3 inch aluminum tube from a very efficient intercooler. the tube feeds into a heavy cast aluminum Greddy elbow that turns the air 90 degrees. the charge air feeds thru a 3 butterfly (one for primary and 2 for secondary) throttle body and then runs into 4 runners. the runners are parallel to the ground and then turn 90 degrees downward (at which point the secondaries add fuel) then turn another 90 degrees and feed into the ports where the primaries add fuel into the port. most rotary AI (auxiliary injectors) locate a single jet in either the intercooler to elbow tube or the intercooler tube before the elbow. it sure doesnt seem to be the optimal location... if you locate the jet in the elbow, placement would be extremely critical so as to insure even distribution thru the 3 butterflies and eventually into the 2 primary and 2 secondary runners servicing the 2 rotors. if you locate it further upstream in the tube before the elbow better distribution would be attained but the mxture would have to negotiate yet another 90 degree turn at the elbow. it is common knowledge that on methonal powered racecars the intake manifolding is literally cooled to the point that it shouldnt be touched after a quartermile run... of course thats straight meth. my concern w upstream (as above) injection is that a great deal of the cooling is LOST on the heavy cast aluminum manifolding. we all know aluminum is one of the greatest conductors of heat/cold. on my car my charge air temperatures are already nice. i am interested in effecting the combustion chamber not the manifolds. i also dont want the wet mixture to have to make all those 90 degree turns. i plan to locate my jets in the lower manifold approx 5 inches from the intake port and one 90 degree turn. i would be delighted to discuss my thoughts with anyone that might have valuable ideas both pro and con. howard coleman
"very" interested in the idea on a rotary???????????? here's the answer to my question and why at that moment i crossed Coolingmist off my list........
coolingmist ADMIN Thanks howard. One of our project cars is a 94 Rx-7. WE find that the elbow is a great place to locate the jets. We utilitize our angled injectors and aim the water/meth toward the flow of air. This causes the meth/water to be distributed best. Hope that helps.
4) Having said all of that, I am very interested in the idea on a rotary.
"very interested?"
Jan 21 06
i posted the following question on the Coolingmist Tech Forum:
jet placement: cool combustion, not the manifold?
i run a 13 brew rotary that utilizes the typical intake manifolding. that would be an approx 3 inch aluminum tube from a very efficient intercooler. the tube feeds into a heavy cast aluminum Greddy elbow that turns the air 90 degrees. the charge air feeds thru a 3 butterfly (one for primary and 2 for secondary) throttle body and then runs into 4 runners. the runners are parallel to the ground and then turn 90 degrees downward (at which point the secondaries add fuel) then turn another 90 degrees and feed into the ports where the primaries add fuel into the port. most rotary AI (auxiliary injectors) locate a single jet in either the intercooler to elbow tube or the intercooler tube before the elbow. it sure doesnt seem to be the optimal location... if you locate the jet in the elbow, placement would be extremely critical so as to insure even distribution thru the 3 butterflies and eventually into the 2 primary and 2 secondary runners servicing the 2 rotors. if you locate it further upstream in the tube before the elbow better distribution would be attained but the mxture would have to negotiate yet another 90 degree turn at the elbow. it is common knowledge that on methonal powered racecars the intake manifolding is literally cooled to the point that it shouldnt be touched after a quartermile run... of course thats straight meth. my concern w upstream (as above) injection is that a great deal of the cooling is LOST on the heavy cast aluminum manifolding. we all know aluminum is one of the greatest conductors of heat/cold. on my car my charge air temperatures are already nice. i am interested in effecting the combustion chamber not the manifolds. i also dont want the wet mixture to have to make all those 90 degree turns. i plan to locate my jets in the lower manifold approx 5 inches from the intake port and one 90 degree turn. i would be delighted to discuss my thoughts with anyone that might have valuable ideas both pro and con. howard coleman
"very" interested in the idea on a rotary???????????? here's the answer to my question and why at that moment i crossed Coolingmist off my list........
coolingmist ADMIN Thanks howard. One of our project cars is a 94 Rx-7. WE find that the elbow is a great place to locate the jets. We utilitize our angled injectors and aim the water/meth toward the flow of air. This causes the meth/water to be distributed best. Hope that helps.
06-23-06, 08:37 AM
#133
Banned. I got OWNED!!!
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 296
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Howard,
We just added our direct inject kit just a couple months ago. At the time of your posting, we did not have our controller either. Our controller came out on April 1. We would not have tried to sell you a direct port kit without a controller.. Before we add ANY kit to our site, we make sure its worthwhile to do so. At the time, the answer we gave you was the one that we supported. WE still recommend the elbow in most cases.
We just added our direct inject kit just a couple months ago. At the time of your posting, we did not have our controller either. Our controller came out on April 1. We would not have tried to sell you a direct port kit without a controller.. Before we add ANY kit to our site, we make sure its worthwhile to do so. At the time, the answer we gave you was the one that we supported. WE still recommend the elbow in most cases.
Originally Posted by howard coleman
Coolingmist
4) Having said all of that, I am very interested in the idea on a rotary.
"very interested?"
Jan 21 06
i posted the following question on the Coolingmist Tech Forum:
jet placement: cool combustion, not the manifold?
i run a 13 brew rotary that utilizes the typical intake manifolding. that would be an approx 3 inch aluminum tube from a very efficient intercooler. the tube feeds into a heavy cast aluminum Greddy elbow that turns the air 90 degrees. the charge air feeds thru a 3 butterfly (one for primary and 2 for secondary) throttle body and then runs into 4 runners. the runners are parallel to the ground and then turn 90 degrees downward (at which point the secondaries add fuel) then turn another 90 degrees and feed into the ports where the primaries add fuel into the port. most rotary AI (auxiliary injectors) locate a single jet in either the intercooler to elbow tube or the intercooler tube before the elbow. it sure doesnt seem to be the optimal location... if you locate the jet in the elbow, placement would be extremely critical so as to insure even distribution thru the 3 butterflies and eventually into the 2 primary and 2 secondary runners servicing the 2 rotors. if you locate it further upstream in the tube before the elbow better distribution would be attained but the mxture would have to negotiate yet another 90 degree turn at the elbow. it is common knowledge that on methonal powered racecars the intake manifolding is literally cooled to the point that it shouldnt be touched after a quartermile run... of course thats straight meth. my concern w upstream (as above) injection is that a great deal of the cooling is LOST on the heavy cast aluminum manifolding. we all know aluminum is one of the greatest conductors of heat/cold. on my car my charge air temperatures are already nice. i am interested in effecting the combustion chamber not the manifolds. i also dont want the wet mixture to have to make all those 90 degree turns. i plan to locate my jets in the lower manifold approx 5 inches from the intake port and one 90 degree turn. i would be delighted to discuss my thoughts with anyone that might have valuable ideas both pro and con. howard coleman
"very" interested in the idea on a rotary???????????? here's the answer to my question and why at that moment i crossed Coolingmist off my list........
coolingmist ADMIN Thanks howard. One of our project cars is a 94 Rx-7. WE find that the elbow is a great place to locate the jets. We utilitize our angled injectors and aim the water/meth toward the flow of air. This causes the meth/water to be distributed best. Hope that helps.
4) Having said all of that, I am very interested in the idea on a rotary.
"very interested?"
Jan 21 06
i posted the following question on the Coolingmist Tech Forum:
jet placement: cool combustion, not the manifold?
i run a 13 brew rotary that utilizes the typical intake manifolding. that would be an approx 3 inch aluminum tube from a very efficient intercooler. the tube feeds into a heavy cast aluminum Greddy elbow that turns the air 90 degrees. the charge air feeds thru a 3 butterfly (one for primary and 2 for secondary) throttle body and then runs into 4 runners. the runners are parallel to the ground and then turn 90 degrees downward (at which point the secondaries add fuel) then turn another 90 degrees and feed into the ports where the primaries add fuel into the port. most rotary AI (auxiliary injectors) locate a single jet in either the intercooler to elbow tube or the intercooler tube before the elbow. it sure doesnt seem to be the optimal location... if you locate the jet in the elbow, placement would be extremely critical so as to insure even distribution thru the 3 butterflies and eventually into the 2 primary and 2 secondary runners servicing the 2 rotors. if you locate it further upstream in the tube before the elbow better distribution would be attained but the mxture would have to negotiate yet another 90 degree turn at the elbow. it is common knowledge that on methonal powered racecars the intake manifolding is literally cooled to the point that it shouldnt be touched after a quartermile run... of course thats straight meth. my concern w upstream (as above) injection is that a great deal of the cooling is LOST on the heavy cast aluminum manifolding. we all know aluminum is one of the greatest conductors of heat/cold. on my car my charge air temperatures are already nice. i am interested in effecting the combustion chamber not the manifolds. i also dont want the wet mixture to have to make all those 90 degree turns. i plan to locate my jets in the lower manifold approx 5 inches from the intake port and one 90 degree turn. i would be delighted to discuss my thoughts with anyone that might have valuable ideas both pro and con. howard coleman
"very" interested in the idea on a rotary???????????? here's the answer to my question and why at that moment i crossed Coolingmist off my list........
coolingmist ADMIN Thanks howard. One of our project cars is a 94 Rx-7. WE find that the elbow is a great place to locate the jets. We utilitize our angled injectors and aim the water/meth toward the flow of air. This causes the meth/water to be distributed best. Hope that helps.
06-23-06, 09:11 AM
#134
development
Originally Posted by howard coleman
Coolingmist
4) Having said all of that, I am very interested in the idea on a rotary.
"very interested?"
Jan 21 06
i posted the following question on the Coolingmist Tech Forum:
jet placement: cool combustion, not the manifold?
i run a 13 brew rotary that utilizes the typical intake manifolding. that would be an approx 3 inch aluminum tube from a very efficient intercooler. the tube feeds into a heavy cast aluminum Greddy elbow that turns the air 90 degrees. the charge air feeds thru a 3 butterfly (one for primary and 2 for secondary) throttle body and then runs into 4 runners. the runners are parallel to the ground and then turn 90 degrees downward (at which point the secondaries add fuel) then turn another 90 degrees and feed into the ports where the primaries add fuel into the port. most rotary AI (auxiliary injectors) locate a single jet in either the intercooler to elbow tube or the intercooler tube before the elbow. it sure doesnt seem to be the optimal location... if you locate the jet in the elbow, placement would be extremely critical so as to insure even distribution thru the 3 butterflies and eventually into the 2 primary and 2 secondary runners servicing the 2 rotors. if you locate it further upstream in the tube before the elbow better distribution would be attained but the mxture would have to negotiate yet another 90 degree turn at the elbow. it is common knowledge that on methonal powered racecars the intake manifolding is literally cooled to the point that it shouldnt be touched after a quartermile run... of course thats straight meth. my concern w upstream (as above) injection is that a great deal of the cooling is LOST on the heavy cast aluminum manifolding. we all know aluminum is one of the greatest conductors of heat/cold. on my car my charge air temperatures are already nice. i am interested in effecting the combustion chamber not the manifolds. i also dont want the wet mixture to have to make all those 90 degree turns. i plan to locate my jets in the lower manifold approx 5 inches from the intake port and one 90 degree turn. i would be delighted to discuss my thoughts with anyone that might have valuable ideas both pro and con. howard coleman
"very" interested in the idea on a rotary???????????? here's the answer to my question and why at that moment i crossed Coolingmist off my list........
coolingmist ADMIN Thanks howard. One of our project cars is a 94 Rx-7. WE find that the elbow is a great place to locate the jets. We utilitize our angled injectors and aim the water/meth toward the flow of air. This causes the meth/water to be distributed best. Hope that helps.
4) Having said all of that, I am very interested in the idea on a rotary.
"very interested?"
Jan 21 06
i posted the following question on the Coolingmist Tech Forum:
jet placement: cool combustion, not the manifold?
i run a 13 brew rotary that utilizes the typical intake manifolding. that would be an approx 3 inch aluminum tube from a very efficient intercooler. the tube feeds into a heavy cast aluminum Greddy elbow that turns the air 90 degrees. the charge air feeds thru a 3 butterfly (one for primary and 2 for secondary) throttle body and then runs into 4 runners. the runners are parallel to the ground and then turn 90 degrees downward (at which point the secondaries add fuel) then turn another 90 degrees and feed into the ports where the primaries add fuel into the port. most rotary AI (auxiliary injectors) locate a single jet in either the intercooler to elbow tube or the intercooler tube before the elbow. it sure doesnt seem to be the optimal location... if you locate the jet in the elbow, placement would be extremely critical so as to insure even distribution thru the 3 butterflies and eventually into the 2 primary and 2 secondary runners servicing the 2 rotors. if you locate it further upstream in the tube before the elbow better distribution would be attained but the mxture would have to negotiate yet another 90 degree turn at the elbow. it is common knowledge that on methonal powered racecars the intake manifolding is literally cooled to the point that it shouldnt be touched after a quartermile run... of course thats straight meth. my concern w upstream (as above) injection is that a great deal of the cooling is LOST on the heavy cast aluminum manifolding. we all know aluminum is one of the greatest conductors of heat/cold. on my car my charge air temperatures are already nice. i am interested in effecting the combustion chamber not the manifolds. i also dont want the wet mixture to have to make all those 90 degree turns. i plan to locate my jets in the lower manifold approx 5 inches from the intake port and one 90 degree turn. i would be delighted to discuss my thoughts with anyone that might have valuable ideas both pro and con. howard coleman
"very" interested in the idea on a rotary???????????? here's the answer to my question and why at that moment i crossed Coolingmist off my list........
coolingmist ADMIN Thanks howard. One of our project cars is a 94 Rx-7. WE find that the elbow is a great place to locate the jets. We utilitize our angled injectors and aim the water/meth toward the flow of air. This causes the meth/water to be distributed best. Hope that helps.
you have to remember, you are talking to ZeroBanger
https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=93665
^his racing history
06-23-06, 09:20 AM
#135
Banned. I got OWNED!!!
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 296
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by dubulup
you have to remember, you are talking to ZeroBanger
https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=93665
^his racing history
https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=93665
^his racing history
My company manufactures methanol injection kits, we dont specialize in 1/4 mile racing. If your requirement for buying a kit is that its manufactured by someone that is a 1/4 mile racer, we are not the company for you.
I used to go to the track, so whats your point? Dont put me on trial because I am not a 1/4 mile racer, I never, ever made the claim that I was. Please leave this thread for those that have questions and want answers.
06-23-06, 09:44 AM
#136
Originally Posted by BDC
Mind if I ask how much volume you're spraying? My goal is around 2000cc/min at higher loads. I plan on supplanting about 1/4 of my gasoline fuel with alcohol injection. I want 25+psi on pump gas, baby!
B
B
06-23-06, 09:48 AM
#137
Originally Posted by Alkycontrol
Denatured leaves a smell. Methanol is odorless
06-23-06, 10:31 AM
#138
Racing Rotary Since 1983
iTrader: (6)
Coolingist,
at that time ( Jan 21) you had already previewed your controller and were taking preorders for shipment around 30 days out. "order now and be in the first batch." you obviously had a beta and if you had any interest in my question you would have said something in reference to it and tied it into your upcoming progressive controller. it just seemed you had a cookie cutter biz plan and i just didn't fit into it. that's O K w me but just didn't suit my plans.
you had the progressive controller in first stage of manufacture so please don't try to rationalize your nonresponsive answer on that basis. if you had cared at all about my potential biz you would have said.... we are bringing out a progressive controller shortly and it would work well w your proposed location etc etc.
as far as what Coolingmist currently "recommends" as to nozzle location, pardon me while i turn off my hearing aid. further, it might be a good idea to ditch the Lotus picture as this is a Mazda RX7 board.
howard coleman
at that time ( Jan 21) you had already previewed your controller and were taking preorders for shipment around 30 days out. "order now and be in the first batch." you obviously had a beta and if you had any interest in my question you would have said something in reference to it and tied it into your upcoming progressive controller. it just seemed you had a cookie cutter biz plan and i just didn't fit into it. that's O K w me but just didn't suit my plans.
you had the progressive controller in first stage of manufacture so please don't try to rationalize your nonresponsive answer on that basis. if you had cared at all about my potential biz you would have said.... we are bringing out a progressive controller shortly and it would work well w your proposed location etc etc.
as far as what Coolingmist currently "recommends" as to nozzle location, pardon me while i turn off my hearing aid. further, it might be a good idea to ditch the Lotus picture as this is a Mazda RX7 board.
howard coleman
06-23-06, 10:35 AM
#139
Banned. I got OWNED!!!
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 296
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by howard coleman
Coolingist,
at that time ( Jan 21) you had already previewed your controller and were taking preorders for shipment around 30 days out. "order now and be in the first batch." you obviously had a beta and if you had any interest in my question you would have said something in reference to it and tied it into your upcoming progressive controller. it just seemed you had a cookie cutter biz plan and i just didn't fit into it. that's O K w me but just didn't suit my plans.
at that time ( Jan 21) you had already previewed your controller and were taking preorders for shipment around 30 days out. "order now and be in the first batch." you obviously had a beta and if you had any interest in my question you would have said something in reference to it and tied it into your upcoming progressive controller. it just seemed you had a cookie cutter biz plan and i just didn't fit into it. that's O K w me but just didn't suit my plans.
you had the progressive controller in first stage of manufacture so please don't try to rationalize your nonresponsive answer on that basis. if you had cared at all about my potential biz you would have said.... we are bringing out a progressive controller shortly and it would work well w your proposed location etc etc.
as far as what Coolingmist currently "recommends" as to nozzle location, pardon me while i turn off my hearing aid. further, it might be a good idea to ditch the Lotus picture as this is a Mazda RX7 board.
howard coleman
Thanks!
06-23-06, 10:44 AM
#140
Originally Posted by Crusader_9x
Im not sure if you saw my first post in this thread or not but i would check out FJOs water injection kit. I believe that there system qualifies to be in your level 4. Only thing im not sure about is whether or not its 100% methanol compatible. Heres there site, make sure you check out there pdfs and the software.
Of course that system is a little more pricey as well. I see about $650 to replicate what I'm trying to get with about $300 into my Coolingmist kit, with the caveat that it may be more precise depending on that solenoid.
06-23-06, 10:47 AM
#141
Originally Posted by Alkycontrol
How much HP are the cars requiring/wanting level3/4 making?
I say built a complete new fuel system, separate stainless steel injectors.. like the ones used for E85, use an OEM E85 pump, stainless filter, stainless steel tubing/lines/fittings.. and run it of an AEM with wide band feedback. Then switch the system on/off with the AEM controlling both your primary and secondary injectors.
Would be perfect.. if you could afford it
I say built a complete new fuel system, separate stainless steel injectors.. like the ones used for E85, use an OEM E85 pump, stainless filter, stainless steel tubing/lines/fittings.. and run it of an AEM with wide band feedback. Then switch the system on/off with the AEM controlling both your primary and secondary injectors.
Would be perfect.. if you could afford it
That is exactly it. (stage 4)
I'm just trying to get 80% of the performance of that system at 20% of the cost.
06-23-06, 11:04 AM
#142
Originally Posted by BDC
Here's a "Legitimate", technical question -- Is the CoolingMist system, any of them, capable of 2000cc/min of output delivery under very high pressure?
While I'm at it, how well do nylon tubes hold up to high-pressure alcohol?
B
While I'm at it, how well do nylon tubes hold up to high-pressure alcohol?
B
Originally Posted by coolingmist
Our systems will pump as much as 1.2 gallons per minute if necessary.
Nylon tubing is fine with the alcohol. We rcommend that if the hose will be under extreme heat to use our stainless steel teflon hose.
Nylon tubing is fine with the alcohol. We rcommend that if the hose will be under extreme heat to use our stainless steel teflon hose.
Just to add slightly more color to that answer, this is what they have on the Coolingmist site for the nicer (but still plastic) hose:
It can handle in excess of 500 PSI, Is flame resistant and can handle temps as low as -40F.
The inner diameter of this hose is .177. We sell barbs that fit this hose (our 3/16 barbs) or you can use your own. This new hose is designed to retain a semi-soft rigid texture and not harden over time.
The inner diameter of this hose is .177. We sell barbs that fit this hose (our 3/16 barbs) or you can use your own. This new hose is designed to retain a semi-soft rigid texture and not harden over time.
06-23-06, 12:19 PM
#143
BDC Motorsports
Originally Posted by coolingmist
Our systems will pump as much as 1.2 gallons per minute if necessary.
Nylon tubing is fine with the alcohol. We rcommend that if the hose will be under extreme heat to use our stainless steel teflon hose.
Nylon tubing is fine with the alcohol. We rcommend that if the hose will be under extreme heat to use our stainless steel teflon hose.
B
06-23-06, 01:03 PM
#144
Banned. I got OWNED!!!
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 296
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by BDC
Is the system itself capable of 1.2gpm? At what pressure?
B
B
06-23-06, 01:53 PM
#145
Lost Cause
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: VA
Posts: 154
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Has anybody tried something along the lines of using an additional injector controller like this: http://www.splitsec.com/products/aic1/aic1ds.htm
combine that with methanol injectors (like the 1200cc units here http://www.petroject.com.au/performance.html) and a methanol pump that turns on when you arm the system or at given rpm/boost and you have a secondary fuel system capable of mounting wherever you wanted (maybe the extra 2 ports in a GZ LIM?) with complete control of flow. Cost would be a bit more, but not as much as a second ECU. I was not able to exstablish that there are components for a full fuel system that can handle Meth. on a permanent basis. Most recommended that the system be flushed before down time.
Thoughts?
combine that with methanol injectors (like the 1200cc units here http://www.petroject.com.au/performance.html) and a methanol pump that turns on when you arm the system or at given rpm/boost and you have a secondary fuel system capable of mounting wherever you wanted (maybe the extra 2 ports in a GZ LIM?) with complete control of flow. Cost would be a bit more, but not as much as a second ECU. I was not able to exstablish that there are components for a full fuel system that can handle Meth. on a permanent basis. Most recommended that the system be flushed before down time.
Thoughts?
06-23-06, 02:43 PM
#146
Cant be bothered anymore
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Norwich UK
Posts: 465
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Wow. last time i came on line this thread was like 3 pages long...........Hell.....
I have some power run figures for those interested in the base tune effects of water, meth etc.
the runs are all on the same tune and on the same day. The power is low becasue i dare not push an experimental tune.
Scott
I have some power run figures for those interested in the base tune effects of water, meth etc.
the runs are all on the same tune and on the same day. The power is low becasue i dare not push an experimental tune.
Scott
Last edited by sdminus; 06-23-06 at 02:47 PM.
06-23-06, 03:16 PM
#148
Cant be bothered anymore
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Norwich UK
Posts: 465
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
sorry forgot to add
It was performed with the coolingmist varicool kit. I believe i was one of the first.
It was on a seq twin fd. I have since carried on to a very nice tune with the controller.
My tuning partner also uses the same kit on his FB rx7. It was a n/a rx7 to start with,It now has a T3 turbo on carbs running 16psi of boost with loads of timing. He uses a msd knock detector. This car was tuned for quite a few months back to back and drag raced. The engine is a tad tired a 107 000 Miles but it is still running.
I have been running coolingmist products for a year now with no serious problems at all. My tune has been critical of the kit for several months with good out comes. ie i beat my pb on the strip.
With out the varicool we could not have achieved the close tune with the fb, The tuneing factors gave us the chance to do this. If not we would have been bust
Scott
Scott
It was performed with the coolingmist varicool kit. I believe i was one of the first.
It was on a seq twin fd. I have since carried on to a very nice tune with the controller.
My tuning partner also uses the same kit on his FB rx7. It was a n/a rx7 to start with,It now has a T3 turbo on carbs running 16psi of boost with loads of timing. He uses a msd knock detector. This car was tuned for quite a few months back to back and drag raced. The engine is a tad tired a 107 000 Miles but it is still running.
I have been running coolingmist products for a year now with no serious problems at all. My tune has been critical of the kit for several months with good out comes. ie i beat my pb on the strip.
With out the varicool we could not have achieved the close tune with the fb, The tuneing factors gave us the chance to do this. If not we would have been bust
Scott
Scott
06-23-06, 03:18 PM
#149
Cant be bothered anymore
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Norwich UK
Posts: 465
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by z-beater
WOW, is that really a 21hp increase? If so I am shocked!
LOL. yeah. i have more than one run to back it up....
My next project
06-23-06, 03:19 PM
#150
Banned. I got OWNED!!!
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 296
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Scott,
Im very glad the unit has been working out so well for you. let us know what you are thinking about for intake correction as we are working on a way to add that functionality to the vari-cool as we speak.
Thanks!
Im very glad the unit has been working out so well for you. let us know what you are thinking about for intake correction as we are working on a way to add that functionality to the vari-cool as we speak.
Thanks!