1FastT2

iTrader: (1)

Hey guys I have a TO4B 60-1 with a P-trim and a .84 divided housing. I was told that this turbo will support 550hp at quite low boost levels by turbonetics. Any comments?

1FastT2

iTrader: (1)

Also will I have noticable lag or will it spool up fairly quickly?

1FastT2

iTrader: (1)

Sure as soon as I post then no one replies!

13BAce

That should spool up VERY quickly. I'm not sure about 550 HP at low boost, maybe higher, like 18-20 PSI.

1FastT2

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for the reply! Hopefully I can get some pretty good power around the 12psi mark. I really don't want to have to boost too high just to kick a vipers ***,

affinitee

With a smaller housing and a P-trim, should spool very quickly....
I agree with 13Bace...
Hp @ 12 psi = 325-400... Depending on exhaust manifold, wastegate and EMS

HWO

that will spool very similar to the stock turbo, you'd need over 20psi to make 550Hp at the flywheel with it though

Rice Racing is making that kinda HP at around 16-17psi boost with a 1.32A/R exhuast housing with the same compressor set up. the larger exhuast housing means higher HP with less boost.

HWO

I asked a guy who has tuned injection systems on 70+ 13BT set ups in various cars and he said unless you want over 600HP then a P trim will provide better results than a Q trim will.

A Q trim has less blade back angle than a P trim right? so a smaller A/R Q trim spools like a larger A/R P trim, something like a Q trim .8 would compare to a 1.32 P trim or something along those lines i would imagine.

The thing is, you still need the turbine area for the high RPM exhuast flow, having less angle on the blades doesn't improve it 'that' much

13BAce

You'll get good power at 12 PSI, but you'll need alot of boost to whoop up on Vipers. Remember, they're making 450 HP.

13BAce

i've been in a 1st gen with a 13B REW with a big port, HKS TII undivided manifold, Turbonetics wastegate, and a T-72 .96 Q trim, and the boost came on VERY quickly. That car does mid to high 10's consistently.

I have a ported 89-91 TII motor with the same manifold, an HKS standard(40 mm) wastegate, and a Greddy T-78. It spools up pretty well. I think I usually get full boost--17 PSI--at around 4500 RPM, but I make boost pretty early. That turbo is kind of lazy until it hits about 10 PSI.

1FastT2

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for the feed back guys! I guess I'll have to think about running a little more boost than I thought I would be running.

Maxthe7man

I have the T04e with 60-1 wheel, ptrim, 1.15 divided a/r turbine housing, any of you guys know this spools and boosts on a 13bt streetported? Before I go much farther with this project I would really like to know if I should step down a housing size or two, My goal is 400rwhp, I would like to keep the PSI levels out of the stratosphere also, I am not out to build a total racer out of the car, but a driveable 400 rwhp car, so I think I am on the right track here, the Turbo is in getting re-machined and what not right now, so now would be the best time to knock the housing size down..Max

affinitee

Same set up for my 10th...
Told that with boost in the range of 15-18 psi car will hit same goal...

I'll see you in the 11's!!!

waynespeed

Actually, the Q-trim wheel itself is of a bigger diameter.
The P-trim/Q-trim
Exducer 2.544/2.922
Major 2.693/3.111

The Q-trim however does flow a lot more than the P-trim and will require a smaller A/R ratio. The Q bleeds off so much more air that
the A/R ratio has to be decreased to increase the velocity around the wheel itself.

Thanks HWO, for taking the time to research.

Boostn7

>>>>>>The Q-trim however does flow a lot more than the P-trim and will require a smaller A/R ratio. The Q bleeds off so much more air that
the A/R ratio has to be decreased to increase the velocity around the wheel itself. <<<<<<

OK, it's true the Q-trim does offer more flow......
but you're defeating the purpose by decreasing the A/R and choking exhaust flow from the engine... >> increasing turbine inlet pressure.
I feel you're going about it backwards to make it work.
You seriously need to look at the opening of a .70A/R and .1.00A/R and compare and you'll understand that before the exhaust hits the wheel it needs to flow thru that window.

Turbonetics introduced the Q-trim wheel to assist with their huge compressor wheels for big displacement engines (800+++hp).
Originally they simply welded tips on P-trim wheels and called it a Q-trim, now they're cast as one.

The only time I would move to a Q-trim is if using it on a 20B.

Just trying to help,
John D

HWO

if you'll look at my post, you'll notice i said " right?" meaning am i correct? you'll also notice me saying "i would imagine" at the end, i wasn't exactly sure.

Boostn7 hit the nail on the head with what i was trying to say, i just couldn't find the words to phrase it correctly.

waynespeed

If a .70 would choke on a Q-trim they would not have made such a turbine housing.

Check out this Rx7 choking on a .81Q
http://www.rx7s.com/tandrracing/jpg-...%20noaudio.avi

Check out this Rx7 choking on a .70 "O" trim
http://www.rx7s.com/tandrracing/even...02%20mpeg4.avi

So I figured go somewhere in the middle and try (won't hurt to try if no one else did, right?) .70 "Q"

I have a T70 BB center Q-trim, at this stage going backwards would be using the "P".


HWO and John, Thanks again for your replies.

Share the knowledge, rotary power forever!!!

HWO

a T70 is a over 600HP compressor, what did i say in my earlier post?

its a bit like the T04 vs T78 debate......

AJC13B

Get a turbo that looks right and your tuner says to go for.

My lag and someone elses is 2 different things. My lag is having nothing till 4000, 10psi by 4500 and 15psi by 5000. Someone elses is having no boost by 3000rpm.

I have a big turbo, .84 front, 1.22 rear on BIG blade (could be Q) and I run 11.1 @ 125 on 22psi. Car makes 500+rwhp on 22psi and C16.

Thank you.

13BAce

Yeah, more boost=more fun. Too much boost=

jaysrex

and i quote, " 1. keep the major diameter of the compressor and turbine wheels within 15% of each other. 2. the exducer diameter is a good indicator of turbine size. AND 3.) SMALLER TRIMS OF THE SAME WHEEL FAMILY WILL SPOOL FASTER, BUT FLOW A LITTLE LESS. the larger variance inducer to exducer gives the exhuast gas more oomhph on the wheel. it also gives the gas a less direct path out of the turbine.
it is often better to put a small trim wheel in a bigger A/R housing to solve spool up time than to put an extremely small (anything under .8) A/R housing on a large trim turbine."

so.. stick with the V, O, P trims and forget the Q unless you are a hardcore dragger. keep the A/R in the .9-1.0 range and let the exhaust flow.. it'll make more power! anyone can put a R trim and a .7 A/R on their car and make big power, but the same compressor with a P trim and bigger A/R will make more power everytime. remember that rotory's aren't 4 or 6 bangers...

if you are running ont he street or you are road racing...go for the turbine and A/R that'll let your engine breath and still have "the best of both worlds" spool up time. drag racing is a different story.... you can sacrifice low end lag for top end insane power.

i'm building up my T2 and i'm getting a 1.0 A/R divided housing with a P trim turbine on a T-72 compressor. i think this will suit my needs for the strip and the street. its my best of both worlds combo and i'll be sure to post the dyno results and lag times when i get her built.

later all
Jay

affinitee

AGREED!!!!!