sleeper7

Just installed a S480 turbo on a S4 motor. Ported primary port and added a very small bridge to secondary, exhaust was to the sleeves.

50/50 meth/water 400cc comes on at 7psi
Fuel is 80% Q16 and 20% E85

Was on the dyno trying to work things out but just before we were going to start making some 4th gear pulls we found a vacuum/boost leak, between LIM and UIM.
All pulls were in 3rd gear from 3000 to 7500rpms. 8600rpms once and the hp and tq lines were still climbing. Little boost creep also.

30 psi at 6800rpms
Timing at 30psi was 16 with 5 split
Timing at 15psi was 19 with 7 split
EGT never went over 720c before turbo, in manifold
AFRs in the 10.4 to 11.4 range from 12 psi up.
AFRs in the low12 below 12 psi range
13 afr in vacuum areas.

I do have a Nitrous kit to help with spool. It's the Zex turbo kit. Currently have the 65hp jets installed and turn off point set at 10psi. Not tried yet.

Questions, Is the egt to low or is it because the E85? or is it the rich mixture or is it the timing? suggestions before the car goes back on the dyno.

No dyno chart and really dont remember the exact #s. was just trying to get a clean pull. Did notice a higher HP # when we leaned it out to high 11s. Not much though. Never got a chance to play with the timing.

thanks

a_reyes1014

iTrader: (1)

wow would like to know the number man good job get some more dyno time on that bad boy good luck

sleeper7

left is rear rotor and the right one is the front rotor. Fuel was added to rear rotor, 3%.

13B-RX3

iTrader: (2)

How many pulls were on those plugs? From what i have read it is going to be very hard to get a reading on the plugs with that much deposits. If you can't get anyone to give you any timing numbers i would warm it up and put in a fresh set of plugs. Then make an 1/8 mile pass and look at the ground (timing) and the first few threads (mixture). If it looks good try a 1/4 and read the plugs again. If the cad plating is burnt off the ground close to or past the bend of the ground strap pull some timing out and if it's burnt off past the first thread throw some more fuel at it.

Maybe someone a little more qualified than myself will chime in too

Good luck Chuck.

arghx

iTrader: (3)

I guess your choice of fuel throws everything off a bit, but that seems like a lot of timing for 30psi--not necessarily because it will detonate, but because combustion may not be occurring at the ideal time given whatever flame front speed you have. More advance does not always equal more power. I've seen that on my own car with race fuel and 18psi as well as my old nonturbo on 87. 15 degrees of advance, even on race fuel and E85, is a lot for 30psi. I can't say I've seen a piston or a rotary with that much advance at least in my experience, but perhaps the veteran tuners will in fact chime in.

The single turbo Supras I've seen running around with that much boost on race fuel do have more like 6 or 8 degrees advance. Same with the high boost Vr-4 maps I've seen. Of course those are diffferent engines with different setups. All I'm saying is that there is a chance the car could actually run better with less timing. Have you tried pulling more leading timing after 15psi? Can you post your timing map?

Also, most people who try to do serious tuning by reading plugs only do a couple pulls or passes on fresh ones before pulling them out.

Slammedblk7

iTrader: (7)

Good stuff Chuck, Can't wait to see it! You're still coming to Ennis right?

enzo250

Are you saying a 2jz only needs 6~8degrees of timing at 30psi?
I hope that was a typo on your part....

15 degrees at 30psi on a rotary is not alot with good fuel..

sleeper7

Did some passes tonight. best was 10.8 at 135 going in to a 15mph wind, bogging 1st gear. rpm dropped to 4200. No ignition break up.
Just under 30psi and 8300rpms. 7.1 at 106mph in the 1/8.

Adjusted the timing to-
20deg up to 20psi.
18 deg up to 25psi and 17 after that.
split is 12.

Also leaned it out to high 10s very low 11s for the most part. a spot here and there at 11.5. The EGT did get hotter, 800c. Was getting ignition break up with the br10 spark plugs. will try some 10.5s tomorrow night.

If the 10.5 plugs fix the ignition break up I'll leave the AFRs alone and add a few more degs of timing from 15psi up.

forgot to mention, 9.7 n/a rotors. Rotors did have the casting lines in the dish, could be 9.0 rotors but the guy I got them from assured me they were 9.7s

Never understood the importance of a large waste gate (two) and a good boost controller. Had to start opening the gates at 20psi to make sure the boost stayed around 30psi. I know it leaving more power on the table because of these two things being inadequate.

Carpenter

Just curious, why not run 100% Q-16?
Also, what boost control set-up are you using?

Congrats on your new 60 ft. time!

sleeper7

Did some more testing tonight. Rand a 6.9 at 111mph in the 1/8th. Finally got a good launch with no bog and a little wheel spin. 1.8 60ft.
Misfire stopped the 1/4 mile times down. 10.5 at 135mph.

Is was really cold out to I adjusted the timing down to 15 above 30psi and 17 from 22 to 30psi. Also subtracted 2 deg from the rear. and added 7% fuel to rear rotor. Took first gear to 9500rpms.

Off to IFO in Dallas.

Boost controller is just a solenoid between turbo and gates. On the T4 turbo this set did well.
Why the 20% E85, just to try something differant, and cooling.

13B-RX3

iTrader: (2)

So after adding fuel to the rear everything smoothed out?

How did the plugs look?

10.5 !!!! Thats good considering that there were ice on some of the cars after making a pass. Any video from the race?

Slammedblk7

iTrader: (7)

Im off to see this car run in ENNIS, i'll post vids

sleeper7

Went to IFO today and ran my best mph. 140. 10.5et. 1.68 60ft.

Added a total of 7% fuel to the rear rotor and added another 5% to the map and ran a clean pass. AFR is low to mid tens now. Timing was 18 up to 30psi and 15 after that. Third gear was the only gear to go over 30psi. I think having to add more fuel to the rear rotor is due to me not port matching the FD UIM to the FC LIM.

I guess with the 20% E85 fuel the AFR needs to be in the low 10s, not low 11s. EGT was also lower. 750c. Did'nt get enough runs to get a chance to see if adding a few more deg of timing would help.

Side note: qualified 3rd out of 13 cars in the street class. Lost in the first round due to the clutch letting go on the launch. I was first to go after they prepared the track and the amount of VHT they put down was amazing. I was going to ask them, why spray it down, just pour it strait out of the jug. It is amazing how much the stock turboII axles will take.

13B-RX3

iTrader: (2)

Congrats Chuck, It sounds like you had a good weekend.

sleeper7

Here's my rpm and boost on the 10.5 140 pass.

launch at 6843rpm boost was 4 and timing was 21, free reving
dropped to 5935rpm, boost was 14
then 7122 at 27
shift at 8656 at 30psi
second gear
5573 at 10psi
6966 at 27
8395 at 32
3rd gear
6144 at 17
7523 at 32
8700 at 33
4th gear
6430 at 27psi
6982 at 31
7607 at 32psi

Hit 30psi at 6475 in 3rd and 4th gear

Remember the gates open at 20psi to try to keep it a 30psi.
No two step off the line. stock axles so I slip the clutch some.

Highest injector duty cycle seen was 129%.

Erdin

well done some good times what ECU you using.

arghx

iTrader: (3)

exactly what wastegate setup are you running (size, location)? Are they recirculated?

sleeper7

Waste gates are 35mm. Already had them so that's what I used. Manifold runners are 2"ID and run strait out from the ports for almost 3". All turns are less then 75degs. Rear waste gate is on the first turn but at the 7:30 position and 2" from manifold. Front gate is just under the exhaust housing sticking out toward the radiator and is about 2" from manifold. 'someone' with allot of rotary knowledge suggested one 50mm or bigger for this turbo.

arghx

iTrader: (3)

I've never seen a comparison of two small wastegates versus one big one. I used to run one HKS 40mm on the HKS log manifold and it sucked for boost control. I had to crack the wastegate about 4psi before target pressure but it would still creep sometimes. My new setup I'm working on collects to a Tial 44m on a stainless mani.

Perhaps you should get a single Tial 60mm.

sleeper7

Going with different gate means building a new manifold. Right now I am going to live with what I have because I am leaving san antonio next month for Okinawa, wife has another two year tour overseas. So my racing attempts are over for awhile.

But, we (koa, forum member) fixed the clutch problem and the car is going back to the track to try spaying a 65 shot up to 10/12 psi. My goal for awhile now was to go 9.9 at 140mph+. Meet one, now going to try to get the other goal before leaving next month.

13B-RX3

iTrader: (2)

I wish you the best of luck on your 9 sec pass Chuck.

If you want i can keep that turbo warm while your gone

Slammedblk7

iTrader: (7)

what exactly was the deal with the clutch?

sleeper7

throwout bearing. It came apart and seized.

Slammedblk7

iTrader: (7)

quick fix, now get those times before you leave!

T04Eneedy

awsome times! what ecu are you running,also shoot me a PM im interested in a copy of your manifold!