Alright, attempting to start a database of spool up times for different turbo's on 13B applications. Please try to give as accurate information as possible.

So, if you could spare the time and information, please fill out something similar to below...


Full boost at RPM: 11 psi at 3400

Turbo: Garret 60-1 non BB
Turbine A/R: 1.01
Engine/Porting: S5 13b, stock 4 ports
Manifold I.D.: 2.157" (sch 10 2.0)
Manifold Length: 14 inches
Manifold Description: three 45's per runner, completely equal.
Exhaust: 4 inch all the way back.
Boost Control: Manual boost controller, twin 44 Tials.
Intercooler: Front mount

 

you didnt post which turbine wheel you're using (i'm assuming its a P-trim), you didnt say which gear you're doing this "measurement" in, and you didnt say what the intake air temps were.

those could all be pretty significant changes.

 

Ya, did forget about turbine wheel. It is a P trim. It was in 2nd gear. intake air temp was 100 on the dot. Truth is there is a lot of variables..

Any information you may think is important. please add it.


Full boost at RPM: 11 psi at 3400

Turbo: Garret 60-1 non BB
Turbine A/R: 1.01
Turbine Wheel: P-trim
Gear: 2nd
Vehicle Weight: 2620 lbs. total
Engine/Porting: S5 13b, stock 4 ports
Manifold I.D.: 2.157" (sch 10 2.0)
Manifold Length: 14 inches
Manifold Description: three 45's per runner, completely equal.
Exhaust: 3 inch turbo outlet, 15 degree concentric reducer to 4 inch all the way back.
Boost Control: Manual boost controller, twin 44 Tials.
Intercooler: Front mount
Intake Temp: 100 F
Ambient Temp: 87 F

 

Wouldn't intake diameter, length of tubing, rebuild quality, A/F ratio, ignition timing, Weight of flywheel, Weight of wheels + OD of tires also make a difference in turbo spool times?

 

And what RPM you start from...

 

Ya there is a lot of variables, but this isn't a explain all the variables that affect spool thread, it's who's spooling by what RPMs. I just wanted to have a bit of core information for immediate comparisons.

But, is any one spooling 35r's to 14 psi by 2500? or are they all around 3500? This is the type of answer I'm seeking. Basically, who has the fastest spooling setup with some of the common turbo's used on 13b's?

Possibly add in some datalogged stock turbo spool up times to see how far off we are from stock.

Then we can go into details of how it got to be the fastest.



And start from whatever RPM you feel will produce the earliest spool time. I've been wanting to compare a full throttle stomp vs a roll on throttle approach from about 1900 RPM's to see which is more effective.

 

i think most people talk about "spool time" when just punching the throttle in 4th gear from a low rpm (2000rpm maybe?) and looking for what rpm it takes to get to full boost (whatever they have it set to)

the problem is that "lag" is just response time, not an RPM at which a certain boost happens.

also, i find it hard to believe you can hit 11 psi on a p-trim 1.0 A/R T4 by 3400rpms in 2nd gear. there's enough gear reduction in 2nd gear to make your car accelerate through the rpms faster than it takes for the boost to climb up to 11psi... so either you have an incredibly responsive 1.0 a/r T4 setup, or your car is just really slow in 2nd gear. you should post a video of it.

 

and compression ratio is also a big contributor.

 

is the old catenet webpage with all the different setup dynos still alive somewhere?

 

Turblown TD61 (p-trim) journal bearing 1.0 A/R
Street port, XS/HKS Cast manifold, Vmount, 3.5inch DP
45celcius air temps. High 11afr during spool up to 11.0afr after 9psi

4th gear starting 2500rpm
10psi by 3000rpm
15psi by 3400rpm

 

Thats how I have done it to compare different setups.

3582R 1.06 T4
Street port w/3mm seals, HKS Tubular manifold, Vmount, 3" DP
Mid 11's afrs dropping to low 11's in boost, 315cc water starting at 7psi

4th gear
10psi by 2800rpm
full boost of 17psi comes a few hundred rpm later, but ive always just payed more attention to when I get 10psi for whatever reason.

 

Exactly.

There are also WAY more variables than just the turbo. Two cars (not RX-7) I'm thinking of right now had similar turbos and similar displacement engines, but one had pretty tame response to the throttle, so it actually wasn't very "laggy" in the sense that the engine accelerated quicker than the turbo, since the engine didn't accelerate all that quickly off-boost, but turbo response was still always about 1/2 second behind the engine until the RPM where everything came together and the turbo could really get moving... while the other one had scary-quick response to the point where it didn't even feel like a turbo engine, felt like the boost gauge was directly tied to the throttle pedal and it would instantly make whatever boost the turbo could at that particular RPM.

The difference was the second one had more compression and free flowing headers...

 

ive tried a couple different setups, but the best so far is running a journal bearing 60-1 hybrid (S5) with unclipped P-trim wheel. it got 15psi by 3300 RPM and was a blast to drive. never had that setup dyno[d, but i think it was somewhere around 350whp, using an ARC tmic

im currently running a custom manifold to experiment with runner size and length. im running a v-trim with stage III turbine.. spool is insane but it feels like it has lost some power. it hits 10psi easily by 2500. im ordered a p-trim housing and going to run back to the 60-1 to see how that compares

 

regardless of different setups being posted. I think this could be a good sticky thread. Given the fact people need to also post the ar housing & the port that they have on the motor.. helps others out to know what turbo is good for there application..
but kind of put the post how the single turbo section is
an example


so to continue this

13b-Rew
Agressive Street Port with stock ported housings
Garrett GT4202R (Q t-4 trim) 72mm/78mm turbine... with a 1.28ar housing
Boost @ 4700rpm
Full Boost @5400rpm @ 28psi
3.5 in downpipe with 3.in HKS hiper exhaust
greddy profec B spec II boost controller


car is semi PP port now so this might be updated again after the tune



also for people posting to post the compressor & turbine wheel size cause not many people know the size of some of these turbos

 

holset vgt from a 2008 dodge diesel A couple of vid. First is in neutral free revving to 7000 second vid in on highway in 4th around 3200rpm. Hitting around 28psi

13b-rew
Half-bridge with exhaust sleeve remove square port
Holset vgt he351
Spools 7-10psi at cruise lol
Full boost @3500-3800 30psi
4" into dual 3" exhaust
ms3 ecu controlling boost.
Also very bad tune. Near impossible to tune with this turbo. Need to setup multiple map to or use mass air to tune properly.

 

/\ hey darren stop trying to hold the camera while driving the car... geez got a headache lol j/k dude



i guess ill post the dyno up as well just for ***** & giggles as well

 

dark phantom, why the stock ported housings? and street ported irons

 

You may need to play around some more with MAP-based enrichments. I'm not familiar with what the MS3 can do but can you have it not engage MAP-based until you reach 90kpa or so? I know that under low load you can't use it at all on a "lumpy" engine since the burping and brapping will constantly throw enrichment at it. Assuming that your VE table is reasonably sound, it would get rid of that lean spot as boost comes up.

Sorry if this is academic for you and you've tried it already. Looks like a mean setup!

 

no reason... when i bought the motor it came already ported & closed.. Besides the fact he was selling it very cheap so i bought it & put the motor on the car & tunned it... The guy lied saying the housings were ported when they werent after i opended the motor to do the Semi Peripheral porting.

 

I posted about this subject in the 3rd gen section, title was something like "my hand at porting". Stock exhaust ports flow incredibly well and years of my experience tell me there is very little reason to modify the exhaust ports very much at all.

 

honestly djseven ive really havent seen any comparison between the 2... so unfortunatelly i cant really comment on any hp difference... i do know bigger exhaust flow allows the turbo to spool around 500rpm sooner

 

Stock exhaust ports have an "anti-reversion" lip. It's the step you can see/feel in there. Leave it stock and you can make more power than a ported exhaust port. Sounds weird, I know.

 

how about we also add hp/tq numbers @rpm?

say rpm to 200 whp and rpm to 200 wtq...

i think it would be more meaningful to me than only boost numbers

 

Ya! That is a better measurement, but I figured less people will have that information, and the dyno chart section should already have a lot of that.
I've always thought about taking a dyno chart, and adding every 1000 rpm interval together, to see who makes the most power across the whole useable rpm range. More of a "useable" power number. But it may or may not work well, I haven't tried it.

I'm really trying to find out what the "par" spool up RPM is for some turbo's.
It would be nice if we could end up with a scatter plot. Everyone would have to post a 4th gear 10 psi by rpm figure for it to really make good sense.

 

Hey is there any where I can find more information about your setup?