OFFICIAL Turbo Nomenclature guide
10-25-08, 04:08 PM
#1
OFFICIAL Turbo Nomenclature guide
I'm making this thread because honestly, understanding turbo nomenclature among all the different manufacturers can be confusing. A Greddy/Mitsu T-67 is NOT the same as a Garrett/HKS T-67/T04R/T04Z for example. When comparing turbos across manufactuers, a larger number after the "T" does not always mean it is the 'bigger/better turbo'.
So what I'm going to do here is start building a master list of some of the terms that are used by major manufacturers such as Garrett, Turbonetics, Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, Borg Warner, and Holset. The main goal of this thread is to clear up some confusion about nomenclature, rather than building an exhaustive list of all the size configurations available for every turbo.
I would appreciate it if people can contribute any corrections or additional information, and if we can get a good thread going I would like to see this thread a sticky in the main single turbo section or moved to the FAQ. Pics are courtesy of ebay and the online catalogs of some manufacturers.
Garrett T series
Let's start with the Garrett T series family of hotside flanges. These hotside flanges are used by most turbos that anyone would run a rotary. Other manufacturers may have their own name for their turbos, but the turbine inlet flange will most likely be one of the following:
T25 -- too small for a single turbo rotary, common on factory 4 cylinder turbos, I believe they are 4 bolt turbine inlets
T3 --- available in divided, undivided, and undivided with internal wastegate. Most of these turbos are too small for a rotary, but a few will work.
T4 --- available in divided, undivided, and undivided on-center configurations. This is the most common turbine inlet flange for an upgraded single turbo rotary.
T6 --- available in divided and undivided configurations. These are big turbos and will most likely make at least 500 to the wheels on a rotary.
Note that a hotside which does not have an internal wastegate is called a "free-float" turbine housing.
The two most common hybrid turbos (smaller turbine housing than compressor housing) are the T28 (a T25/T3 hybrid) and the T3/T4 hybrid.
So what I'm going to do here is start building a master list of some of the terms that are used by major manufacturers such as Garrett, Turbonetics, Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, Borg Warner, and Holset. The main goal of this thread is to clear up some confusion about nomenclature, rather than building an exhaustive list of all the size configurations available for every turbo.
I would appreciate it if people can contribute any corrections or additional information, and if we can get a good thread going I would like to see this thread a sticky in the main single turbo section or moved to the FAQ. Pics are courtesy of ebay and the online catalogs of some manufacturers.
Garrett T series
Let's start with the Garrett T series family of hotside flanges. These hotside flanges are used by most turbos that anyone would run a rotary. Other manufacturers may have their own name for their turbos, but the turbine inlet flange will most likely be one of the following:
T25 -- too small for a single turbo rotary, common on factory 4 cylinder turbos, I believe they are 4 bolt turbine inlets
T3 --- available in divided, undivided, and undivided with internal wastegate. Most of these turbos are too small for a rotary, but a few will work.
T4 --- available in divided, undivided, and undivided on-center configurations. This is the most common turbine inlet flange for an upgraded single turbo rotary.
T6 --- available in divided and undivided configurations. These are big turbos and will most likely make at least 500 to the wheels on a rotary.
Note that a hotside which does not have an internal wastegate is called a "free-float" turbine housing.
The two most common hybrid turbos (smaller turbine housing than compressor housing) are the T28 (a T25/T3 hybrid) and the T3/T4 hybrid.
10-25-08, 04:16 PM
#2
The T04 series
This is where it starts getting confusing as people and manufacturers throw around a lot of different terms. In general car conversations, when someone refers to a T04B or T04E turbo they could be referring to a number of different things. T04B and T04E turbos come in various compressor and turbine A/R and wheel sizes. The most common for the rotary are the T04E 57 or 60 trim and the T04B 60-1, which is similar to the T04S that I'm about to get to. It can get even more confusing because there are a lot of T04E and T04B hybrids out there that are not normally used on rotary engines.
While the terms T04B and T04E could refer to a lot of different turbos (check the turbonetics online catalog and you'll see what I mean), the terms T04S and T04R are more specific. In typical usage, a T04S turbo specifically refers to a turbo with a 60-1 compressor wheel (~60mm inducer/~76mm exducer) and .70 A/R compressor cover. A T04R usually refers to the Garrett T67 turbo with a 67mm compressor wheel inducer. The T04Z is a ball version of the T04R/T67. HKS sells their own slightly modified version of these turbos.
Turbine Wheel trim
In their online catalog Turbonetics lists 3 main types of turbine wheels, and these are common across manufactures. The "big shaft" turbine wheel sizes are as follows:
O trim : 58mm exducer 74 mm major
P trim : 64mm exducer 74mm major
Q trim : 68mm exducer 79mm major
There is also a modified Q trim wheel called the GT-Q, but I don't know too much about it. Of those 4, the P trim is by far the most common turbine wheel used on a rotary application.
This is where it starts getting confusing as people and manufacturers throw around a lot of different terms. In general car conversations, when someone refers to a T04B or T04E turbo they could be referring to a number of different things. T04B and T04E turbos come in various compressor and turbine A/R and wheel sizes. The most common for the rotary are the T04E 57 or 60 trim and the T04B 60-1, which is similar to the T04S that I'm about to get to. It can get even more confusing because there are a lot of T04E and T04B hybrids out there that are not normally used on rotary engines.
While the terms T04B and T04E could refer to a lot of different turbos (check the turbonetics online catalog and you'll see what I mean), the terms T04S and T04R are more specific. In typical usage, a T04S turbo specifically refers to a turbo with a 60-1 compressor wheel (~60mm inducer/~76mm exducer) and .70 A/R compressor cover. A T04R usually refers to the Garrett T67 turbo with a 67mm compressor wheel inducer. The T04Z is a ball version of the T04R/T67. HKS sells their own slightly modified version of these turbos.
Turbine Wheel trim
In their online catalog Turbonetics lists 3 main types of turbine wheels, and these are common across manufactures. The "big shaft" turbine wheel sizes are as follows:
O trim : 58mm exducer 74 mm major
P trim : 64mm exducer 74mm major
Q trim : 68mm exducer 79mm major
There is also a modified Q trim wheel called the GT-Q, but I don't know too much about it. Of those 4, the P trim is by far the most common turbine wheel used on a rotary application.
10-25-08, 04:32 PM
#3
Turbonetics turbos
Turbonetics lists a lot of turbos and compressor wheels in their online catalog. In addition to the T04E and T04B turbos I've already mentioned, some of the most common turbonetics turbos for the rotary are:
60-1 (already mentioned this)
62-1 (flows better up top compared to 60-1)
T61 (NOT the same as a 60-1, more efficient at higher boost)
TS04 (NOT the same as a T04S/60-1)
There is also the T76 etc. Remember to research carefully the size and flow capability of the wheels when comparing turbos across manufacturers. Generally speaking, for most Turbonetics and Garrett "T" series turbos (GT series is different, don't get confused!), the number after the "T" is the size of the compressor inducer in millimeters.
Garrett GT series
The excellent online Garrett catalog makes getting information about these turbos pretty easy. There are a few things to keep in mind though in terms of nomenclature. The most common GT families of turbos are the GT2x, GT3x, and GT4x. So some of the terminology mirrors that of the T series. Let's do an example though.
GT3582R -- GT series turbo, 35 the more specific type, 82 is the compressor exducer (not inducer), and R means ball bearing. Don't get this stuff confused! A Garrett T67/T04R/T04Z may have a smaller number after the "T" than a GT3582, but the T67 is significantly bigger as it has a 67 millimeter inducer versus the 61mm inducer of the GT35. Note that a lot of GT35's are T3 inlet, but A-spec sells a T4.
Turbonetics lists a lot of turbos and compressor wheels in their online catalog. In addition to the T04E and T04B turbos I've already mentioned, some of the most common turbonetics turbos for the rotary are:
60-1 (already mentioned this)
62-1 (flows better up top compared to 60-1)
T61 (NOT the same as a 60-1, more efficient at higher boost)
TS04 (NOT the same as a T04S/60-1)
There is also the T76 etc. Remember to research carefully the size and flow capability of the wheels when comparing turbos across manufacturers. Generally speaking, for most Turbonetics and Garrett "T" series turbos (GT series is different, don't get confused!), the number after the "T" is the size of the compressor inducer in millimeters.
Garrett GT series
The excellent online Garrett catalog makes getting information about these turbos pretty easy. There are a few things to keep in mind though in terms of nomenclature. The most common GT families of turbos are the GT2x, GT3x, and GT4x. So some of the terminology mirrors that of the T series. Let's do an example though.
GT3582R -- GT series turbo, 35 the more specific type, 82 is the compressor exducer (not inducer), and R means ball bearing. Don't get this stuff confused! A Garrett T67/T04R/T04Z may have a smaller number after the "T" than a GT3582, but the T67 is significantly bigger as it has a 67 millimeter inducer versus the 61mm inducer of the GT35. Note that a lot of GT35's are T3 inlet, but A-spec sells a T4.
10-25-08, 07:27 PM
#4
Mitsubishi/Greddy Turbos
Mitsubishi terminology is different from other manufacturers. They have several different families of turbine/compressor housings and the hotsides not normally listed in terms of Area/Radius (a ratio), but actual cm^2.
Here's an example turbo name: TD04-13G . TD04 is the family of housings, a bit like T25 or T3 for Garrett's. The 13 I suppose refers to the size of the compressor wheel in some way, but I'm not entirely sure. A bigger number usually means a bigger wheel though. "G" has to do with the shape of the compressor blades I think. It's not all that important for rotary applications.
Here are the major families of Mitsubishi/Greddy turbos, non of which are ball bearing to my knowledge.
TD04 -- Miniscule turbos that would not work well on our cars. The TD04-13G is the stock turbo on a 1st gen automatic Eclipse/Talon/Laser. These hotsides have a 3 bolt flange.
TD05 -- I think these are around the size of a T25, but a TD05 hotside will not bolt up to a T25 flange I'm pretty sure. The TD05-14B is the stock turbo on a manual transmission 1st gen Eclipse/Talon/Laser. The hotsides of these turbos are too small for a single turbo rotary generally.
TD06 -- A TD06 has a T3 inlet and will bolt up to a T3 manifold. The smallest one you would run on a rotary is a TD06-20G, which comes with the Greddy turbo kit for the FC. The other common turbo is the TD06-25G (Greddy/Mitsu T67). I have never looked at the Greddy kits available for Rx-7's but I know for other cars the 20G has a T3 hotside.
TD07 -- A TD07 has a T4 inlet and will bolt up to a T4 manifold. A common TD07 turbo is the T78.
TD08 -- Bigger than a TD07, but I'm not sure if it's a T6 flange or not.
The key to understanding the Greddy/Mitsu nomenclature: the first number is the hotside family and the second number is the compressor side family. So a T67 is a TD06 Hotside with TD07 compressor, T78 is TD07 hotside with TD08 compressor, etc.
Mitsubishi terminology is different from other manufacturers. They have several different families of turbine/compressor housings and the hotsides not normally listed in terms of Area/Radius (a ratio), but actual cm^2.
Here's an example turbo name: TD04-13G . TD04 is the family of housings, a bit like T25 or T3 for Garrett's. The 13 I suppose refers to the size of the compressor wheel in some way, but I'm not entirely sure. A bigger number usually means a bigger wheel though. "G" has to do with the shape of the compressor blades I think. It's not all that important for rotary applications.
Here are the major families of Mitsubishi/Greddy turbos, non of which are ball bearing to my knowledge.
TD04 -- Miniscule turbos that would not work well on our cars. The TD04-13G is the stock turbo on a 1st gen automatic Eclipse/Talon/Laser. These hotsides have a 3 bolt flange.
TD05 -- I think these are around the size of a T25, but a TD05 hotside will not bolt up to a T25 flange I'm pretty sure. The TD05-14B is the stock turbo on a manual transmission 1st gen Eclipse/Talon/Laser. The hotsides of these turbos are too small for a single turbo rotary generally.
TD06 -- A TD06 has a T3 inlet and will bolt up to a T3 manifold. The smallest one you would run on a rotary is a TD06-20G, which comes with the Greddy turbo kit for the FC. The other common turbo is the TD06-25G (Greddy/Mitsu T67). I have never looked at the Greddy kits available for Rx-7's but I know for other cars the 20G has a T3 hotside.
TD07 -- A TD07 has a T4 inlet and will bolt up to a T4 manifold. A common TD07 turbo is the T78.
TD08 -- Bigger than a TD07, but I'm not sure if it's a T6 flange or not.
The key to understanding the Greddy/Mitsu nomenclature: the first number is the hotside family and the second number is the compressor side family. So a T67 is a TD06 Hotside with TD07 compressor, T78 is TD07 hotside with TD08 compressor, etc.
10-25-08, 07:36 PM
#5
Hitachi turbos
The stock turbos on Rx-7's are made by Hitachi. The FC stock turbo is the HT-18, the FD stock turbos are HT-12's, and the Cosmo 13B-RE turbos are HT-10's. All these turbos have proprietary hotsides that will not bolt to standard T3, T4 etc manifolds.
Holset turbos
The most common Holset turbos are the H1C/HX35/HY35 and the H1E/HX40 . The H1C, HX35, and HY35 all have a T3 inlet. The H1C is an earlier model turbo with a free float housing and v-band discharge. The HX35 and HY35 are usually internally wastegated, with the HY35 having a smaller undivided hotside. The HX and HY turbos are internally wastegated. All of these turbos came factory in Cummins Dodge Ram diesel trucks at one point or another.
The H1E/HX40 turbos have T4 inlets and come with much larger hotsides available than the H1C/HX35/HY35 series. There are also HX55 and larger turbos which will make enormous power.
MasterPower etc
Most of the lesser turbocharger manufacturers will use standard Garrett and Turbonetics names for their turbos, such as T04E, T04S, etc. The actual sizes of the wheels and housings may not be exactly the same as what is offered by the major manufacturers.
Borg Warner
I don't know a whole lot about Borg Warner turbos, except that they are commonly resold by Bullseye. The turbos tend to say Schwitzer on the compressor housings. Besides that, I think the S200 series are T3, S300 series are T4, and the S400 series are T6, but please, somebody post up about these turbos.
The stock turbos on Rx-7's are made by Hitachi. The FC stock turbo is the HT-18, the FD stock turbos are HT-12's, and the Cosmo 13B-RE turbos are HT-10's. All these turbos have proprietary hotsides that will not bolt to standard T3, T4 etc manifolds.
Holset turbos
The most common Holset turbos are the H1C/HX35/HY35 and the H1E/HX40 . The H1C, HX35, and HY35 all have a T3 inlet. The H1C is an earlier model turbo with a free float housing and v-band discharge. The HX35 and HY35 are usually internally wastegated, with the HY35 having a smaller undivided hotside. The HX and HY turbos are internally wastegated. All of these turbos came factory in Cummins Dodge Ram diesel trucks at one point or another.
The H1E/HX40 turbos have T4 inlets and come with much larger hotsides available than the H1C/HX35/HY35 series. There are also HX55 and larger turbos which will make enormous power.
MasterPower etc
Most of the lesser turbocharger manufacturers will use standard Garrett and Turbonetics names for their turbos, such as T04E, T04S, etc. The actual sizes of the wheels and housings may not be exactly the same as what is offered by the major manufacturers.
Borg Warner
I don't know a whole lot about Borg Warner turbos, except that they are commonly resold by Bullseye. The turbos tend to say Schwitzer on the compressor housings. Besides that, I think the S200 series are T3, S300 series are T4, and the S400 series are T6, but please, somebody post up about these turbos.
10-29-08, 04:46 PM
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Hitachi turbos
The stock turbos on Rx-7's are made by Hitachi. The FC stock turbo is the HT-18, the FD stock turbos are HT-12's, and the Cosmo 13B-RE turbos are HT-10's. All these turbos have proprietary hotsides that will not bolt to standard T3, T4 etc manifolds.
Holset turbos
The most common Holset turbos are the H1C/HX35/HY35 and the H1E/HX40 . The H1C, HX35, and HY35 all have a T3 inlet. The H1C is an earlier model turbo with a free float housing and v-band discharge. The HX35 and HY35 are usually internally wastegated, with the HY35 having a smaller undivided hotside. The HX and HY turbos are internally wastegated. All of these turbos came factory in Cummins Dodge Ram diesel trucks at one point or another.
The H1E/HX40 turbos have T4 inlets and come with much larger hotsides available than the H1C/HX35/HY35 series. There are also HX55 and larger turbos which will make enormous power.
MasterPower etc
Most of the lesser turbocharger manufacturers will use standard Garrett and Turbonetics names for their turbos, such as T04E, T04S, etc. The actual sizes of the wheels and housings may not be exactly the same as what is offered by the major manufacturers.
Borg Warner
I don't know a whole lot about Borg Warner turbos, except that they are commonly resold by Bullseye. The turbos tend to say Schwitzer on the compressor housings. Besides that, I think the S200 series are T3, S300 series are T4, and the S400 series are T6, but please, somebody post up about these turbos.
The stock turbos on Rx-7's are made by Hitachi. The FC stock turbo is the HT-18, the FD stock turbos are HT-12's, and the Cosmo 13B-RE turbos are HT-10's. All these turbos have proprietary hotsides that will not bolt to standard T3, T4 etc manifolds.
Holset turbos
The most common Holset turbos are the H1C/HX35/HY35 and the H1E/HX40 . The H1C, HX35, and HY35 all have a T3 inlet. The H1C is an earlier model turbo with a free float housing and v-band discharge. The HX35 and HY35 are usually internally wastegated, with the HY35 having a smaller undivided hotside. The HX and HY turbos are internally wastegated. All of these turbos came factory in Cummins Dodge Ram diesel trucks at one point or another.
The H1E/HX40 turbos have T4 inlets and come with much larger hotsides available than the H1C/HX35/HY35 series. There are also HX55 and larger turbos which will make enormous power.
MasterPower etc
Most of the lesser turbocharger manufacturers will use standard Garrett and Turbonetics names for their turbos, such as T04E, T04S, etc. The actual sizes of the wheels and housings may not be exactly the same as what is offered by the major manufacturers.
Borg Warner
I don't know a whole lot about Borg Warner turbos, except that they are commonly resold by Bullseye. The turbos tend to say Schwitzer on the compressor housings. Besides that, I think the S200 series are T3, S300 series are T4, and the S400 series are T6, but please, somebody post up about these turbos.
For Borg Warners, you can purchase them at any local diesel shop for cheaper prices...99.9% of them are box units, but the internet is still new to them so companies are capatilizing on consumer ignorance. I deal with a diesel shop that gets them to me for half the cost of most vendors on the common forum. Key is getting the part #.
S200's are T3 and T4 based
S300's are the same as well
S400's are T4 and T6 based.
The BW362 and BW366's at your local diesel shop are 899-950 bucks. Some of the dealers like mentioned and some others jack the price up big time. The S400's all are <$1000 and even with a race cover they are as well. Some companies are charging twice the price for them.
Turbonetics now has dropped most of the Garrett names. They now deal with HP series and F-1 series nomenclature. That is cause Turbonetics now casts their own wheels and turbines and no longer is using the GT wheels.
Garrett still utilizes the GT nomenclature but alot of it can be crossed over to a TV series turbo and can be bought for cheaper as well.
Holset is working on performance units so I am waiting to see what will happen with that
11-10-08, 02:58 PM
#7
update on Holset stuff... I am incorporating some information (collected from various posts on this and other forums, can't guarantee accuracy) about hotside measurements.
Holset housing size - Garrett approximate equivalent
9cm^2 - .48 A/R
12cm^2 - .63 A/R
16cm^2 - .83 A/R
18cm^2 - 1.00 A/R
22cm^2 - 1.15 A/R
One more thing. Not every HX and HY is internally wastegated, but I don't think there are any internally wastegated H1C/H1E turbos.
Holset housing size - Garrett approximate equivalent
9cm^2 - .48 A/R
12cm^2 - .63 A/R
16cm^2 - .83 A/R
18cm^2 - 1.00 A/R
22cm^2 - 1.15 A/R
One more thing. Not every HX and HY is internally wastegated, but I don't think there are any internally wastegated H1C/H1E turbos.
Last edited by arghx; 11-10-08 at 03:09 PM.
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11-19-08, 12:58 PM
#9
Updated list of OEM Hitachi Turbos, none of which will bolt up to aftermarket manifolds:
HT-10: Stock turbos on 13B-RE. Stock secondary turbo on 20B (20B had different sized primary and secondary turbo)
HT-12: Stock turbos on 13B-REW
HT-15: Stock primary turbo on 20B
HT18S-2S: Stock turbo on FC, I am guessing the "2S" means twin scroll because these turbos have divided inlets.
HT-10: Stock turbos on 13B-RE. Stock secondary turbo on 20B (20B had different sized primary and secondary turbo)
HT-12: Stock turbos on 13B-REW
HT-15: Stock primary turbo on 20B
HT18S-2S: Stock turbo on FC, I am guessing the "2S" means twin scroll because these turbos have divided inlets.
02-13-09, 08:46 AM
#10
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Below are some details i've got for the Schwitzer (Borg Warner) S200 series:
Compressor Housing:
A/R .60
4" Inlet
3" V-Band Outlet
Compressor:
61mm Inducer
Turbine Housing:
A/R .88
T3 Flange
4" V-Band outlet
Turbine:
63mm Exducer
Oil-cooled
Compressor Housing:
A/R .60
4" Inlet
3" V-Band Outlet
Compressor:
61mm Inducer
Turbine Housing:
A/R .88
T3 Flange
4" V-Band outlet
Turbine:
63mm Exducer
Oil-cooled
03-06-09, 01:16 AM
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I've seen the following names for these turbos in the mix:
AirWerks, Bullseye, Borg Warner, Schnitzer.
And the following designations for seemingly the same turbo:
S300SX 91/79 (full-race.com) 91 being compressor exducer
S366 (undergroundmotorsports.com, bullseyepower.com) 66 being compressor inducer
S66X (forcedinductions.com)
And the following option permutations not consistent from vendor to vendor:
extended tip/non-extended tip (undergroundmotorsports.com) or
standard cover/race cover (spoolinperformance.com)
Full-race.com is trying to tell me the S200SX 75/70 series is the model people are using for 425-475whp RX7's which I think wrong, but due to the chaos I'm not entirely confident that I just am not following their nomenclature.
Finding a compressor map is sketchy and I'm not sure the ones I find apply to extended tip vs. non-extended tip. The one for the S362 on bullseyepower.com doesn't even have adiabatic efficiency numbers on it, just a pretty picture is all)
03-06-09, 12:36 PM
#13
91/79 = S366
88/75 = S362
75/70 = S256
The BW race cover is a 9.5" bell inlet housing. The Bullseye is almost the same, but 10" bell inlet. Some of these turbos are extended tip, some are not.
At roughly 60 lb/min with the S256, it should be possible to make 450whp on an RX-7, but you would want the 74mm compressor, not the 69mm.
If anyone has questions on the BW/Bullseye stuff let me know, Ive become pretty familiar with it. I also know Garrett and Precision VERY well.
88/75 = S362
75/70 = S256
The BW race cover is a 9.5" bell inlet housing. The Bullseye is almost the same, but 10" bell inlet. Some of these turbos are extended tip, some are not.
At roughly 60 lb/min with the S256, it should be possible to make 450whp on an RX-7, but you would want the 74mm compressor, not the 69mm.
If anyone has questions on the BW/Bullseye stuff let me know, Ive become pretty familiar with it. I also know Garrett and Precision VERY well.
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