JAPSPECGTUs

I am getting a fresh streetported Atkins S4 for my car in about 1 month. I want a bigger turbo...this S5 stock turbo isn't gonna cut it for me, I wanna have a highway/track monster(400-500 rwp). So I'm planning on buying a new turbo system. Right now I have a Spearco FMIC the dimensions of the core are 18/8/3". I want t upgrade to a T66(Garret, GReddy, Turbonetics...) I went to search and so many things popped up. I read a few and it poduced more questions than answers. All this technica talk is like reading an ancient language from India. I know very little so be specific... So far I know I need these items
T-66 Turbo "kit(With Manifold)
Oil Cooler Lines
Wastegate
Custom DP
Standalone EMS(I guess this is optional but a must)
Larger Injectors...(Size???)
Fuel Pump
What else do I need,will my IC hold up to the 20-25 psi?
What I will be doing is slowely saving up the money but putting the stuff that I can put on i.e. fuel pump and standalone before installing the T66
What do all the gurus out there suggest? What am I missing from the picture(besides about $4000-5000) I decided I wanted to go bigger when I was sick of these V8 guys calling my "4-cyl" slow before they even know what I have. And the freaking riced J-Body's out here.......ahhh it's crazy...

JAPSPECGTUs

I must make some changes......I'm saying about 15-17 psi not 20-25......at least not yet.......

Silver7

If you gave a specific question more people would be more willing to help you. So far your list looks pretty good. I would say 4-5K is a very low estimate but I suppose it could be done for around that if you can do all of the work yourself. What types of things don't you understand?

Trav

Well something to keep in mind as you're planning. If you're wanting to go w/ the staged approach to this, you will definitely NOT want to buy your turbo first. Otherwise, you'll have a turbo that you can't use. Basically you need to buy the items to support that turbo first. i.e. fuel pump, injectors, IC, etc. Some of those items you can put on before your turbo, but if you stick a big turbo on there and crank up the boost before you have fuel, well you're gonna be adding a new engine to your list of things to buy also. It looks like you started to mention that anyway, so I think you've got the right idea.

As far as injector sizes, you'll probably get differing opinions, but best I can tell, you'll probably want something like 800ish cc primaries, and 1200-1600ish secondaries. This will be similar to what I'm going to run anyway and it looks like your requirements will be simliar to mine. Others might say go ahead and get bigger primaries... Do some research on that subject.

You have the Spearco IC, I doubt you'll have any problems w/ that. They're very nice (wish I had one). You'll easily handle your estimated boost there and it should cool very well as they're supposed to be pretty efficient.

JAPSPECGTUs

My question is about the custom manifold, what requirements are their for this and all this P/Q Trim stuff....like I guess they are variations of the T66 from brand to brand? What is the difference? Can I just buy a T66 from either brands I mentioned above or do I have to look for some sort of hybridization that will work well. My goal is 400-500 rwp with boost levels that will work on pump gas. I meant 4-5k in parts and such, I know a few people who can help me put this stuff together and my stepdad knows the owner of Rush Hour Performance in Fairview Heights, Ill so tuning related questions can be helped there. In response to the stages, yes I will buy and put the turbo on last. For now I will run 10psi on stock turbo with my Spearco, that way I'll keep the boost low enough to save the motor for the T66.

Silver7

P trim is the most popular trim when it comes to turbocharged rotaries. There comes a point where P trim exhaust wheels are too restrictive when one is trying to make BIG HP numbers, so they go to a less restrictive Q trim wheel. The downsides to Q trim is they are more expensive and the spoolup is slower. There are a few manufacturers of a T66 turbo, Turbonetics, Innovative Turbo, etc. They are basically the same. Greddy does not make a T66 to the best of my knowledge.
425 HP is attainable on pump gas but this is pretty much the limit. Anything over 425 HP will require race gas or some sort of water/alcohol injection to keep from blowing your motor. Most people will not attemp to boost their engines above 15 psi on pump gas. Beyond 15 psi, the margin of error become extremely narrow. As for manifolds, just about any type will work. A divided manifold will spool faster than an undivided one. Undivided manifolds will generally produce more peak power. 13 inch runners seem to be the optimum length that incorporates good power with fast spoolup. Cast manifolds are very popular due to their durability. It all depends on what type of power curve you are looking for and what your car is going to be used for. You'll find that everyone has a different opinion on this.

BDC

That's about the top limit you want to run (15-17psi) on that S4 block. Those things have a tendency to break the cast iron around the rear dowel pin from housing stretching. I recommend actually running a slightly smaller turbo setup, perhaps a 60-1 w/ a P-Trim 0.81 divided for the street or 1.00 divided for higher RPM power. You'll easily land well over 350 to 375 on an extend ported motor w/ aftermarket EFI system.

B

JAPSPECGTUs

See....you confused me, I have no idea what you just said.........The only thing I understood is: get a smaller turbo. Block will crack at nething over 17 psi and the rwp you mentioned. So why wouldnt 15psi with a T66 work, or is it not worth it for the price, would a T04 be better? I mean they are cheaper as well so.........

Silver7

The 60-1 turbo is better suited for the 15 psi range. The T66 is designed to make big power at higher boost. Buying a T66 and running 15 psi on pump gas would be kind of a waste. The spoolup will also be slower. You can make over 400 RWHP with a 60-1 on pump gas and it will spool very quickly.

JAPSPECGTUs

Sounds good...but what if I wanted to go big!(90% sure it wont happen because in a year and a half ill be going to college......) Okay so where can I find info on the 60-1, who makes it, were can I buy it. Is it ball-bearing(really doesn't matter though I guess)? How can I get a manifold for this? Wastegate? Average price for the 60-1? Do I need a custom dp and where can I obtain one? What about the price compared to a T04? thanks guys

Silver7

I bought my 60-1 from Innovative Turbo for just under $1K. You can get a BB option for $600 extra. All this will do is help spoolup. The 60-1, like most other turbos, uses a T4 exhaust flange. It will bolt up to any manifold with a T4 flange. You can buy manifolds from well known companies like HKS or XS Engineering or you can have one custom built. If you do some research you should be able to find some very good fabricators who can build you a manifold. The GT3540 turbo would also suit your needs since it is roughly the same size as a 60-1. This turbo is a little different than the rest of them since it uses a T3 flange. You would need a different manifold to run this turbo. It sounds to me like you would be better off going with a turbo kit. That way you don't have to go through as much trouble scrounging around for parts. XS engineering sells a very good kit that utilizes a 60-1 turbo. They call it their "T04S" turbo kit.

JAPSPECGTUs

Ahhh I like the Kit at Rx7store.net for the T04S.....however it is only for 93-95 it says...will it bolt up to my S4 block? If not where do they sell the FC kit? About this kit....is it more effective(money wise) than making a custom set because 3500 is a lot of money to drop on the turbo w/o estimating the cost of fuel management and injectors.......

chris-reedtn

Whats so wrong with the t66? I think thats what you need. haha


-Chris

Silver7

You can do a custom kit and as long as you do all the install work it shouldn't cost you over 3K.

JAPSPECGTUs

Man I don't think I will be able to afford this....I'm just gonna get a stage 3 bnr.....so I will only get about 320 rwhp but at least it can be still pretty quick.....at about 320 rwp what would be the average 1/4?