hiroichi1515

iTrader: (17)

Ok... So yet another issue.

I have been running 550cc primaries and 720 secondaries for quite awhile now, and had the car tuned the way I liked it. I was at 87% at 10 psi of boost. There was a couple of times while learning how to use the boost controller properly it spiked to 14 psi. At those time im sure the duty cycle was nearly maxed out. Fast forward to two days ago, I went from the previous setup to 720cc primaries as well. I was unable to make any changes to the map at that because I didn't have my pc or palm. Anyway the was running really lean 15 - 16 and would not idle. I figured since I was still on the same setting 550cc and 720cc it would run rich with all 720s but it did not. i tried to boost it just to see what the afrs where and what do you know its in the 10s. That's what I was expecting but also to be rich in vacuum too. I made it home, and changed the setting to the 720/720. Set the idle then went for a drive. With the map zeroed out, the afrs was 17 - 18 with the car jerking nonstop. I've changed the setting to 550/550 and the afrs are around 14 - 16 in vacuum with the map zeroed out.

Today I changed the afm, secondary fuel rail, fuel filter, and checked the voltage at the pump (already rewired). The injectors I put in where brand new, so I don't think that is the issue but I dont know what else to test. My only other though was to reset the ecu, but I don't want to do that until the weekend.

Please let me know if anyone has any ideas. Thanks

jg13b

If it was fine before the injector swap (vac leak always being the #1 thing) ECM seeing the wrong resistance from the primaries seems most obvious. I'm not even sure how it would run or if at all with the wrong resistance injectors in there, just a thought.

hiroichi1515

iTrader: (17)

the injectors I had in before were the s5 high imp injectors. What resistance are those at? The new ones I put in are also high imp.

Thanks,

hiroichi1515

iTrader: (17)

could the fuel pump possibly be going out? I had a brand new fd pump installed and it died in about 5 months. I bought this one used, but the other one did not have issues like this. It was just fine one moment and dead the next.

RotaryRocket88

iTrader: (7)

What turbo? 4x 720cc injectors, right? Can you post a log of the problem?

Injector resistance is not an issue unless you use low impedance injectors without resistors. Then you'll just burn up the ECU.

hiroichi1515

iTrader: (17)

The turbo is a hybrid that I recently built. I have 4x 720cc injectors on the 4x 550cc setting in the rtek. I will get a log for you later tonight. Yesterday I moved the fuel pump ground directly to the battery and that seemed to help alot. The afrs were in the 10's and 11's quite a bit. I got it up to around 12 and 13ish, then night fall came. When I turned on my headlight the afrs went to 15 - 16.8 ish around 14 - 18 inches of vacuum. It's also not constant. It will stay there for a bit then jump back to 13's while I hold the throttle steady. Any ideas?

chatchie

iTrader: (22)

Whats the voltage when you turn the headlights on? Voltage at the pump when under load/off load?

My voltage drops to around 12 at idle and back up to 13.5ish off idle.

turbo2ltr

iTrader: (1)

Or Hi impedance with resistors.


Is the ECU properly bolted back into place? Sounds like you have a grounding issue.

jg13b

Sounds by that like its low voltage to the fuel pump. I'd test the voltage at the pump with every electrical load on.

I used to see it get a lot leaner at idle by turning the lights and blower on. Rev it a bit and the voltage comes back up to normal. The stock charging system sucks.

hiroichi1515

iTrader: (17)

Ok.... So I swapped my 550cc injectors back in and everything has been great. The 720cc I had at in the primaries where now in the secondary position and everything was been going smooth for months.

Fast forward to two days ago. I picked up some 820cc injectors and decided to go 720/820 to handle the extra boost I was planning to run. After putting them in and starting the car with no adjustment the afrs at idle are still the same and a tad leaner during cruise. Just for kicks I switch it to the 720/720 preset in the rtek and the idle afrs went to 17 and I had to give it some throttle to stay on. I changed the preset back to 550/550 and went for a drive. Once I got into boost it was super rich so I tuned it out and everything was ok.

Well now today after I get home from work and let the car cool down for maybe two hours I start it. Guess what... Idle is at 700rpm and the afrs are in the 11's. This is what I was expecting to happen from the beginning but for some reason it didn't. Well I go for a short drive and after about 30 seconds its back to the way it was before, idling in the 14's and sometimes hitting 15ish while cruising. On the way home I started smelling something and check the wires at the battery and the fuel pump wire was hot as well as the ground wire connecting the battery to the chassis. I went back to the relay that I have the pump connected to and that was burning up as well. I'm at a loss and have no idea what is going on.

I believe the wires may be getting hot from a lose or bad connection but would this make the pump run in over drive and create the overly rich condition that is randomly starting to happen or have I always had a bad connection and it has never provided the full flow until now with the random richness it is doing at idle.

These problems do not occur if the 720's are in the secondary position and they work very well there. I assumed that maybe since the injectors are modified there may not be enough flow at idle and cruise for them to operate as they should so I was going to upgrade my fd pump to a Walbro. Now since it is going super rich at times that throws that theory out the window....

I am at a loss and have no idea, what to do, where to look, or what to check. Does anyone have any advice what so ever?



S4 keg
S5 fuel rails
720cc pri / 820cc sec hi imp(carukorex modified ones)
FD fuel pump (wired directly to battery with relay)

hiroichi1515

iTrader: (17)

So I start the car this morning and it fires up instantly, idle is in the 11's the whole time this morning on the way to work idling at 800. Before I swapped the injectors and the 1st day I ran them like this idle was at 1000ish in the 14's. Driving to work was normal except for a 15 - 16ish spot at 12 - 14 inches of vacuum. After that it never went that low again. Fuel pump wire is still hot, or rather warm but I don't know if that is normal or not. I will be rewiring that connection this evening. The ground wire from the battery to the chassis is also warm. If it makes a difference my pinion snubber is also my grounding point. Will keep you guys posted and stay on the look out for any advice.

Thanks!!!

hiroichi1515

iTrader: (17)

Really..... Not even a single comment...

Anyway another update. After work I rewired the fuel pump again. I soldered all connections and used heat shrink and electrical tape. I The car starts instantly is idling in the 11's. Voltage at the pump was 12.0 with headlights on and hazards going at the same time. I go for a drive afrs where in the 12's - 13's for about 30 seconds. Then slowly it start climbing til it got to 17 then then I pulled over in neutral. The car dropped down to 700 rpms with a 11 afr at idle. Then (this has never happened before) all my gauges, cluster, headlights started flickering as if you would quickly repeatedly try to crank the car and stop (as in moving the key back and forth back and forth. At this point I shut the car down and check my connections again. Everything looked good. Turned the car back on and made it home with no issues other than 16 - 17ish afrs at times. Once home I swapped out the main relay (just for the heck of it) and went for another drive. This time the car only hit the 15's once or twice and drove fine other than that. Idle is still really low and very rich, but I will adjust that tomorrow. If this keeps up I am going to swap the 550cc primaries back in.

Now the big question......

If I swap the other 550cc injectors back in what could possibly go wrong with my injectors for it to cause all of this.

088

iTrader: (9)

Try logging battery voltage while all this is happening? You might have a phantom electrical problem with the injector swap being coincidental rather than causative.

Buggy

iTrader: (8)

I'd say you have a base electrical issue with the car itself. I would do some voltage drop testing on your main electrical system (battery, alternator, etc.) and on your fuel pump circuit. Also check your charging system. Something is not right there. Sounds like a grounding issue to me.

hiroichi1515

iTrader: (17)

Did a log this morning and battery voltage was rock solid 14 until revs went below 800 at idle then it dropped to 13.1.

I don't think I have an issue with the battery or alternator. The battery is new and the alternator is a S5 unit I upgraded too before all this started to occur. I have to additional grounding points from the engine to the chassis but I guess that isn't doing anything. I am going to try it again tonight and see what happens on a full load. If the same thing occurs I will additional grounding points to the ecu's ground wires. Other than that I don't have a clue. I think the injectors just hate me lol. I only have issues when I put those in. Also, I was reading a thread in this section about the o2 sensor messing with the cruise section of the map so my o2 sensor has been disconnected for months now, but drove fine with the 550s.

Thanks for the suggestions.

sharingan 19

iTrader: (16)

Ever get to the bottom of this?

hiroichi1515

iTrader: (17)

Nope... I upgrade to 720/820 and with the rtek fuel correction map zeroed out it runs lean 16 - 17 afrs and smokes at idle. Under boost everything is super rich though... I thought it may have been bad 720cc injectors so I put the 820 in the primary position and it is a bit richer but still lean. I have since tuned the car like that and just run 820/720. The car runs perfectly under boost but cruising is usually 13.4 - 14.8 and it dips down the 15's almost 16's quite as bit but I am used to it now. On light throttle afrs are in the 12's and if I make any adjustments in that area it instantly goes into the 15's and 16's. I just figured it to be an ecu issue and dont bother anymore. As long as the boost areas work perfectly Im ok. Im also not running an o2 sensor due to the closed loop crap that goes on. I also recently came across an issue where the car would idle at 1000 after driving and the stopping or going in on the clutch and then after 30 secs or so it drops down to like 800. I find that kind of weird since I adjusted the stop screw to make it idle at 1000 but its still dropping down for some odd reason... Oh well... I give up lol...

I certainly hope you have you haven't got this issue as well...

Brandon Robinson

iTrader: (3)

I just finished a build with an Rtek 1.8, BNR stage 4, and injector dynamics 725cc primaries and 850cc secondaries. Removed injector and fuel pump resistors, running stock fuel pump and have the same exact, and i mean "exact" issues going on. I am also running a aeromotive FPR. Today I was getting into the 15-16 during cruising situations and remembered that I had a spare vacuum check valve with a section of hose in the floor board. It seemed like when the FPR was seeing vacuum the afr would go lean so i pulled over and installed the check valve on the FPR so that it would only see boost, It helped ALOT cruising afr's went to 12-14 unless i let off a little then back to 15. Also adjusted the TPS to no success on finding the proper setting tonight. I tried running it to 1 volt and ran so lean i had to turn around. Went in the opposite direction to 2.5 volts and the mixture started to look better. I may try running it up to 3 volts tomorrow and wee what happens.

turbo2ltr

iTrader: (1)

Don't chase your tail. If you go through the setup procedure and 1v on the TPS doesnt work, there's probably another issue that's causing. it. Having to grossly misadjust the TPS from what it's supposed to be is just a bandaid to cover up the real problem.

Brandon Robinson

iTrader: (3)

I set the tps today using the fsm procedure and fins myself running dangerously lean during idle/cruise light throttle situation. But the minute i accelerate or the map registers boost everything leans out. I'm kinda lost here. Mind that i am only using a 1.8 and cannot correct anything also using 725 injectors a tad bit larger than the 1.8 is set for. Fuel pressure is spot on and voltage is good.

turbo2ltr

iTrader: (1)

Error codes? Do you still have the OEM o2 sensor connected?
MAP senor properly plumbed?
Temp sensor reading correctly?
Is you MAF in a position other than stock?
Are the injectors high or low impedance and do you have the resistor blocks installed?

Brandon Robinson

iTrader: (3)

Took some fuel pressure readings, they are fluctuating. Installing a Walbro GSS341 and rewiring today in hopes it levels out.

Brandon Robinson

iTrader: (3)

I am running stock O2 to the ecm and wideband just to monitor. MAP plummed alone to lim port. MAF is in stock position. Injectors are high imp, resistor pack removed. Walbro fuel pump aleviated most of the leaning, removed FP resistor. Setting the TPS made a huge difference, finally broke down and cut up a tail light harness and made the lamp assy. Now cruise mixture is better, 13 down to 11 for 15 seconds then it jumps to 14 - 15 untill i bump or release the throttle then it goes back to perfect.

Brandon Robinson

iTrader: (3)

Could it be the 2 speed resistor relay to the fuel pump?

Brandon Robinson

iTrader: (3)

I finally got mine back on the road with th same issues on a/f ratio. When I noticed that if i matched my mechanical boost guage to the stock guage the a/f would go to 11. I think its a bad boost sensor.