The Driver

iTrader: (4)

On my first rotor ~

Pistons I've rebuilt an LT1, V-tec's and what not. To lazy to list em though... I'm not here for interview I'm stating the facts and laws of physics. If you want to count each indivual one of the rotor bearings and the compessor wheels in the turbos too you can go ahead if it makes make you feel better.

Like I said the theory Achems Razr will prevail in high stress situations.

phoenix7

Ignore the "motivational" aspect of it. LOL

This is a 6 cylinder BTW.

Gorilla RE

iTrader: (1)

I know power @ 5k+ is hard for you pushrod guys to handle....but thats when all the fun starts!!!
-J

The Driver

iTrader: (4)

Personally I agree and thats why rotors will always be king. Please throw a V8 against a 20B or even a 26B and watch the outcome.

rotary8

call mister brent rau and ask him how much boost he is running he will enlighten you .

Uncle Hungry

iTrader: (2)

Thanks I understand how it works what I'm saying is that fact is irrelivent if it doesn't inhibit the engine from doing it's job efficiently.

phoenix7

These are ALL REPOSTS but they all apply well to this discussion so, sorry for rehashing the dead:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...8pushrodmullet

Everyone wants the rotary to fail.



I posted Crispeed's quote where brent laughs at their setup cus it pushes 45lbs while he's in the 70's and 80lbs!!! SO the whole argument of "why don't rotaries push the same boost as pistons doesn't really apply.

Uncle Hungry

iTrader: (2)

I know how much boost he runs, what difference does that make?

Well that like me saying " oh yeah well put a 13b againt a v12 or for that matter a v16 and watch the outcome"
These arguements are stupid imo. They are just two completely different designs and I personally believe the only way to compare them is by the absolute highest hp output of the engine regardless of the boost needed to achieve it.

The Driver

iTrader: (4)

Forget it lmao ~ A Mib engine 20B PP Fc is just insanity. I'm sure Scca has that car on their ban list.

phoenix7

really???? I don't know what you're arguing anymore.

Gorilla RE

iTrader: (1)

I love teh rotary but.....You're a little off. Yes, if everything was equal but the fact is it's not. Thats's ok because I enjoy playing "catch-UP" with the "big boys"!
-J

rotary8

well if you have two engines of similar displacement and you run 75+lbs on one and 45+lbs on the other and both run the same time you figure it out.

razorback

everyone says rotary engines have 4 moving parts. yet there are springs, side seals, corner seals, etc etc. it adds up to alot more than the "4" everyone seems to repeat.

everyone says that piston engines have so many moving parts, its bad, etc etc.. which engines are more reliable?

Gorilla RE

iTrader: (1)

Efficiency

phoenix7

lol, yeah, let's try and catch up with 110+ years of R&D with our 40 years of R&D.

While to some it seems unfeasible we can use the whole FWD in racing argument. The automotive industry changed to FWD and the racing bodies had to work their *** off to implement and EFFICIENTLY compete against what was once considered the industry standard. The suspension technology EVOLVED in LEAPS AND BOUNDS in order for this new system to be competitive and here we are today, watching FWD integras and other cars succesfully and competitively race in SCCA.

Who is to say we're not on the same track? Granted the development is much slower considering that MAZDA is the only automaker todays investing in this technology as opposed to the MAJORITY of automakers going to FWD to save $$

Gorilla RE

iTrader: (1)

Don't be such a tool
-J

Uncle Hungry

iTrader: (2)

But you need a larger turbo with the rotary and probably as much fuel as it would take to run the 75psi on the piston motor, it would not be the case given two equal compressors. Keep in mind this is a 4cyl were talking about. I mean I not bashing rotaries I just don't see what some of you guys are saying. I mean even pro fwd guys are knocking on 6's now.

The Driver

iTrader: (4)

Seals move?

Reliability? I think it's more budget ability is the correct term. When the PROPER materials are used such as cermix and the correct port as well as maybe NOT running the worlds most complicated sequential turbo system with over 30 solenoids might help? Oh yeah that was made in 1993 right? I'm not just going to specify the FD though.

The Driver

iTrader: (4)

Nor will it be the same as far as spool time either

When they run the same boost then what?

phoenix7

http://www.engine-builder.com/ar/ar79938.htm



Look at the DNF cars towards the bottom.
http://www.experiencelemans.com/en-us/dept_146.html

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/121020...e-failure.html

^^mind you these are race PREPPED motors and even then it's not so "reliable"

razorback

yes, seals move, they have springs. its whats hold in compression. if they didnt then a stuck apex, side or corner seal woudlnt be an engine killer.

razorback

and what does that prove? do you want me to go take pictures of rotary engines ive pulled apart with internal damage?

Uncle Hungry

iTrader: (2)

you tell me actually I'd be inclined to know exactly what the difference is. I'll go with a 60-1 cause alot of old school honda guys used em as did rx7 guys.A t3 60-1 can make 450 on a 2l honda motor on 13 psi and about 630 on 25 psi. What would the 13b do?

The Driver

iTrader: (4)

I'd call that vibration not forced movement. If thats the case then you might as well consider every bolt and stud to the engine a moving part since they all do have some vibration regardless if it can be seen by the human eye or not.

phoenix7

sure, and also how you caused the damage. I can show you cracked housings from too much boost, destroyed internals from detonating or pre-igniting, I can show you apex seals that have shattered and anihilated the 13B. But those are all builder/ tuning errors. Same as a piston engine.

Basically, the point is:
the R&D for piston engines has been great for the past 100 years. In that time we've pretty much come up with an almost IDIOT proof motor that can take the abuse but the same applies with the rotary, we're just 60 years behind the "big elderly boys"