VTEC or 13B?
10-25-05, 01:52 PM
#3
EliteHardcoreCannuckSquad
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I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt, and assume this is a joke... right?
Becuase no sane person would come onto the RX7Club Forum and ask that question...
Especially in the Rotary Peformance section, where all the engine builders hang out.
Right?
Becuase no sane person would come onto the RX7Club Forum and ask that question...
Especially in the Rotary Peformance section, where all the engine builders hang out.
Right?
10-25-05, 02:49 PM
#4
Engine, Not Motor
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Neither?
That's like asking "what's the best colour?"
Both are two different engines for two different purposes. VTEC allows sane valve timing at low RPM to maintain mileage and torque, while using more aggressive timing up high in the RPM range to deliver more power.
In a sense, the rotary has had VTEC since the 6 port 12A was introduced, and continues to the Renesis today. In 6 port engines produced until the Renesis, the 5th and 6th ports are closed below about 3800 RPM. Above 3800 RPM, they open up, changing port timing to so the ports close much later. This allows more flow at high RPMs.
The Renesis goes even further and keeps the secondaries closed below a certain RPM range (I don't know offhand where), and the 5th and 6th (aux) ports. The secondaries open, then the aux ports higher up in the revs.
Of course, this question may have been a joke in which case I just wasted 42 seconds typing this.
That's like asking "what's the best colour?"
Both are two different engines for two different purposes. VTEC allows sane valve timing at low RPM to maintain mileage and torque, while using more aggressive timing up high in the RPM range to deliver more power.
In a sense, the rotary has had VTEC since the 6 port 12A was introduced, and continues to the Renesis today. In 6 port engines produced until the Renesis, the 5th and 6th ports are closed below about 3800 RPM. Above 3800 RPM, they open up, changing port timing to so the ports close much later. This allows more flow at high RPMs.
The Renesis goes even further and keeps the secondaries closed below a certain RPM range (I don't know offhand where), and the 5th and 6th (aux) ports. The secondaries open, then the aux ports higher up in the revs.
Of course, this question may have been a joke in which case I just wasted 42 seconds typing this.
10-26-05, 12:07 AM
#6
Red Pill Dealer
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Aaron, you could not be more correct. My daily driver is a Prelude. Before you guys flame me, I just want to give the facts! It also has a variable intake, similar to a 6-Port. It's a '98, bought in '99 with 25K. It now has 157K. I dont have a coffee can, no huge wing, looks stock. It has been a great car. Very little maintanance.
I believe a TII will kick its ***. Thats why I own one of them too. But, that doesn't make V-TEC un-cool.
I believe a TII will kick its ***. Thats why I own one of them too. But, that doesn't make V-TEC un-cool.
10-26-05, 09:40 AM
#7
Engine, Not Motor
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My daily driver is an Insight, which has sort of a "reverse VTEC". During normal driving, the cams are switched over to "performance" mode. On the highway, they switch over to "economy mode" as the car enters lean burn.
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10-27-05, 01:17 PM
#9
engineer wanabe
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ok first off the variable intake runners on the b18c5 which is the engine you have has nothing to do with the valves or head. those are to take advantage of the helmholtz effect at both low and high rpm. and i think the post should have been named t2 vs prelude if you want a answer to your questions. but if you are asking which engine is better the 13b or the b18c5 then you are just going to get alot of opinions. o and vtec has nothing to do with being cool or not. its a great engineering design that was first pioneered by honda for power, fuel efficiency, or both that is now used by all major car manufactures in one form or another.
10-27-05, 02:13 PM
#11
lots of car manufacturers use a variable valve timing system, but Toyota's VVT-i system for example is not very similar to VTEC. It doesn't have separate cam profiles, at least as far as I know. Instead I believe it changes the duration of the cam depending on RPM.
10-27-05, 05:08 PM
#13
engineer wanabe
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Originally Posted by carsaregood
just a quick correction...
the b18c5 (type R) doesnt' have a variable length intake manifold, you're thinking of the b18c1 (gsr)
the b18c5 (type R) doesnt' have a variable length intake manifold, you're thinking of the b18c1 (gsr)
10-27-05, 06:01 PM
#14
it depends how radical of a cam you run in the 13B. a rotary with a really long duration cam is unstoppable!! also it helps to grease the brakes on the rx7, and to add some go-fast juice to the little plastic tank next to the cruise control.
pat
pat
10-28-05, 08:15 PM
#20
Red Pill Dealer
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I was just trying to support the idea that they both use smilar tech. 5th & 6th port activation is like the V-TEC jump, and the H-22A4 variable intake is like the VDI. I did not want to start a war. I love both cars! I don't think I should have to hate Hondas because I like and own RX7's also. I know which one is a unique experience and which one will be the best daily mule.
10-28-05, 08:43 PM
#21
no clever remarks...
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Why even consider that swap? WOuld it be going into a honda or a rx-7? Doing rear wheel drive in a Honda will take some work... Unless you have an s2000 already, in which case a rotary swap would be completely bad ***. I always though it would be cool to show up at a rotary event in an s2000 that had a 13b swap in it. That is just me though. My dd is a honda, but I want something RWD that is economical... Like a AE86, or 240SX, something with back seats that gets fairly decent gas mileage and is still fun to drive.
10-28-05, 11:50 PM
#23
Die Motha ****as!
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ARE YOU CRAZY!? I mean like me rephrase that in an understandable language to you...Do you have a piston engine stuck up you A$$? Of course 13BBBBBB T or REW or whatever BBBBBBB owns. End of story! Close this thread.
Over and out....
Over and out....
10-29-05, 02:12 AM
#24
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Originally Posted by DelSlow
13B with VTEC y0!!!
Think about it! It would be unstoppable1!! The mAd powah of the 13B, but with TWO cam lobes!
Think about it! It would be unstoppable1!! The mAd powah of the 13B, but with TWO cam lobes!
Werd up bro.... I really think that if you fused the two together you might get a ........ 13B-TEC ? By the way, a vtec is faster at falling down a bridge because its .5 litre quicker and SUPERMAN will dominate in a duel!!
-1st post-
10-29-05, 02:19 AM
#25
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i have built a few honda's both FI and NA in the last 7 years..havent had the chance to build a rotary engine(yet)
i know a FI B16 is a stout little engine..ive built a one that produce'd 270whp/212tq @ 9psi shift at 8200 with a custom built turbo kit(not a store bought kit), uberdata fuel managment, and *** dyno tuning..all of that on a stock block and head(minus head gasket, block guard, and head studs)...i know a 13b/13BT takes alot more to do the same but rotary engines are alot cheaper to build in my opinion..
im currently running a NA B16 in my 92 civic(for sale in the non-rx-7 related forum)
Vtec (variable valve timing and electronic lift control) is nothing special..its good for 2whp on the dyno if your lucky..most NA (TODA) cars remove Vtec all together because it makes more sense to install highlift cams with less lobes which also weigh less, reduce valvetrain mass, reduce friction, reduce vtec rocker arms and keep you in high cam from idle than it is to sacrifice missing a shift and having the car drop out of high cam and watching the car fall on its face costing you the race.
vtec is best for daily driven street cars..if you wanna make power ditch the useless economy crap
just my .02
i know a FI B16 is a stout little engine..ive built a one that produce'd 270whp/212tq @ 9psi shift at 8200 with a custom built turbo kit(not a store bought kit), uberdata fuel managment, and *** dyno tuning..all of that on a stock block and head(minus head gasket, block guard, and head studs)...i know a 13b/13BT takes alot more to do the same but rotary engines are alot cheaper to build in my opinion..
im currently running a NA B16 in my 92 civic(for sale in the non-rx-7 related forum)
Vtec (variable valve timing and electronic lift control) is nothing special..its good for 2whp on the dyno if your lucky..most NA (TODA) cars remove Vtec all together because it makes more sense to install highlift cams with less lobes which also weigh less, reduce valvetrain mass, reduce friction, reduce vtec rocker arms and keep you in high cam from idle than it is to sacrifice missing a shift and having the car drop out of high cam and watching the car fall on its face costing you the race.
vtec is best for daily driven street cars..if you wanna make power ditch the useless economy crap
just my .02