Falken

This is up on RX8club now. I saw it this morning, they have finally broken 400whp at 16-some PSI.

Now we know it's possible. Don't count us out yet.

Pump gas? Yes.
Injection? Nope

http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.ph...83#post2695583

diabolical1

iTrader: (3)

yeah, i saw it this morning also. it was just a matter of time. i'm not really sure what the skepticism was all about. what? just because it's not as "easy" as days of old?

nevertheless, it's a commendable accomplishment.

BDC

Anyone notice the graph is produced by the same people who sell the kit in the first place? Not to mention it's only showing one piece of data thing. I'm skeptical.

B

BDC

Something else I just noticed: This thing looks like a T3/T4 hybrid. Even if it were a 70mm compressor (which I doubt), I don't think this thing would yield anywhere near that kind of power.

http://www.esmerilracing.com/images/...Turbo_pic.html

B

Falken

I'm not all that surprised - a customer posted a dyno at 366whp a few months ago with this kit, which was the highest we had yet seen just at that.

They upgraded the ignition I believe.

BDC

Is that the same dyno that's posted up on their website?

And yes I saw the upgraded ignition. Those are some skinny, dinky coils on that thing. I'd be surprised if they're all that powerful.

B

AlexG13B

iTrader: (7)

hhmmm.........

AnthonyNYC

iTrader: (3)

I was thinking the same thing. They should take it to an independant shop to get dynoed.

BLUE TII

iTrader: (9)

There is nothing wrong with a T3/T4 hybrid on the Renisis.

It has no overlap it doesn't need the stupidly large exhaust side a peripheral port exhaust rotary does to prevent intake charge dilution.

If a peripheral exhaust port rotary with stock exhaust side and 60-1 compressor can make these numbers at this boost why shouldn't a renisis be able to do it w/ a T3/T4 as well?

Gorilla RE

iTrader: (1)

The builder is from Puerto Rico...... I say congrats

-J

BDC

I'd like to see one that's honestly and truly done that. I've never seen one get anywhere near *close* to 400rwhp; more like ~280.

B

BLUE TII

iTrader: (9)

Yes, most stock hybrids are on near stock low budget applications and don't make much power.

If you do a good single turbo build and simply replace the single turbo with a stock hybrid interesting things happen.

For example, one of Bryan's customes at BNR has the dyno of a ported cosmo motor with many mods that would typically be done on a single turbo conversion and a S4 stock hybrid.

Even with the crummy undivided S4 exhaust manifold and restrictive staggered S4 AR exhaust housing and internal wastegate it made over 400RWHP peaking at 18psi dropping to 15psi boost where peak power was made....

Now, use a S5 manifold/turbo, big external wastegate, more free flowing exhaust and intake and power won't exactly go down....

ChrisRX8PR

Just ran into this thread and wanted to clear up a few things.

The turbo is not a t3/t4 hybrid. It is a T04S/60-1 turbo with a .84A/R on a P trim wheel. It is a T3 flanged T4 housing with a 3" V-Band exhaust, that might have caused the confusion.

Esmeril Racing does not own a dyno, the dyno run was performed at an independent location. The pick up was having problems(not anything new on the RX-8) getting a steady RPM signal and that screwed things up so we had to do it with MPH. The TQ curve was choppy as well so we had to go with the HP curve, max torque was 304. The old 366whp curve has both RPM and TQ to give you an idea of the power band.

The new run was on Pump gas at 16psi on a stock motor. And yes this is as high as I would ever take a renesis on pump and yes it was pushing it(We were running 5 degrees on Leading at 16psi and it was super rich on the top end,9's AFR) the two runs after the first one were both a little lower probably due to heat concentration but where still above 400whp. We just wanted to prove that a stock reni was capable of handling 400whp on pump with the kit before I went all out on the Renesis. To customers we recommend alcohol injection if pushing more than 13psi.

I just got the car running with a new motor that has been dowel-pinned and has our new Apex Seals in it. I also got it running permanently on E-85 and installed a PT71gtq turbo. My goal is to take it to 500whp on street trim(using something you can buy at the pump ). Currently I notice huge lag compared to the other turbo and I am working to optimize it as much as possible.

Thanks for the interest.

Chris

BDC

A full T4! Good to hear. I thought it was a T3/T4 hybrid. The 0.84 A/R is also a good choice for the motor setup.

As far as the lag thing on the PT71GTQ, you could try reducing the size of the hotsize down to a 0.81/0.84 ala the other turbo but alot of that comes from the larger shaft diameter as well as the larger compressor, everything else remaining the same. More mass to accelerate. Good stuff!

B

ChrisRX8PR

Yeah I though of that, right now it has a .96A/R, it seems like it has a crazy top end but spool isn't ideal...I am actually considering changing to a Water to Air intercooler to eliminate the intercooler/piping volume.....this should help with lag, right? The RX-8 has a huge frontal area so I can get a nicely sized radiator in front for this purpose without blocking the stock cooling system.

What do you think.

Chris

BDC

Depending upon the power goals if you want to stay in the low-mid 400's you can get away with using a 0.84 A/R housing. I think upwards of 500 to the wheels and slightly above is the 0.96 A/R territory. Of course, manifold design and whether or not it's possible to keep a tubular, divided setup would make a considerable difference on boost response and threshold. For the Rx-8 I don't know how to achieve this due to its side port exhaust.

I like the W2A IC idea. I used to run one about 9-10 years ago on my Rx-7 here as a converted top-mounted IC. It worked very well and also allowed the shorter intake plumbing as well as didn't block the radiator and oil cooler. That's the #1 reason why I am not a fan of FMIC's.

B

ChrisRX8PR

Here is a pic of what the new manifold used with the PT-71gtq looks like. You're right, there is no way to run a divided manifold, but this is probably as good as it gets when it comes to the Renesis. We'll see how it flairs out...

Chris

BDC

I like it Chris. That's good work. I still wonder however if there's a way to do a divided inlet. The center plate duo-exhaust ports makes it a troublesome feat.

B

ChrisRX8PR

The problem lies in that the engine mount actually goes around the manifold about 1" before the collector joins all the pipes. This manifold barely fits as it is, the car just doesn't have the space the RX-7's have. I also route a 3" downpipe through the same area but above the engine mount instead of through it...its a tight fit. I tried to see if I could make 2 smaller runner coming of the center port with a spliter plate between then to segregate the flow but there is nowhere to route two pipes all the way up to where the turbo flange is, they would have to be 1.5-1.75" pipes at most which would really choke the engine.

We'll try this one out and see where it gets us ...wish me luck

Chris

neit_jnf

iTrader: (17)

Chris no puedes tirarte el invento de cambiar los puntos del motor?? Algo como esto:

http://www.rx8club.com/showpost.php?...10&postcount=6

Creo q Mazsport ya no esta trabajando pero podrias mandar hacer unos custom....



Chris how about changing the engine mounts? Something like this: (link)

I think Mazsport is not working anymore but you could have them custom made...

BDC

Hey Chris, I got a good look at a Renny motor in an 8 chassis. I see what you are talking about. Those stupid aluminum cross members for the motor mounts are ridiculous. The passenger one encloses the exhaust manifold for crying out loud. Makes it near impossible to fit something in there. Also made it difficult to get it off when pulling the engine out the first time, too.

B

ChrisRX8PR

Exactly

Now you can imagine that same space with a 3-runner header/manifold with a 60m wastegate's necessary piping going through the engine mount and a 3" DP snaking around the top of the mount without hitting the OMP or the water hoses and you can truly understand what I am talking about.

Below are some pics of the manifold in the making with the mount installed, not much space left, it actually sits at about 1/8" away from the mount in one spot.

I want to make a larger DP for my test car but I think 3.5 will be pushing it and I don't want problems with the components in that area. Currently I have a 3" DP and the midpipe has a tapered section from the flange that goes from 3.5-4.0" and then its full 4" all the way back so I could potentially make a 3.5" DP if I want to.

We'll just have to see if I can fit it.

Chris

ChrisRX8PR

Hola Neit,

Those mounts make a little bit more space but they don't solve the problem, any mount for the RX-8 will be a "bridge" type mount so you will still have to go through something and around something, I guess we could try our own approach at it though.

Thanks for the suggestion.

Saludos desde el frio :/ (MN)

Chris