Scalliwag

Thanks for the suggestion. It's more an appearance of stepping on toes I am worried about.
If I don't do anything other than install the tube I won't have people second guessing. The last thing I ever want is someone going apeshit and swearing that I duped an exact copy of someone elses work.
It is just too sensitive an issue.
If somebody wants me to do a set they need to make arrangements to get that done elsewhere. I can pull the exhaust sleeves out if they request it to make it a little easier to work without worrying about getting loose metal under the sleeve.
I don't do well with people accusing me of things and it could result in an all out fistfight at a track someday and I'm getting too old for that

peejay

You could just go to Paul Yaw's site and copy the MFR peripheral port housings' timing. I posted a link recently on this thread. No toes would be stepped on since it is information that has already been made public.

Scalliwag

Hmmm. While that timing may not be the most efficient for these pports it would still be better than stock.
I could give someone that option or mark it out for them.
Once I lay out the first one it will be easy. The intake timing is going to be different though.
Here is the link for those interested in seeing what PeeJay is talking about. Thanks PJ! http://personal.riverusers.com/~yawpower/dectech.html
It is at the bottom of the page

Mazda Factory Peripheral Port
IO 86° BTDC
IC 75° ABDC
EO 73° BBDC
EC 65° ATDC

peejay

151 degrees of overlap....

Scalliwag

side exhaust ports would sure be nice

No7Yet

Side exhaust ports (without bridging) = 48 deg...

of dwell!!!

Brandon

Scalliwag

That would rock!

Scalliwag

They got the housings resprayed and I will have to get them tomorrow at lunch. I also order more parts for my finishing machine that officially put me over the 10K mark. I can finish these without the parts but I am hoping to cut my labor time in half. Hint: it involves diamonds and they ain't for my wife!
At least she does not read this thread

peejay

If by "rock" you mean "suck"...

Unless you had a peripheral intake port. That might be interesting. You get the superior chamber fill of the peripheral port (no "dead space" at the rotor housing between the two intake ports, when the side ports begin to open) and low enough overlap that it would idle smoothly and get decent mileage. Oh yeah and the better emissions from the side exhaust port preventing unburned crap from blowing right out.

Scalliwag

Right. I meant using a side exhaust port with this monster pport. 55mm can rake in a lot. But getting it out efficiently is a real challenge.

No7Yet

Well, you know, that's easy enough to do.

Just spin the motor backwards.

Brandon

Scalliwag

My Dad always told me if my brain was in a bird it would fly backwards

Scalliwag

I got the housings back from being resprayed. Hopefully it goes better this time I picked them up Wednesday but I was too busy to take off and work on them and evenings were a mess as well.
But starting this evening they are my main priority.

TommyTheCat

Sorry, I couldn't remember but: what did you finally choose to spray them with?

Scalliwag

The Armacor M which is applied via twin-arc thermal spray. It was chosen over the next closest candidate Armacor C because the C version has properties that make it more corrosion resistant but it did not have as great of bonding strength and as good of a co-efficient of friction, nor was it able to withstand as much heat.
The corrosion resistance is still very good with the M though. They are talking about corrosives like salt water for their comparisons but in our application we will not see corrosion.
So that is easy to see why the choice between the two was pretty easy.
Well I am off to the garage guys.

zyounker

Have you thought of spraying the water passages? i mean most blown rotaries i see are from a broken coolant seal.. which is because people don't change their coolant and the alumnium corrodes..



Just a thought, but it might help alot in long term reliability..


-Zach

Scalliwag

Even if that was affordable it cannot be done at least with a twin arc spray. They are limited to 45 degrees from straight on. Think of it as having to spray paint the part and you cannot flow the paint into a hole.
Pitted water jackets pretty much disgualify a housing from this effort.
There would not be worth risking that much money into.

Scalliwag

Well the spray shop decided to make sure that these were sprayed thick enough. I've been grinding on the first one about 5 hours now Son-of-a-bitch this sucks.
I was pretty sure when I picked them up that they looked a little thick but the wire cost over $20 a lb. so I would not have expected them to go too far over. WRONG! Bastards!!!
The real **** off is not just the time but the wear on the tooling that is upsetting the **** out of me.
My new diamond tooling I ordered takes two weeks to come in but these would have both been done by now.
Of course I would still be pissed about the unneccesary wear though
I will keep you guys posted.

Scalliwag

Well two days into the first housing. The first was about .080 over sprayed. I am talking to the spray shop about it tomorrow and telling them to tell the idiot that sprayed them to get a freak'n clue because this was a nightmare. I wrecked my tooling and I am ripping pissed about it.
I don't know if this guy was trying to be a smartass of if he is really just too incompetent to do them but this was nothing like the test housing and if the first housings were just a little more thicker they would have been fairly easy as well.
So while I wait for my new tooling I am going to finish up on my side housing grinder. ARRGHHH!!! Not the way I wanted this weekend to go.

banzaitoyota

One step forward , two steps back. Sorry to hear about the tooling. Perhaps you should buy an extra set of bits and have the Cryo-Cycled to increase tool life. John

peejay

I don't think cryo-treating DIAMOND would do any good.... it already has a perfect crystalline structure

Scalliwag

My original tooling was carbide and it was treated with a type of TiN process. What I went through over the weekend would have probably been the equivelant of doing 8 sets of housings.
The **** is of hard that it is going to wear the tooling so it is important that the spray shop has their act together.
If this is successful I will probably have to bite the bullet and get the equipment. As I mentioned before the **** is not cheap and requires 3 phase electricity and a big air compressor. So that would mean a small shop. Which means a monthly payment....YIKES!!!! I hope the spray shop can get this down and stay consistant.
Right now I am very bummed about this ****. Don't take that as a sign of giving up though. Not going to happen.

Scalliwag

I talked to the spray shop and we are going to come up with a solution to the problem.
My tooling may be in by early next week. I ordered a diamond disk for side plates and some lapping disks to test with as well.
The side plates may be ready shortly after the rotor housings it looks like.

Scalliwag

Very good news guys. I got the diamond tooling in and it is worth every penny. I was only able to set it up and test a short time. We have NOPI here tomorrow and Sunday and Ken Scheepers, David Sanchez, and other friends are going to be racing out there.
So I am going out there tomorrow but I am working the housings on Sunday.
This may not sound like much but if you read the past few posts you will know why this is a big deal to me.

banzaitoyota

Great NEWS!!!! Keep it coming. I still would HIGHLY recommend Cryo-treating the tooling