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screeching during auto-x, good or bad?

Old 09-08-03, 02:39 AM
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screeching during auto-x, good or bad?

Hi there, looking into auto-xing. Understand the concept of keeping momentum and smoothness but in a stock FD with street tires, screeching during a turn, does it indicate that you're near the limit of the traction or is it actually slower going around the corner than without the tires screeching, assuming not a 4-wheel slide? just curious, bill
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Old 09-08-03, 08:51 AM
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Screeching is honestly a trait of a particular tire and in itself is no indicator of grip. The "feel" of grip is due to the slip angle of the tire. Basically the load through the suspension builds due to the grip of the tire and actually drops very slightly at maximum grip. Once that point is exceeded the tire very quickly begins to slide.

FWIW street tires have deep, less stable tread and therefore do tend to squeal some when they are at maximum grip. They also tend to squeal when the car is spinning in circles

The feel of a tire's grip has nothing to do with the sound, but you can use the sound to go along with the feedback you receive through the steering wheel and chassis to help inform you of what the car is doing.
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Old 09-08-03, 10:04 AM
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Squeal not squall. Hearing the tires squealing as you make transitions is not bad .... and as Damon pointed out, some tires just plain ol' howl when pushed at all. However, the deafening screech from coming in way too hot into a corner ... that's bad. Usually an indication of the tire pushed beyond its limit of adhesion and turning capability.

Grip driving is actually faster, at least in auto-x, when the tires don't make as much noise. Again, keep in mind the street tire type and tread depth factor in quite a bit too.
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Old 09-08-03, 02:38 PM
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Or as an instructor explained it to me, you want to hear them "sing" and not "scream". When they're just starting to make noise is supposed to be optimal for a street tire, but if you hear the screaching like you hear when someone's locked up their tires and about to rear-end somebody...you've gone too far! ;-)
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Old 09-08-03, 06:29 PM
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I agree; my best times in my short autox career have been with my tires singing in every cuve.
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Old 09-08-03, 07:59 PM
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That is such a cool looking front end 88 Looks good!

PaulC
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Old 09-08-03, 11:08 PM
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Thanks for info. My next question is, when you come to a turn you should brake late but should you have all your braking done before you start turning the wheel and have your foot on the throttle when your actually turning? otherwise wouldnt your rear slide out if youre still braking while turning. tia bill
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Old 09-09-03, 02:45 AM
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Originally posted by spikej
Thanks for info. My next question is, when you come to a turn you should brake late but should you have all your braking done before you start turning the wheel and have your foot on the throttle when your actually turning? otherwise wouldnt your rear slide out if youre still braking while turning. tia bill
You are talking about a technique called "trail-braking". You are correct, that as a beginner, you should do all your braking in a straight line and then turn in. However, in my limited track experience so far, I have found that for the really tight low speed auto-x corners, that a little trail-braking helps the car turn in. It can get you into trouble though.... and I don't recommend doing it in faster corners until you are more experienced (advice I'm trying to follow myself).
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Old 09-09-03, 04:06 PM
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An instructor once said "A squealing tire is a happy tire." In my limitied experience braking while turning is bad, and late apexing(turning in too late) is bad. But who knows what'll lead to you turning better times.
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Old 09-09-03, 05:01 PM
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Originally posted by crazysuprakid
An instructor once said "A squealing tire is a happy tire." In my limitied experience braking while turning is bad, and late apexing(turning in too late) is bad. But who knows what'll lead to you turning better times.
Late apexing is actually better for novice track drivers. The reason being that you are much less likely to get into trouble applying power coming out of the turn.
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Old 09-09-03, 07:26 PM
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I have to trail brake pretty hard to get rid of my Integra's large amount of understeer. I hate that car for anything but daily driving. Time for me to finish the FC.

And thanks Paul. Yellow is a righteous color.
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