Herblenny

iTrader: (13)

Lately (past year), I've seem more people I know getting screwed/scammed on this forum..

I been on this forum since the early days and been very lucky with this forum. But recently, there are some VERY shady characters (in my case, Sonix7 aka Jason Evans) getting on the forum and selling cheap parts or providing cheap labors.

So, how can we change the forum so we have less of this kind of issues??

Here are my few suggestions..

1. If you are buying something from some on this forum, first look at their join date. If they just joined, ask for their number so that you could reach them. It takes a minute or two to give them a call. If they are new and has few posts on their back, do a search and read thru... who knows, they might already have bad thread about them.. or acts stupid on the forum already.. if they seem unprofessional, then be careful!

2. Ask for a pic and ask them to send you a pic with a piece of mail with their name and address on the background. If they don't want to do this, then BE VERY careful. Anyone who's selling stuff on this forum will exchange their address and this shouldn't be an issue.. Of course some wonder about their privacy and wouldn't want to do so, in that case, their street address could be crossed out and just their city and zip.. who knows, but make sure the parts exist! I've heard some people ask people to take pics of the part front of the computer screen with Forum on the back ground.. This is to make sure the part exist and not some scammer trying to sell things without actually having the part..

3. Buy it from a Veteran vs. Newb.. I think those who been around the forum for years are less likely to rip you off... I think this is pretty true most cases.. Maybe because we been around and know what it could do to someone or we been thru it ourselves... but your chances of getting ripped off from those who joined early 2000s is LOW!

I also think since the world of rx7club has changed, we need to change the forum.. I know some of the other forums have become more stricted about joining/registration and also controlling who could sell and who can't. I think the time has come to make some changes on this forum. I just hope some of the admins realize this problem and strive to fix it.

Couple of solution I can think of is make sure newbs can't sell until they pass certain time point. This would eliminate few scammers. Next, I've seen iTrade options on other forums. This would give ratings/feedback on individual forum members on their trade they have made. If they recieve a bad feedback, they have an option to battle it or resolve it themselves and potential buyer could read it. I personally think iTrade option could eliminate most of what we see on this Good guy Bad guy section.. But it could be a nightmare for admins to add this function.. who knows.

Well, if you have better suggestions, post here.. And sorry about my rant..

7_rocket

iTrader: (6)

All of your suggestions are good, but sometimes you get scammed regardless. IE.. I bought a pfc from this guy in GA. I had his phone # his bank accounts and such, guess what he moved to another state, changed his banking info and his cell # dont work.

jamespond24

iTrader: (13)

+1

Herblenny

iTrader: (13)

Point is to reduce your chance of getting scammed and ultimately getting the item you have paid for.

In your situation, escrow service might of been the best chance... or COD... who knows.

When I first started to buy big purchase items (usually over $500), I spent that extra $10 buck for UPS COD.. But I also remember buying items on the forum when they would send the parts first and me paying them after seeing the part... or pay half and pay other half later.. I think those days are definitely over as its impossible to trust someone on this forum!! Well, except those I know personally..

Also, beware of people who don't have verified Paypal account.. when someone only wants MO, Cashier's check, or check.. BE CAREFUL!! Or at least send them certified via USPS. Fraud involving USPS is a Bigger crime!

I'm suggesting all this to reduce your chance of getting ripped off.. things will happen regardless but few simple things could help! But just ignoring these simple things I say is stupid.

RotaryResurrection

iTrader: (8)

Most of the problem is cheap *** buyers. I've been selling parts and engines for over 7 years now, most of that on this forum. Somebody posts needing a part, and if I have it, I respond with a price. Then they say "oh god, I could get that cheaper somewhere else" and that's the last I hear about it until I see them post that they got screwed on the deal.

So I tell people...you can buy it cheaper from joe blow on the forum. They may not send your part at all. They may send it but it might be a bad part, or the wrong part. This could be intentional or a result of lack of knowledge. Either way, in buying from a reputed long term forum member you do pay a bit more but you also get piece of mind concerning getting what you paid for.

Rx-7Doctor

iTrader: (13)

Here is a thread that I started awhile back and the feedback on it.
https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=563683

turbodrx7

iTrader: (43)

This is very true.

Atkins Dan

I todaly agree with Kevin on this one.. If you need something get it from a seller that knowes what thay are doing like a Business the Same goes for E-bay..

Here is one way to think of it.. A Business or shop wants the repeat business to stay open, where a indivual may not care if you come back at all. where there are some on this forum that will take care of you from start to finish Like the ones that have been around for some time. Same applyes to E-bay..

Later
Dan

Herblenny

iTrader: (13)

I can't lie, I'm one of those cheap *** buyers Kevin is mentioning (was that your point).

But I also totally agree with him. Buying from a reputable seller on the forum is the key to avoiding any problems in the future. Most of us whos been here for years been on the both side of the fence and know what NOT to do.

By the way, Kevin is a fantastic SELLER, Businessman, and Supporter of my event!

So is Dan Atkins!! Support these guys!

RotaryResurrection

iTrader: (8)

No Phil, in no way was I talking about anyone in particular. Just the way things seem to go, especially for FC owners/buyers.

rx7goomba

Eaxctly....is it really worth all this bullshit of saving a few bucks? Why not support reputable members/vendors that are well known? Chances are the more we buy from them....the cheaper they'll be on their prices and then we all win.

Jodeny

iTrader: (3)

Tip- when you do a reputation search- search for all the info about your seller. Don't just search for his screen name becaus it may have been changed recently. Search his real name. Then his address and whatever else you may have. ...and don't pay by money order or certified check- find the part elsewhere, even if it's more money because peace of mind is imporant.

John

XxMerlinxX

iTrader: (2)

I think a combination of actions would probably be the best solution, two of which you already mentioned. Making a new member wait until a certain number of posts and/or making them wait a certain amount of time would not only cut down on the number of scammers, but cut down on a number of spammers as well I would imagine. I also like the iTrade idea as it's much easier to look-up references through that, than having to search for someone's name and then read through all the posts about them to see if they're legit. The problem with that option is getting it implemented. Nothing against Ryan, but it takes a lot of poking and prodding to get him to change something on the board. But hopefully he'll see that protecting the members, in the long run, protects him as well, so who knows, he may be receptive to the idea. There are also a few ideas that are a bit more out there, such as implementing some sort of one time fee to post in the FS section (something low, like $5 or $10). You could also make a phone number required for selling, with that number having to be verified in some manner by one of the admins or mods.

It's a slippery slope when you start trying to think up ideas about this kind of thing. You don't want to alienate people by forcing them to do something like give you money or their personal info, but if it doesn't take up time/money/privacy in some manner, the scammers and spammers will just keep coming.

rx7roller02

I have a few ideas....as some, like Kevin, can attest, I have put in a boatload of effort over the last few years trying to help people that have been scammed. The biggest complaint I have is this--too many people get screwed over, post a thread about it, and then dont do anything else. No less than three times, I have set up contact with forum members concerning one particular scammer that has burned many people, and asked the buyers to gather proof of the scam. And no one does. The last time I did this, there were nearly a dozen victims, and only one sent me any information about how he got scammed. We're talking a lot of money in some cases, I have seen people get scammed by the same guy for hundreds of dollars, and I found him trying to scam people out of over a thousand in one shot.....but even then, no one does anything but complain.

Maybe its time we actually do something to those who screw people over. It IS still illegal, and something CAN be done about it, but the victim needs to put in the legwork. Let me tell you, I have spent a lot of my time, resources, and even money to help people in here, and it really sucks *** to do all of that, only to see that most victims wont even help themselves. BUT--if we get charges pressed against some of these people, maybe this place will stop looking so inviting to thieves, does that make sense?

Merlin, in regards to something you said, people in this forum have alleged before that someone who is friends with the admins or owners has gotten away with scamming people. honestly, I dont see the need or the chance for success in expecting the owner of this forum to regulate it in such a manner. For one thing, we are seeing more and more good sellers with a long reputation suddenly screw people over....so all the ideas about noobs wont help that. Plus, Ryan has, I am certain, plenty of things to keep him busy without having to play cop for scammers in here. I think it is time that some of the people who post these threads pony up and do something about it. I used to help a lot more people than I have recently, because I got mighty tired of putting in all the legwork to find someone or to coordinate everything, only to have most victims leave me hanging--hey, its their money in question, right? You would think that they really do want it back, but apparently not enough to actually do something about it other than post a thread. Of the people I have worked with, Kevin is one of the VERY few that actually took the steps to get back what was taken from him...in the end, he ended up getting a partial refund from the POS scammer. So did two others. But that was where it stopped--I had a guy from another forum who was robbed of a GRAND by this scammer, and he dropped the ball about getting his money back. That's ridiculous. If we make this place so that it isnt scammer's paradise, the scammers will either get caught or have to look elsewhere.

Sgtblue

iTrader: (16)

Depending on the statutes in a given state, it can be difficult to get jurisdiction on some of these losses. And for any scam involving less than several thousand dollars, your not likely to get the Fed's interest with their interstate jurisdiction. And note that I say "losses" not thefts. Too often you have to prove a state of mind, an extensive pattern of behavior or prior intent NOT to deliver with some goods or services before you can file anything criminal. And if it isn't criminal, it's civil.... and we all know where that would leave the vast majority of us, most the time.

That said, along with Kevin's comments, I'd add that improvement might be as simple as more scrutiny by the mods on the current rules. Lately it seems fashionable for some ignoramus kid to get on here and crap on some guys thread about what he feels is too high of a price Still others post with no prices, and start what amounts to an ebay auction. Though it's not mandated, it seems more and more posts are without pictures too. I'm wondering if basic rules were enforced a little more stringently , maybe the 'tone' or atmosphere would improve. No more idiot-sticks posting auctions, or "feelers". And more threads with firm prices, terms and pictures. Violations being dealt with anywhere on a continuum between deletion of the thread and a quick and permanent ban. My .02.