swap KA24de(t)
08-05-05, 12:22 AM
#26
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chasis dynamics is all i have to say about why dont i just get an s13, i will go into detail later on still workin some things out with the chasis.
the ka is a torquey motor IN THE REALM OF 4 CYL ENGINES..... cannot compare the torque of a 4cyl to a v8 thats just stupid to do, end of story
sr has no torque compared to the ka comparing 2 engines, kat and sr, both turbo same psi the ka will create more hp and torque easily.
i think the saying goes, no replacement for displacement.....simple as that
the ka is a torquey motor IN THE REALM OF 4 CYL ENGINES..... cannot compare the torque of a 4cyl to a v8 thats just stupid to do, end of story
sr has no torque compared to the ka comparing 2 engines, kat and sr, both turbo same psi the ka will create more hp and torque easily.
i think the saying goes, no replacement for displacement.....simple as that
08-05-05, 12:41 AM
#27
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after experiencing all these motors first hand (i've owned 4 s13 240sx's).....if your gonna use a 4 cyl nissan motor u can't beat the sr imho..... its proven, it works, parts are available..... its just a smooth motor. of course this is just my 2 cents...
08-05-05, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by wakeboarder2186
chasis dynamics is all i have to say about why dont i just get an s13, i will go into detail later on still workin some things out with the chasis.
the ka is a torquey motor IN THE REALM OF 4 CYL ENGINES..... cannot compare the torque of a 4cyl to a v8 thats just stupid to do, end of story
sr has no torque compared to the ka comparing 2 engines, kat and sr, both turbo same psi the ka will create more hp and torque easily.
i think the saying goes, no replacement for displacement.....simple as that
the ka is a torquey motor IN THE REALM OF 4 CYL ENGINES..... cannot compare the torque of a 4cyl to a v8 thats just stupid to do, end of story
sr has no torque compared to the ka comparing 2 engines, kat and sr, both turbo same psi the ka will create more hp and torque easily.
i think the saying goes, no replacement for displacement.....simple as that
08-05-05, 12:42 PM
#29
Mechanical Engineering
just buy a 240, its already got the KA in it. and its much easier to drfit. the RX7 is more of a grip kinda car for taking corners fast not sliding around them.
how about being real original and drop a RB in? or why not a Lexus V8 motor? go with somehting thats got more power stock and more displacement stock. and personally the only NA motor thats worth dropping in a 7 is an F20C.
how about being real original and drop a RB in? or why not a Lexus V8 motor? go with somehting thats got more power stock and more displacement stock. and personally the only NA motor thats worth dropping in a 7 is an F20C.
08-05-05, 11:49 PM
#30
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Originally Posted by TheSparo
i must say, you impressed me with your stupidity in your post. Why would you go CA? you do realize those motors are MUCH older than SR motors, in turn you will almost %100 of the time need to rebuild it, then still have quite a bit less tq and hp... and comparing the KA-T and SR @ same psi? wtf is that? of course a high compression motor will make more power at the same psi, hence higher compression. SR was built for boosting, KA was not, so SR has lower compression to allow for higher boost... you think you'd know that..
A - Ca's do not 100 percent of the time need rebuilds. Most JDM motors will have near the same mileage due to the 3 year rule in Japan, where it is not cost effective to keep a car after 3 years. Hence why most engine suppliers say their motors should have around 36k miles.
A big reason why the Sr20 make a TAD more horsepower is due to having the bigger AR t25 turbo, this is why many CA owners go with SR20 t25 turbos and make, and let me say this clearly, ALMOST EXACTLY THE SAME HORSEPOWER.
Not to mention, when you go with the CA motor you will have a grand left over. These motors are iron blocks and can handle 300whp easily with good tuning, but goes for almost every motor. The same goes for KA24DE-t's, they're very strong blocks.
B- As for your lower compression higher boost factor, you're techinically wrong on that.
Compression is not the only limiting factor on adding boost or withstanding boost. It is also based on Volume efficiency and cylinder, and block (bottom end). Freaking magazine racer.
Just because the motor has more compression, does not mean it will make more power. Volume efficiency and Brake specific fuel consumption and displacement come into play.
For the Sr20 versus CA section of my arguement.
- The CA weighs 40 pounds less than the Sr20 and is 80 pounds lighter than the 13b.
- The sr20 has an inferioir head design due to the rockers which during high RPMs causes valve float. The sr was designed during Nissan's financial struggle so cutting corners was inevitable, thus the inferior design. The SR uses a bigger turbo than the CA thus why it produces more hp, and an extra 2 psi than the 8 psi on a stock CA. There's a good reason why the RB series motors are just like the CA's, only with two extra cylinders. One last thing, the CA has been known to handle 500whp on stock internals, just ask the europeans.
SR parts are more expensive.
You do realize redtop sr20's are almost just as old with only a difference of a year between the redtop and the last CA?????
Another reason the CA was discontinued was not because of performance or anything just that NIssan couldn't afford to make them anymore, they were at the verge of bankruptcy.
Last but not least, the world record CA and KA have more horsepower than the world record SR20.
I'll admit I had some help from my brother becuase he is doing a CA swap into a 240sx.
But don't ever try to assume you know more than someone, and try to throw these petty magazine racer comments at anyone else again you dipshit with 4 posts coming on here like you own things. You also might want to read up on engine dynamics, throwing this high boost low compression corrolation. AND STAY AWAY FROM THE ISSUES OF SUPER STREET!!!!
Do you guys smell that? Damn I am on fire
Last edited by Pat McGroin; 08-06-05 at 12:01 AM.
08-06-05, 12:49 AM
#31
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Originally Posted by Pat McGroin
Ok, where should I start....
A - Ca's do not 100 percent of the time need rebuilds. Most JDM motors will have near the same mileage due to the 3 year rule in Japan, where it is not cost effective to keep a car after 3 years. Hence why most engine suppliers say their motors should have around 36k miles.
A big reason why the Sr20 make a TAD more horsepower is due to having the bigger AR t25 turbo, this is why many CA owners go with SR20 t25 turbos and make, and let me say this clearly, ALMOST EXACTLY THE SAME HORSEPOWER.
Not to mention, when you go with the CA motor you will have a grand left over. These motors are iron blocks and can handle 300whp easily with good tuning, but goes for almost every motor. The same goes for KA24DE-t's, they're very strong blocks.
B- As for your lower compression higher boost factor, you're techinically wrong on that.
Compression is not the only limiting factor on adding boost or withstanding boost. It is also based on Volume efficiency and cylinder, and block (bottom end). Freaking magazine racer.
Just because the motor has more compression, does not mean it will make more power. Volume efficiency and Brake specific fuel consumption and displacement come into play.
For the Sr20 versus CA section of my arguement.
- The CA weighs 40 pounds less than the Sr20 and is 80 pounds lighter than the 13b.
- The sr20 has an inferioir head design due to the rockers which during high RPMs causes valve float. The sr was designed during Nissan's financial struggle so cutting corners was inevitable, thus the inferior design. The SR uses a bigger turbo than the CA thus why it produces more hp, and an extra 2 psi than the 8 psi on a stock CA. There's a good reason why the RB series motors are just like the CA's, only with two extra cylinders. One last thing, the CA has been known to handle 500whp on stock internals, just ask the europeans.
SR parts are more expensive.
You do realize redtop sr20's are almost just as old with only a difference of a year between the redtop and the last CA?????
Another reason the CA was discontinued was not because of performance or anything just that NIssan couldn't afford to make them anymore, they were at the verge of bankruptcy.
Last but not least, the world record CA and KA have more horsepower than the world record SR20.
I'll admit I had some help from my brother becuase he is doing a CA swap into a 240sx.
But don't ever try to assume you know more than someone, and try to throw these petty magazine racer comments at anyone else again you dipshit with 4 posts coming on here like you own things. You also might want to read up on engine dynamics, throwing this high boost low compression corrolation. AND STAY AWAY FROM THE ISSUES OF SUPER STREET!!!!
Do you guys smell that? Damn I am on fire
A - Ca's do not 100 percent of the time need rebuilds. Most JDM motors will have near the same mileage due to the 3 year rule in Japan, where it is not cost effective to keep a car after 3 years. Hence why most engine suppliers say their motors should have around 36k miles.
A big reason why the Sr20 make a TAD more horsepower is due to having the bigger AR t25 turbo, this is why many CA owners go with SR20 t25 turbos and make, and let me say this clearly, ALMOST EXACTLY THE SAME HORSEPOWER.
Not to mention, when you go with the CA motor you will have a grand left over. These motors are iron blocks and can handle 300whp easily with good tuning, but goes for almost every motor. The same goes for KA24DE-t's, they're very strong blocks.
B- As for your lower compression higher boost factor, you're techinically wrong on that.
Compression is not the only limiting factor on adding boost or withstanding boost. It is also based on Volume efficiency and cylinder, and block (bottom end). Freaking magazine racer.
Just because the motor has more compression, does not mean it will make more power. Volume efficiency and Brake specific fuel consumption and displacement come into play.
For the Sr20 versus CA section of my arguement.
- The CA weighs 40 pounds less than the Sr20 and is 80 pounds lighter than the 13b.
- The sr20 has an inferioir head design due to the rockers which during high RPMs causes valve float. The sr was designed during Nissan's financial struggle so cutting corners was inevitable, thus the inferior design. The SR uses a bigger turbo than the CA thus why it produces more hp, and an extra 2 psi than the 8 psi on a stock CA. There's a good reason why the RB series motors are just like the CA's, only with two extra cylinders. One last thing, the CA has been known to handle 500whp on stock internals, just ask the europeans.
SR parts are more expensive.
You do realize redtop sr20's are almost just as old with only a difference of a year between the redtop and the last CA?????
Another reason the CA was discontinued was not because of performance or anything just that NIssan couldn't afford to make them anymore, they were at the verge of bankruptcy.
Last but not least, the world record CA and KA have more horsepower than the world record SR20.
I'll admit I had some help from my brother becuase he is doing a CA swap into a 240sx.
But don't ever try to assume you know more than someone, and try to throw these petty magazine racer comments at anyone else again you dipshit with 4 posts coming on here like you own things. You also might want to read up on engine dynamics, throwing this high boost low compression corrolation. AND STAY AWAY FROM THE ISSUES OF SUPER STREET!!!!
Do you guys smell that? Damn I am on fire
-Adam
08-06-05, 01:06 AM
#32
strike up the paean
Originally Posted by Pat McGroin
Last but not least, the world record CA and KA have more horsepower than the world record SR20.
the highest i've heard recently for the ka24 was 633hp and 511tq over at ka-t.org
phat ka-t people made 638 whp and 599 ft lbs
besides that, there is mention of a 700hp ka-t but no documentation
http://www.ka-t.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5200
i'm not knocking on the motor. but i would be surprised if SR's didn't go alot higher simply because alot more companies have given it more support over the years.
08-06-05, 03:24 PM
#34
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Aznpoopy, you're right on the ka-t.org holding the record, but after doing some reading, they still have a lot of room for improvement left. Their air fuel ratio was somewhere in the tens, also they have a lot of retarded timing, no pun intended.
As for the Sr20 record it is at 689whp and for the CA it is at a little over 750whp.
I am sure you give it a little more time and the KA will be at the Sr20's level, give or take a few HP.
I also saw that someone stated the sr20 has better head flow and more revs, sorry the CA takes that title out of the KA and SR20, I really don't know how it goes for the RB motors.
As for the Sr20 record it is at 689whp and for the CA it is at a little over 750whp.
I am sure you give it a little more time and the KA will be at the Sr20's level, give or take a few HP.
I also saw that someone stated the sr20 has better head flow and more revs, sorry the CA takes that title out of the KA and SR20, I really don't know how it goes for the RB motors.
Last edited by Pat McGroin; 08-06-05 at 03:29 PM.
08-06-05, 11:41 PM
#35
strike up the paean
no doubt about it.
the sr has its little bandwagon following right now; it's an overly hyped motor. not a bad motor by any means, but hardly the end all be all motor solution for s chassis cars.
i'm a ka guy myself.
each engine has its own advantages... but for cheap parts and replacement blocks, the ka can't be beat. block of choice for us 'budget' racers.
the sr has its little bandwagon following right now; it's an overly hyped motor. not a bad motor by any means, but hardly the end all be all motor solution for s chassis cars.
i'm a ka guy myself.
each engine has its own advantages... but for cheap parts and replacement blocks, the ka can't be beat. block of choice for us 'budget' racers.
08-07-05, 02:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Pat McGroin
Not to mention, when you go with the CA motor you will have a grand left over. These motors are iron blocks and can handle 300whp easily with good tuning, but goes for almost every motor. The same goes for KA24DE-t's, they're very strong blocks.
Originally Posted by Pat McGroin
Compression is not the only limiting factor on adding boost or withstanding boost. It is also based on Volume efficiency and cylinder, and block (bottom end). Freaking magazine racer.
Just because the motor has more compression, does not mean it will make more power. Volume efficiency and Brake specific fuel consumption and displacement come into play.
Just because the motor has more compression, does not mean it will make more power. Volume efficiency and Brake specific fuel consumption and displacement come into play.
Originally Posted by Pat McGroin
- The sr20 has an inferioir head design due to the rockers which during high RPMs causes valve float. The sr was designed during Nissan's financial struggle so cutting corners was inevitable, thus the inferior design. The SR uses a bigger turbo than the CA thus why it produces more hp, and an extra 2 psi than the 8 psi on a stock CA. There's a good reason why the RB series motors are just like the CA's, only with two extra cylinders. One last thing, the CA has been known to handle 500whp on stock internals, just ask the europeans.
Have you ever seen the SAE paperwork involving the production of the SR engine.
The SR engine was built as a more efficient, more powerful REPLACEMENT for the CA18 engine.
The head has greater flow over the entire powerband, and is well capable of sustaining 8500 RPM in the SE-R Cup Cars with off the shelf parts. The valve angle is substantially shallower and the ports are of a high port design. That is why the rocker arm was adapted on the motor.
An extra 2 PSI ... the **** are you talking about? The SR runs 7 lbs. of boost stock
500whp CA on stock internals? This I'd like to see. I've chatted with at least 50 different 200SX owners in Europe and I've been a member of the SXOC in 3 countries over the past 3 years, and never once have I seen more than 5 CA powered S13's putting out over 500whp period, and they were all built engine cars. The most notable being a completely high-dollar built engine from Norris Designs that makes the same numbers that STOCK bottom end SR's are putting out here. Other people like Big Tone from SXOC.uk have produced excellent power but suffered engine failure. Numerous CA owners overseas have had problems with keeping the bottom end intact, some of them rebuilding motors 2-3 times in a year.
Originally Posted by Pat McGroin
SR parts are more expensive.
Originally Posted by Pat McGroin
You do realize redtop sr20's are almost just as old with only a difference of a year between the redtop and the last CA?????
CA's were in every year of the Euro 200SX... up until 94'
Originally Posted by Pat McGroin
Another reason the CA was discontinued was not because of performance or anything just that NIssan couldn't afford to make them anymore, they were at the verge of bankruptcy.
Is that why Nissan employed the use of a coilpack ignition system, fitted a BOV standard, the same injection setup, etc.
Please you are talking out of your *** about a rumor someone started years ago.
Originally Posted by Pat McGroin
Last but not least, the world record CA and KA have more horsepower than the world record SR20.
Hell JUN has been running 8's with their drag car since 1998 that makes over 700whp.
In the US we've produced SR's making 669whp.
In Sweden they've built SR's with over 650whp as well.
Jickel180, one of the guys in this thread, has nearly 500whp himself. Yet some dumbass made the comment that he "was an embarrasment" LOL.
Originally Posted by Pat McGroin
But don't ever try to assume you know more than someone, and try to throw these petty magazine racer comments at anyone else again you dipshit with 4 posts coming on here like you own things. You also might want to read up on engine dynamics, throwing this high boost low compression corrolation. AND STAY AWAY FROM THE ISSUES OF SUPER STREET!!!!
Do you guys smell that? Damn I am on fire
Do you guys smell that? Damn I am on fire
look who's talkin.
08-07-05, 11:48 AM
#39
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one thing many of you are overlooking.....especially ryan(sr20>all) and jickel and people...
is that it doesnt matter how much power you make...youll still lose to a stock srt4...because everyone knows srt4's are faster than everything....
is that it doesnt matter how much power you make...youll still lose to a stock srt4...because everyone knows srt4's are faster than everything....
08-07-05, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by kriswrx
one thing many of you are overlooking.....especially ryan(sr20>all) and jickel and people...
is that it doesnt matter how much power you make...youll still lose to a stock srt4...because everyone knows srt4's are faster than everything....
is that it doesnt matter how much power you make...youll still lose to a stock srt4...because everyone knows srt4's are faster than everything....
This is Alan, and yes... the SRT4 is the fastestest thing on 4 wheels!
08-07-05, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by sushi bushi
I can already tell SR20DET>All is an idiot, I can already see SO many errors in his post.
08-07-05, 03:47 PM
#45
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wow it has been along time since I have been anywhere near the club. You gotta be kidding me. whatever, peace is back in town, looks like I'm getting another rex here pretty soon. You guys need to do alittle bit more research before you post up stupid engine comparisons, with little knowledge of the internal workings of the engine. stock for stock, there is a big difference in power, but all moderately reliable engines. Mod for mod, they might make similar power, but the more stout components of the sr will keep it together longer. The more you mod an engine the shorter its lifespan will be, but if you start out with a strong engine, and build it up correctly, it will last longer than the weaker engines with comparable power. sr that bitch and get it over with son.
Charles
Charles
08-07-05, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by peacekeeper
wow it has been along time since I have been anywhere near the club. You gotta be kidding me. whatever, peace is back in town, looks like I'm getting another rex here pretty soon. You guys need to do alittle bit more research before you post up stupid engine comparisons, with little knowledge of the internal workings of the engine. stock for stock, there is a big difference in power, but all moderately reliable engines. Mod for mod, they might make similar power, but the more stout components of the sr will keep it together longer. The more you mod an engine the shorter its lifespan will be, but if you start out with a strong engine, and build it up correctly, it will last longer than the weaker engines with comparable power. sr that bitch and get it over with son.
Charles
Charles
Another Rex? Whats up with the FD?
08-07-05, 04:02 PM
#47
strike up the paean
Originally Posted by sr20det>all
Jickel180, one of the guys in this thread, has nearly 500whp himself. Yet some dumbass made the comment that he "was an embarrasment" LOL
500whp car aside, he still made a comment on how the ka was inferior to the turbocharged sr, and made much less hp and tq. i'm sure if posted a similar comment on nico, that would kind of fall under the 'no ****, sherlock' category.
08-07-05, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by SR20DET>All
This is Alan, and yes... the SRT4 is the fastestest thing on 4 wheels!
oh............well whats up then...i thought you were ryan.....obviously.....
and no one listen to peacekeeper....if it doesnt have to do with craigslist he doesnt know it....
08-07-05, 05:07 PM
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Originally Posted by kriswrx
oh............well whats up then...i thought you were ryan.....obviously.....
and no one listen to peacekeeper....if it doesnt have to do with craigslist he doesnt know it....
and no one listen to peacekeeper....if it doesnt have to do with craigslist he doesnt know it....
He has a point!
sr20...My deal with the FD fell through. I might be snagging an FC from some crazy chick. I need another FC, it has been too long since I had one.
08-07-05, 05:53 PM
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Originally Posted by aznpoopy
right.
500whp car aside, he still made a comment on how the ka was inferior to the turbocharged sr, and made much less hp and tq. i'm sure if posted a similar comment on nico, that would kind of fall under the 'no ****, sherlock' category.
500whp car aside, he still made a comment on how the ka was inferior to the turbocharged sr, and made much less hp and tq. i'm sure if posted a similar comment on nico, that would kind of fall under the 'no ****, sherlock' category.
Hey, dumbass:
Originally Posted by jickel180
know you plan on turboing your KA, doing that would make some desired torque..but right off the bat this is going to be a weak N/A motor that will be much slower and make much less torque than an SR.
Originally Posted by jickel180
He chose to decide an NA motor over a factory turboed motor. You think he's talking about a non turbo SR he's looking to swap?
The guy says the SR has no torque,that's his fault for deciding to go with an n/a KA (that makes poop loads less tq than a stock SR) he'll be forced to run for a while (until it's eventually turboed). Now, when turboed and built finally, the KA will make more tq(Read: tq, not hp)than an equally modded SR. That's great for him, i'm sure the boats he's looking to tow, or the lumber he plans to haul will thank him for it.
The guy says the SR has no torque,that's his fault for deciding to go with an n/a KA (that makes poop loads less tq than a stock SR) he'll be forced to run for a while (until it's eventually turboed). Now, when turboed and built finally, the KA will make more tq(Read: tq, not hp)than an equally modded SR. That's great for him, i'm sure the boats he's looking to tow, or the lumber he plans to haul will thank him for it.
Read my posts a little more carefully this time...If his plan goes well, he'll have a turboed KA that will finally be producing some decent torque. Again, it's his fault to put the KA and the already turbocharged SR into the same comparisson category. I can't help the fact that the aznpoopy KA came from the factory N/A. I've made it clear that if it eventually gets turbocharged, it might make some torque. It wasn't stated at the time of my posts if he was going to turbocharge it or not before the motor gets dropped in. This is what I had to work with:
Originally Posted by Bodyshield
looking into swapping the 13b with a ka24de (future T)
Even you make a statement about the N/A KA torque :
Originally Posted by aznpoopy
i really dont consider 155 ft/lbs of torque to be "torquey".
Originally Posted by aznpoopy
you embarass yourself by comparing a n/a ka24de to a sr20det. in fact you embarass 240sx owners everywhere. at least be somewhat intelligent and compare a sr20det to a turbocharged ka24de.
yeah, you did. And about that comment, who the **** are you? Who are you in the 240 community to judge me as an embarassment? I let my car and my work speak for myself, where as you just run your mouth. I find it funny that your ignorant *** comes into this thread making remarks about me such as this. When you're a nobody with a pos s14.