Soaking in Wisdom
06-10-13, 12:10 PM
#1
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Soaking in Wisdom
I've always been a honda a guy and this Rx3 wagon will be my first rotary build so I have a couple of questions...
1) With Hondas you can swap parts between cars and most will fit. Is it possible with these? If so, what are some guidelines?
2) I want to keep the original 12a, what are some key improvements I can make internally to increase reliability. (apex seals, springs etc.)
3) Lastly, I welcome any other bits of advice you would give a newbie.
1) With Hondas you can swap parts between cars and most will fit. Is it possible with these? If so, what are some guidelines?
2) I want to keep the original 12a, what are some key improvements I can make internally to increase reliability. (apex seals, springs etc.)
3) Lastly, I welcome any other bits of advice you would give a newbie.
06-10-13, 03:42 PM
#3
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Welcome to world of rotary. :-)
I am just about to get my first "old school" rotary but have an FD now.
Two of the biggest problems, that I've seen, for the rotaries are heat and carbon. The rotary motor runs considerably hotter than a traditional piston motor. I have a feeling this is LESS of an issue for the old school cars as there is much more space in the engine bay, but it will still produce the same heat (more or less), it just isn't as packed in.
One very large slap in the face going from a Honda to an RX3 is going to be part availability. Honda parts are EVERYWHERE and, like you mentioned, many are interchangable. That 12a is not a B16 so you will need to do some digging to find parts. There are a few good resources on here so do some searching / reading and it should give you a good foundation.
Good luck and enjoy it! To me, nothing compares to the rotary sound!
I am just about to get my first "old school" rotary but have an FD now.
Two of the biggest problems, that I've seen, for the rotaries are heat and carbon. The rotary motor runs considerably hotter than a traditional piston motor. I have a feeling this is LESS of an issue for the old school cars as there is much more space in the engine bay, but it will still produce the same heat (more or less), it just isn't as packed in.
One very large slap in the face going from a Honda to an RX3 is going to be part availability. Honda parts are EVERYWHERE and, like you mentioned, many are interchangable. That 12a is not a B16 so you will need to do some digging to find parts. There are a few good resources on here so do some searching / reading and it should give you a good foundation.
Good luck and enjoy it! To me, nothing compares to the rotary sound!
06-10-13, 11:11 PM
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Best of luck with your parts searches. Parts don't 'interchange', you make them work with research and fabrication. Oh, and it helps to have DEEP pockets. Cook that engine, and you'll be digging in them. As mentioned, you have entered the opposite end of the spectrum in 'I'm a (car make/model) guy' world.
06-10-13, 11:44 PM
#5
well its good to hear you went to mazda , hondas suck ! sa and fb front struts and brakes will work on your car for starters , the twin dizzy motor is alright but if you want to keep a 12 a I would go with a 79 to 85 12a , bigger stock ports , no points and the parts are easier to get .I know its a big jump but a 13b turbo would be a great upgrade . Once you go turbo you wont want to go back , and since its not a POS honda you wont get torque steer , what a concept . Good luck
06-11-13, 05:57 AM
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Thanks for all the great info this far guys. I guess it would be good to give you an idea of where I'd like to go with it. I'd like to keep it as close to factory original as possible with the exception of wheels and height. As far as the engine goes, I'm not really wanting to go "fast" I'm looking for reliability. So any advice in that direction would be great.
06-11-13, 05:57 AM
#7
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well its good to hear you went to mazda , hondas suck ! sa and fb front struts and brakes will work on your car for starters , the twin dizzy motor is alright but if you want to keep a 12 a I would go with a 79 to 85 12a , bigger stock ports , no points and the parts are easier to get .I know its a big jump but a 13b turbo would be a great upgrade . Once you go turbo you wont want to go back , and since its not a POS honda you wont get torque steer , what a concept . Good luck
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06-11-13, 08:51 AM
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Many spring manufacturers (Swift and Eibach come to mind) make such a wide variety of springs you just need to know the ID / OD / height that you need and they will have something that will work.
06-11-13, 11:51 AM
#12
To use Rx7 shock you'll have to swap in the whole strut assembly from a 81-85 model. With Rx-7 strut swap you need to run camber plates to correct the camber as the Rx7 has a different spindle angle when installed in an Rx3. This way you will also get bigger brakes, part availability etc. Or you could get your Rx3 strut tube chopped and welded to be shorter to fit the rx7 tokico shocks.
As far as reliability on you 12A you must keep it cool! The original radiators were border line when in tip top shape, I'd suggest an upgrade. Also oiling, as rotary oil lubes and cools. Always use quality oil and maybe some STP oil treatment. I use STP after an old timer suggested I use it for a dowel pin leak I had and reliability. He said that racers would do a full oil change with only STP on engines with bad oil smoking and in most cases it stopped all oil control ring smoke.
P.s this is not gospel but my experience.
As far as reliability on you 12A you must keep it cool! The original radiators were border line when in tip top shape, I'd suggest an upgrade. Also oiling, as rotary oil lubes and cools. Always use quality oil and maybe some STP oil treatment. I use STP after an old timer suggested I use it for a dowel pin leak I had and reliability. He said that racers would do a full oil change with only STP on engines with bad oil smoking and in most cases it stopped all oil control ring smoke.
P.s this is not gospel but my experience.
06-11-13, 02:51 PM
#13
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I appreciate all of your responses. I really feel like this forum will be my best resource as I do my build.
One other question. In the meantime, what's my quickest/cheapest option to getting the car lower. I'm entirely new to the leaf spring suspension.
One other question. In the meantime, what's my quickest/cheapest option to getting the car lower. I'm entirely new to the leaf spring suspension.
06-12-13, 01:05 AM
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This forum is a great resource, to be sure...Keep a Honda for a 'parts car'- Gotta have something to go get parts in! And to get to and from work.... Talk all the crap you want about a Honda- it'll run longer, with less attention than a rotary car needs. My sig tells THAT story. Paid $1K, and it just keeps going...
06-13-13, 05:39 AM
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Nope. Or should I say, "You're already here".... It's just that there are so few parts available, and they are mostly used, so, as stated, welcome to the world of the unobtanium. Finding your stuff is more work than physically touching the car.
Look, I know I sound like a big bummer, and that is NOT the intent. Just don't want to blow smoke about what you are getting yourself into. You'll get plenty of smoke with the car!
Good luck in your hunt!
Look, I know I sound like a big bummer, and that is NOT the intent. Just don't want to blow smoke about what you are getting yourself into. You'll get plenty of smoke with the car!
Good luck in your hunt!
06-13-13, 11:27 PM
#22
The bottm end is a bolt in affair although you may want to add some roll center spacers between the control arm and lower spindle mount like these https://technotoytuning.com/mazda/fb...-first-gen-rx7
as for the top side of things you have some options...you can run the fb strut tops and redrill the mounting holes or you can use the rx3/glc strut tops with thrust bearings installed in between to allow the strut housing to pivot effectively. If you go coil over which is desireable but expensive you will need to modify the lower spring perch to accomodate but you can now have camber plates which is great because this conversion introduces a fair bit of positive camber and you would want to dial that out ideally. Hope this helps
as for the top side of things you have some options...you can run the fb strut tops and redrill the mounting holes or you can use the rx3/glc strut tops with thrust bearings installed in between to allow the strut housing to pivot effectively. If you go coil over which is desireable but expensive you will need to modify the lower spring perch to accomodate but you can now have camber plates which is great because this conversion introduces a fair bit of positive camber and you would want to dial that out ideally. Hope this helps
06-14-13, 12:06 AM
#23
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Thanks for all the great info this far guys. I guess it would be good to give you an idea of where I'd like to go with it. I'd like to keep it as close to factory original as possible with the exception of wheels and height. As far as the engine goes, I'm not really wanting to go "fast" I'm looking for reliability. So any advice in that direction would be great.
06-14-13, 11:56 AM
#24
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Reliability and keeping it original. If your budget permits I suggest you find an Experienced engine builder with 30-40+ years of experience that started with twin Dizzies and has no problem rebuilding them. If you're building the motor yourself find a old MAZDA engine rebuild book that the Technicians used back in the day and read up.
06-14-13, 12:17 PM
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Half the fun is diving in!
Google (and this site's search function) are your friends. If you're afraid to work on it, you will most certainly screw something up! Either that, or pay through the nose to have someone else work on it.
Google (and this site's search function) are your friends. If you're afraid to work on it, you will most certainly screw something up! Either that, or pay through the nose to have someone else work on it.