Microtech Area is for discussing Microtech systems

LTX-12 Idle map vs Load map

Old 11-01-16, 08:29 AM
  #1  
Rotary Enthusiast
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Portsmouth UK
Posts: 1,101
Received 13 Likes on 13 Posts
LTX-12 Idle map vs Load map

Can anyone post up a good idle map vs load map for a 20B setup please.. I guess 13B one will be similar. Just so I can see the trend for the two where they transition. I have a rich puff as I rev and lift off so guessing it is a transition or maybe overrun thing?

Thank you
Lee
Leeroy_25 is offline  
Old 11-05-16, 10:18 AM
  #2  
Engine, Not Motor
iTrader: (1)
 
Aaron Cake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 29,671
Likes: 0
Received 23 Likes on 22 Posts
If you are getting a rich puff when you lift, check the fuel cut settings. What is the vacuum trip point? Of course the silly Microtech doesn't give you any other adjustment besides that.

Are you running the ECU in matrix mode or carburetor (regular) mode?
Aaron Cake is offline  
Old 11-05-16, 03:52 PM
  #3  
Rotary Enthusiast
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Portsmouth UK
Posts: 1,101
Received 13 Likes on 13 Posts
Hmm.. Might leave that to the tuner.. I have just got it on the basic screens trying to set a decent idle through warm up and was going to look at initial on off throttle. . I presume as soon as you touch the throttle the map is reading from the load map and idle map is ignored until throttle is close again? Just not to sure as free revving is in theory no load?
Do I want it to fuel cut? I am running premix so fuel cut means no rotor lubrication as I think I read before somewhere? I no when it was on the dyno before it was smoking like hell on the overrun so I assume it is something to do with fueling on the overrun is massively rich? No flames surprisingly just a lot of smoke!

Thanks for your input.
Leeroy_25 is offline  
Old 11-14-16, 10:25 AM
  #4  
Engine, Not Motor
iTrader: (1)
 
Aaron Cake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 29,671
Likes: 0
Received 23 Likes on 22 Posts
You absolutely want fuel cut even if you are premixing. Not cutting fuel will actually result in less lubrication as the fuel washes the oil out of the chrome. The chrome is porous so it retains oil. Plenty of oil for a no load situation that happens during fuel cut. Plus not cutting fuel is just tossing money out the tail pipe, polluting unnecessarily, and annoying everyone behind.

When you tap the throttle, the ECU exists the idle map and enters the load map. Then when the TPS falls back to zeroish the idle map is used.

Honestly, I would suggest switching the ECU to Matrix mode before the tune takes place because it will result in a much better tune and is a far more standard way to work vs. the Microtech's ridiculous "carburetor mode" of overlapping fuel and correction tables.
Aaron Cake is offline  
Old 11-14-16, 03:28 PM
  #5  
Rotary Enthusiast
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Portsmouth UK
Posts: 1,101
Received 13 Likes on 13 Posts
Thanks again Aaron, It will get a proper tune again eventually.. Just trying to sot the idle and learn a bit for myself on the way.. Good advice on the fuel cut though.. Is this the Decel setting that I found turned off?

I have another thread going here:
https://www.rx7club.com/microtech-11...alues-1107250/

that has my entire map and setting posted up now!
Please have a look and comment if you can.. If you can advise me a sensible fuel cut setting that would be great.

Thank you
Lee
Leeroy_25 is offline  
Old 11-15-16, 09:44 AM
  #6  
Engine, Not Motor
iTrader: (1)
 
Aaron Cake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 29,671
Likes: 0
Received 23 Likes on 22 Posts
The decel setting will depend on your engine.

You need to find a vacuum point that is crossed during decel but not crossed during regular driving or quick transitions like shifts. Unlike every other ECU, the Microtech provides almost no adjustment. Just a vacuum cut on/off point. So your setting will be a compromise. I'd start with say 22" and go from there. If you find decel being turned on during regular driving or being triggered at idle, then go to 23" and increase as necessary. The opposite if it never comes on during decel.
Aaron Cake is offline  
Old 11-15-16, 03:44 PM
  #7  
Rotary Enthusiast
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Portsmouth UK
Posts: 1,101
Received 13 Likes on 13 Posts
So it will be a highish level of vacuum then. It pulls around 18Hg idle I think and if you give it a little free rev more.. low 20's from memory. so basically get it coming on just before the max vacuum it pulls on a good level of deceleration? I assume if it comes on when you don't want it to it will start jumping around?

Cheers
Leeroy_25 is offline  
Old 11-17-16, 10:29 AM
  #8  
Engine, Not Motor
iTrader: (1)
 
Aaron Cake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 29,671
Likes: 0
Received 23 Likes on 22 Posts
It depends on the vacuum pulled during a decal event. If you idle at 18" and you get low 20" when coming down from rev, then probably you want to start with the setting around 25". Pay attention to how deep the vacuum goes during a decal (engine braking) say in 2nd gear from 5000 RPM to idle.

The Microtech really only has one setting for this while all other ECUs have a much more versatile decal capability (as well as being able to compensate with extra fuel when decal ends because the walls are dry).
Aaron Cake is offline  
Old 11-17-16, 03:52 PM
  #9  
Rotary Enthusiast
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Portsmouth UK
Posts: 1,101
Received 13 Likes on 13 Posts
Thanks for the tip.. I will check it out ans set it a bit high for now so it is at least on! I presume you end up with fuel coming back on higher up the rev deceleration range as you set the value low?
Any tips to get a bit more fuel as you mentioned after decel? ? If you add fuel in the box or two below the idle rpm on the idle table would that work? Not sure if these are normally richer or leaner? I think mine go leaner currently but I have been messing with the idle of course!
Also is it worth making the idle chart follow the trend of the load map for all the off idle values? Or should it actually do something different? I guess if decel is off this is where the engine is fuelling from when you are decelerating which would explain the smoke I got on the dyno before when they lifted off!
Leeroy_25 is offline  
Old 11-18-16, 10:05 AM
  #10  
Engine, Not Motor
iTrader: (1)
 
Aaron Cake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 29,671
Likes: 0
Received 23 Likes on 22 Posts
The Microtech doesn't have any sort of wall wetting or after decal enrichment like other ECUs so the best you can do is tune it slightly rich in that area. Which is where Matrix mode will really, really, really help you. It gets rid of the insane carburetor model the ECU defaults to and instead presents a standard 3D fuel table (injector time over RPM vs. load) that every other ECU in the world uses. Much easier to deal with as it gives you a great visual of how the engine is being fuelled.

I honestly never fart around with the "normal" mode. First thing I do with a Microtech is switch it to matrix.

On the Microtech the decal value is just a vacuum switch. Nothing more. So when the TPS is zero and the vacuum is below the switch point, fuel is cut. When the TPS is not zero or the vacuum is above the switch point, fuel is not cut.
Aaron Cake is offline  
Old 11-18-16, 03:00 PM
  #11  
Rotary Enthusiast
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Portsmouth UK
Posts: 1,101
Received 13 Likes on 13 Posts
Got it thanks.. I am sure my tuner will use matrix mode but I am just a novice looking to learn some basic setup!
On TPS I have a question. I noticed if you adjust the TPS to read 0% manually or with the correction values it will read 0 but the first yellow light on the TPS lights will flicker every now and then but still reading 0%. Is it best to pull the correction down a couple of % to make sure the light does not flicker as long as you get full range as soon as you hit the throttle or is the light flickering no drama and best to have the correction value set as close as you can to getting a value reading in the table?

Thanks
Lee
Leeroy_25 is offline  
Old 11-20-16, 01:50 AM
  #12  
Full Member
iTrader: (1)
 
wcr2k11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: miami
Posts: 164
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Originally Posted by Aaron Cake View Post
The Microtech doesn't have any sort of wall wetting or after decal enrichment like other ECUs so the best you can do is tune it slightly rich in that area. Which is where Matrix mode will really, really, really help you. It gets rid of the insane carburetor model the ECU defaults to and instead presents a standard 3D fuel table (injector time over RPM vs. load) that every other ECU in the world uses. Much easier to deal with as it gives you a great visual of how the engine is being fuelled.

I honestly never fart around with the "normal" mode. First thing I do with a Microtech is switch it to matrix.

On the Microtech the decal value is just a vacuum switch. Nothing more. So when the TPS is zero and the vacuum is below the switch point, fuel is cut. When the TPS is not zero or the vacuum is above the switch point, fuel is not cut.
Sorry to stick in but. Will the ltx12 works for e85?
wcr2k11 is offline  
Old 11-20-16, 10:33 AM
  #13  
Engine, Not Motor
iTrader: (1)
 
Aaron Cake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 29,671
Likes: 0
Received 23 Likes on 22 Posts
Originally Posted by Leeroy_25 View Post
Got it thanks.. I am sure my tuner will use matrix mode but I am just a novice looking to learn some basic setup!
On TPS I have a question. I noticed if you adjust the TPS to read 0% manually or with the correction values it will read 0 but the first yellow light on the TPS lights will flicker every now and then but still reading 0%. Is it best to pull the correction down a couple of % to make sure the light does not flicker as long as you get full range as soon as you hit the throttle or is the light flickering no drama and best to have the correction value set as close as you can to getting a value reading in the table?

Thanks
Lee
Matrix is far easier to tune and more straightforward in my opinion than the carburetor mode of multiple curves. Basically matrix mode is what it is, a table of injector times. You know exactly where the injector open time is coming from as you can see it on the table. Plus it offers you a much finer tuning capability. The resolution still sucks though. Where every other ECU allows you to configure your X and Y axis, the Microtech only has a vacuum load point every 5" and a boost point every 2 PSI. Insane.

When calibrating the TPS, you need to adjust the Microtech until you get the asterisk between the TPS percent. Asterisk means "true zero". By default the Microtech only uses the TPS to determine when the engine is at idle or not, or to activate flood clear on cranking.
Aaron Cake is offline  
Old 11-20-16, 03:48 PM
  #14  
Rotary Enthusiast
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Portsmouth UK
Posts: 1,101
Received 13 Likes on 13 Posts
Are you saying an asterisk should appear in the TPS percent box instead of 0? I have taken the compensation down a few clicks after it hit zero in the box and no asterisk comes? Sure the instructions just say adjust until it says zero on mine? Maybe MT version is different. I can double check next time I power it up though.
Thanks
Lee
Leeroy_25 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

© 2019 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands

We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
 
  • Ask a Question
    Get answers from community experts
Question Title:
Description:
Your question will be posted in: