H22a/13bt

HAHAHAHA!!!! 250-270 BUILT! AKA Aftermarket straight racing parts...BUILT! I've been out knowing more about the potential of Honda motors than you do apparently!

the question is have YOU been under the rock? On OEM/JDM (non-aftermarket) PARTS, the Civic Si as well as other K-powered Hondas have hit 220-245whp! Give me a break!

25 REAL whp off a Hondata intake manifold gasket, catback exhaust (WITH CAT) and a cold air intake! And that's real and for those of you who think a test pipe gets you up to 240+whp on a STOCK S2000....snap snap get to those books guys..lol Oh and wouldn't that mean that you "built S2K" only gains 30hp after that? Wow badass right? haha

300WHP NA on 91 octane pump gas, theres another K20 that once again outdoes your precious F-series. HONDATUNING=read MAY 2006 issue. I don't hate S2000's and I don't hate F-series, I just hate you guys who think your S2000's are the best thing eveeeer maaaan, and how you think you know everything, and think that there is no Honda motor that can touch the F20 and F22! It's laughable. Trivia... What motor is the qoute below referring too? haha

"Most DC5's, direct competition, make similar power numbers using similar displacement, none of which are naturally aspirated."

THANK YOU!

-Sept 2006 issue. HondaTuning (page 70-74)
if you want to be a *** and call "b.s."

OH and to your comment:
"maybe you should do a little more research."

Here's my reply,
Maybe you should do ALOT more research about what research means!

Let me correct you once again, 800hp S2000?
good, what 1/4 does it run?

AND ladies and gentlemen, what is the worlds fastest N/A import in the world? And what did it beat....Jesus Padilla's BUILT N/A 20B! Show me an all motor S2K that runs as fast as this car. HA **** why not find me a turboed S2K (sarcasm im sure there out there)

H22a/13bt

WHAT! Dude I said it handled better already, you don't need to break one factor of the car down into a million pieces and go into that much detail just to make it seem like many more reasons its better! By the way you're wrong about the Si's suspension, the FRONT is fully independent control link Macpherson strut, the rear is FULLY independent compact double wishbone suspension with coil spring and stabilizer bar.....So that makes up for the laggy handling you think the Si has (even though it doesn't have any) Still want to say it handles FAR WORSE, not so much. If the S2000 was SOOOO badass, then why does my friends 2001 Prelude beat them when all he has is I/H/E and MSD???? That's it, He's beaten more than one and they were average to excellent drivers so don't cry. Hell my old 1992 Si VTEC Prelude killed them! even when they had full exhaust, chip and other mods. I was gutted, Falkens 14 lb'ers, full 2.5 with TP, F22a Accord trans....

And how the Si is nowhere near as fast, sorry but stock for stock I'de say a half a second difference MAX, isn't thaaat much faster, **** all the Si will need is once again, a full exhaust and CAI to be EVEN if not beating it...seen a new Si with those 2 mods run a flat 14.0-14.2. So don't act like its way faster, it's a sports car against a grocery getter right???

You asked me to provide you with facts, well there they are especially in my post directly above.

And another fact is you're wrong about responding better to mods. READ!!!!!!!! which I also have something to say about: So you were saying that,

"Better bolt-ons have since been developed that actually provide real gains."

ooooh so you guys with your S2K's have been dumb enough to be buying "performance" mods that provide......fake....gains? phfff

K20 > F20+F22


Stock for stock I know the S2000 is a better performance machine i already ******* said that, but don't hate on the "grocery getter" that is supposedly RIGHT behind you with devilish potential NA. then again who in here buys a car like that and doesn't want to do **** to it!

you can't change my mind. The Si is better in my opinion if i were spending 19-20k

6-speed LSD
K20Z
more comfortable and attractive interior
Navigation, sexy gauges
14.8 1/4 stock
better MPG
more trunk space lol
you can fit twice as many people in it
better motor...hands down

And about my old Si (1990 ED7)
My old *** civic had STOCK internals on a JDM B16A, just had boltons, Accord 280cc injectors, Accord F22A fuel pump, a fully built suspension and brakes, and weighed 2000 lbs, of course I'm going to take S2000's down are you stupid that thing was agile as ****. I ran it in the 1/8th at 9.4@76mph with NOT alot of mods actually. That's a low 14....it was quick in drag. Spent $5,500 TOTAL on thing including price of the car, was better road car than S2000's (mildly modded ones too), worth it to me.

Go ahead and argue with me, you'll just look stupid...these are facts because you asked for them. call that BS all you want

lostllama

does anyone know where i can find the rx7club forum..... cause all i see is honda **** lol. get a life stop fighting on the internet so i say you guys and start talking about sevens.

adrock3217

Dude. To the guy who posted above...omfg.

Saying the K20 is better then the F20 is like saying A $10 bill is better than a $20 bill. It's just plain stupid...


Let me make it an opinion, and then a comparison point of view.

Opinion: The F20 is AMAZING. Not to mention, the sound of that thing is freakin' rediculous. I'd pay tons of cash to make my rotary sound like an F20...its sex.

Comparison: If the K20 was soooo superior to the F20, why didn't Amuse swap it into their all-carbon S2K? Because its no gooooood

BlkS5TII

Apparently all the S2k's making 230whp with I/H/E and a tune are all just forging their dyno sheets. The '06 S2k, which is what should be compared to the '06 Civic, is almost a completely different car, but I'm sure you knew that also. The '06's are making quite a bit more power. Oh wait, those are fake gains as well even though I posted a link to the dyno sheet.

AEM V2 intake, 70mm header back, and a VAFC are all you need for 230whp on a MUSTANG dyno.

You keep comparing modded cars to stock cars. No **** it's going to be faster modded v. stock, and even then it's only going to be that way in a straight line, which you said you cared nothing about. Right...

6-speed LSD - No different
K20Z- That's a good thing?
more comfortable and attractive interior- Your opinion
Navigation, sexy gauges- Too dumb to find your own way? Again, opinion
14.8 1/4 stock- Then I suppose I can pull out the freak stock S2k time of 13.7
better MPG- S2k's hit 30mpg when staying out of it, but what do I care, I bought a sports car.
more trunk space lol- Because when I went looking for a sports car I wanted trunk space.
you can fit twice as many people in it- Because when I went looking for a sports car I wanted a back seat.
better motor...hands down- When comparing modded to stock.

I was in the market for $20k and that's how much I payed for an '01 S2k with 30k miles.

I already congratulated you on your modded Civic being faster, what more do you want? A pat on the back? I built my FC TII for $5500 and I'm sure it whoops the **** out of your Civic, but what does price have anything to do with it? Just remember you get what you pay for.

BlkS5TII

I'd say it's more like having $15 then adding $5 and saying it's better than having a $20 bill because you only started with $15. See how that makes sense?

aznpoopy

actually i think the s2000 looks like ***.

so what you're telling me is honda put out a 20k souped up eocnobox that can hang with its 30k+ flagship, and has cheaper parts and wider aftermarket.

this is helping me love honda more.

btw, i am a civic owner. i am not a civic hater, nor do i enjoy hyping up the s2000.

H22a/13bt

HAHA what? 2 words my friend= BELL HOUSING!

It's a ******* RWD you idiot. That't like me saying well if the F20 was so great why aren't all the hatches rockin them? Dude get a clue, yes it's a great motor, but K is the best motor to datein the majority of Honda fans and pro's opinion...and just watch the K23 Turbo....o boy, wait till civic boys get their hands on that stock build. hahaha

nooo good my ***, get the **** out

H22a/13bt

oh and when i siad better motor....i DID mean stock for stock.
And the civic (CRX HF) I'm workin on right now is N/A...and fresh off the startup I will ruin your FC.....
there will be NO S2000 running 13.7 stock nor 240+whp off a TP....sorry

BlkS5TII

Keep telling yourself that. It's obvious that you only care to ignore the truth in order to maintain what you wish to believe.

That first sentence just completes the image of stupidity that you worked so hard to build. Congratulations, you win.

10thAEWHiteHeat

iTrader: (4)

So ur saying that a CAI and a Cat-back drop an 06 civic's quarter time by .8 of a second??? You wish buddy. You are fighting a losing battle with this civic vs. s2000 thing. Altough u make valid points, the s2000 is still an s2000 at the end of the day which will always be better than a civic. If you dont think so then write a letter to the head reps of honda and tell them to change the civic's name to s2000. And btw i also have a 13bt and H22a and i personally think the H series is better all motor than both the K and F but thats besides the point.

BlkS5TII

I had a 5th gen Prelude a long time ago, and I don't understand what you're saying about the H series. It was fun and all, but really. I still frequent a Prelude forum, and the saying goes that an H22 with bolt-ons is no better than a stock H22.

MARTIN

I spent $300 and Im sure my civic will out run that TII if you are on stock turbo... If not, thats what my vert is for... I dont see why you people gotta hate.. S2k+si are both good cars, different styles, different league.. The s2k comes with more power+rwd, something a bit more desireable. But $10k more for 40hp, its not worth it... (performance wise)...

MARTIN

bottom line, K>b+H.. F is basically same head and Im sure block is almost Identical

H22a/13bt

HAHAH ur a ******* joke, just because the F has more HP stock doesn't mean its a better motor. you're shallow and know nothing, congratulations on your attempt but yes, i do win. Just realize that you are just another ignorant S2K owner who thinks his **** is badder than every other Honda.

H22a/13bt

umm no... I said on full exhaust, and a CAI, which means race header (no cat or TP) and a 7-8whp Cold air...yes, HAVE dropped the Si down to low 14's and a 14 flat (w/Azenis' but still) Stock dynoes have shown 180whp, while with those mods can bring those numbers up to 200whp, so low/flat 14's is nooot to hard to believe especially with that 6spd LSD trans its got, same exact trans as the Honda Integra R of course

and yes the S2000 IS a sports car and stock for stock WILL outperform the Si. I know this. But like I said, that little Civic is following awful close behind that RWD sports car and hey, it's a Civic! And a stock civic that runs 14's is pretty cool to see for once haha.

Oh and about that Nav, shutup man you know you get lost at times, maybe in a place YOU AREN'T FAMILIAR WITH! Or decide to do road trips of some sort. Hell I do, I could use NAV haha

BlkS5TII

It costs more because it is in a different league, as you said. S2k's are limited run hand built sports cars, and Civic Si's are an economy car with a little more power. The S2k's stock handling alone places it above cars that cost 3 times as much or more. I did the whole decently quick economy car thing, and I realized no matter what you do to it you still don't have a sports car.

I had a 190whp 2400lb Celica GTS with a Kaaz LSD. Better than an Si, and still
doesn't meet my standards. Seeing as you have an RX7 I'm sure you know the differences first hand.

H22a:

No, there is one Honda better than an S2k, but it costs $90k new. You're calling me the ignorant fanboy? I'm not the one trying to say that a 180whp 2900lb FF is better than a 200whp 2700lb FR.

"I refuse to get into a battle of wits with an unarmed man." I will leave you to rant on your own now. The one that resorts to childish name calling is the one that has run out of ideas. You have already discredited yourself, so I have no reason to continue.

H22a/13bt

yes, you are ignorant, second I know the S2K is sportier, for the 5th time yes actually read my posts you dumbass!
you contradict yourself way to much, which takes away my belief that you actually know ANYTHING about your own car. You have no reason to continue....

because you are continuesly WRONG!...makes sense to me.

MARTIN

So does the civic... Look @ the slalom and look @ how it compares to pure "SPORT CARS"... Yes, the s2k handles better stock and are faster stock... Im sure we can all agree on that(04-06) models.. But take the price difference, and the civic will handle better and be all around faster than an s2k... The only reason to get it would be if you HAVE to buy a RWD honda..

You just chose the wrong car...

Thats because 190whp is nothing... Add another 100 to that n/a and you have one mean track car, ADD even more with FI and you have a sick street/strip car that can easily compete with "SPORTS CARS"...

And the nsx is garbage, I can think of a shitload of cars that I would get instead of that...

BlkS5TII

I don't say it's sportier. I'm only pointing out that it is a true sports car built for performance use. Look up the difference. I fail to see where I contradict myself. I also don't see where I am wrong. I presented facts, and you tooted on about how it's "better," which is all just your worthless opinion since you failed to provide any factual evidence. Should I start calling you the dumbass to get my point across? No, that would just make me seem like the childish one that has run out of real things to say.

What's with this price difference b.s. now? Yoiu're starting to sound like SRT4 owners. You pay for what you get. I still give the S2k plenty of credit even though my much faster Evo IX costs around the same new.

Do you even know the differences between the model years of S2k's? '06's are very different from earlier versions, and the '04-'05 is nearly identical in performance to the '00-'03. The AP2's have about 5 more whp and a softened up suspension to fix the snap oversteer "issue."

Right, and the Civic has how much to the wheels stock? I can add any amount of hp to any p.o.s., but that does not make it "better." Besides, that's just theoretical b.s. Does your Civic have 300whp n/a? I'd like to see you try, but then you wouldn't have a very streetable car. There are full out purpose built S2k's that have 300whp n/a, but since when do track cars count for anything when comparing one car to another? How about we stick to the equal mods idea. A fully built S2k v. an equally built Civic Si, who would win? Here's a hint: drivetrain, weight, and suspension geometry. JDM tuners are using which car to set n/a I4 time attack records?

And this just reaffirms everything that I already thought about you.

I wouldn't suppose that a $90k car that outperforms $100k+ cars would be appealing to either of you, despite that you both talk about "performance values."
Here's a thought: The NSX has 280bhp about as much as an R34 Skyline does. In case you hadn't seen it spanking Ferraris and Lambos, it's a bit faster than you realize.

I can't believe I let myself keep getting pulled in by you two. Everyone else can see your ignorance from what is already posted, so I have no reason to continue.

BlkS5TII

Here's something off of Autobacsusa.com about the Tokyo Auto Salon:
"Their main attraction was the ASM Honda S2000 Tsukuba Special, which is the first naturally aspirated vehicle to break one minute at the famous HyperRev Tsukuba Circuit Time Attack battle"

Do you think they somehow got a K-series to fit in there?

MARTIN

The price difference plays a big roll... IMHO the s2k is nice, but I rather buy something else..



Anywhere from 180-190 STOCK... Add full bolt-ons and you are talking about 200whp but the most gains are in the midrange...

Well its not just any POS, its a good base to start with.. 200hp,lsd, and great handling is more than your average POS...

300whp requires a bottom end build up, no doubt... But 245 is easily done with cams and kpro... Even the built engines are extrememly driveable... so w.e.

Damn only 300whp out of F?

**** that... it just so happens they chose that platform, but it doesnt mean ****... Its like Saying a v8 is better because they use that on dragsters... Its been proven you can get the same power out of a 4 cyl... It all depends on what the guy with the money decides to do...


outperforms what? I remember when they did that supercar **** in one of the mags or show, the nsx lost to ferrari and porsche turbo.. So WTF is that?.. Ill see if I could bring out the damn article..

Last time I checked, the r34 puts down more than 280.. Jap hp is capped, they just underrated it.. And besides, the beauty of turbo cars is the fact that more power can be generated by turning a **** or pressing a button....

You can say w.e. you want.. But your points dont show much inteligence... So if you are calling me ignorant, then your name must be POT... W.e. I think Im done... This is a waste of time.. fg2>s2k....

BlkS5TII

Only 300hp? That's about the same as you two are bragging about. If the K is SOOO much better then why isn't it getting SOOO much better power when modded? Besides, I was underrating it. They actually make around 315 which is not much better.

There's no replacement for displacement. V8's are the best choice for high hp applications, and apparently S2k's are the better JDM choice for getting the best track times from an n/a I4. It's no coincidence that they choose to use it.

Don't tell me you actually believe small displacement engines have the same potential as larger displacement ones also...

I recalll seeing an NSX beat out several super cars until it overheated just before the finish line. Check it out from BMI.

Uh, dur. That's what I was telling you. The NSX is underrated, or else it wouldn't be able to hang with other 300+ hp cars in the straights as I have seen it do. My guess would be 300-320whp from the NSX-R seeing as it completely spanked an M3 CSL in acceleration.

Tell yourself whatever you want. All the great n/a I4 time attack cars are S2k's, but only because those tuners were too stupid to use Civics.
Oh, and let's not forget the touge champions.

H22a/13bt

WOW! I actually provided you with plenty of evidence, it's all right in front of you. Not going to say it again. Don't act like you are so much better than me dude cmon

H22a/13bt

HAHA Thank you.

He says eveyone see's our ignorance, while he is the ONLY person posting and boasting and trying to proove the point he will never have. And dude how many cars do you have? An S2000, and Evo damn man. Hey I suggest if you can afford all these cars, go out and buy the Si

And to your post if they K ius so much better than why isn't it getting sooo much more power when modded, see that's the issue here, it IS!!!!

Did you totally blow off S2's K drag car....9.74 @139mph i believe the ETA was.
I'm not giving you the specs again. It makes way better power gains off modifications than the F. IT IS A FACT! So accept it, stop posting and you won't get corrected all the time. It's that easy.

You get MORE for your money with the Si, PERFORMANCE AND FEATURES, it's an all around BETTER CAR! Speaking of which which car made C&D car of the year? I didn't see your little S2K up there did I? So stop.....now