rcracer_tx

iTrader: (1)

No, that was going to be my build until I did the research and pieced together what I needed myself and realized that I could upgrade a lot more and have the work done by someone that is one of the best in the industry for less money. LOL at people chasing big numbers as the OP is shooting for 600+whp... People who haven't pushed that envelope can't build something like that without experience in doing so. At that level it is alot of trial and error to be able to know what all works for those type of cars.

Once again, I said their drag car is very fast, but not many customer cars are making big power. I'll be able to push low tens (maybe high 9's if I was a better driver with a better diff/chomoly axles and ET drags. The OP stated that he wanted at least 600whp, and I think even Ari would agree that he's not the shop to push those kind of numbers on the street as he explains in his post.

I'm not questioning his builds reliability. I have seen the work that rx7store does and it is done right, just not high power or pushing the envelope in what is possible to do with the technology that available today. One of their old gt40r builds was one of my original inspirations for getting into rx7's. Alot changes over from over a decade ago, but it seems that their builds have stayed the same. (which is good as its been tried and proven setups for those looking for a moderately fast rx7, but not for the op's desire for 600+ whp)
Yes, this OP is looking for 600+whp, therefore your shop--as good as it is for mild builds-- is not the correct choice here as you say with the 700hp build. No regular pump gas either, E85 (and I gues E70 in the winter when the companies switch their mixtures)

You want my advice for the actual engine build, BDC makes good half bridge engines as they do A LOT of them. I have seen his personal car and its not done to the level of rotary performance in the wiring and other small items department but runs really well. Customer cars seem to be done really well at his shop, and his personal car was still in progress when I saw it though so it was probably just not completed. Another piece of advice is going to an independent builder. I'm sure there is a good one in Houston, but I've never needed to look. If you are going to bring the car down to Dallas, one of the best is George M. (Ari, I know you have seen/heard of his work back from when he was working with Steve Kahn)

Ari, I know this is a bit OT, but why do you not like water/meth? If you are not interested in posting in this thread if you would just pm me or post a new thread it would be appreciated. I think a debate between you and Howard Coleman could bring a lot of good perspective to the debate as I have yet to see any downfalls beside people trying to tune for it instead of using it as a safety margin and then it failing and blowing an engine because they didn't have a fail-safe that went to the ecu.


And here's the headlights for $51 shipped (I hadn't checked since I bought mine 6 months ago and they went up $10 in that time. Another members car I have seen in person has the lights from your store and they are identical, not similar. Here is a link if you would like to get a pair and ask the seller to become your wholesaler if you want to lower your cost. http://www.ebay.com/itm/93-95-Mazda-...4bc7e1&vxp=mtr

sk8world

iTrader: (5)

I miss Mark! We spent a good bit of time discussing our builds and such. We went to Rotary revolution or what ever it was called back in 04 05. Super guy!

Ok back on subject.

To the OP.. Just get Ari to build you a motor. Look at the guys giving you advice and how long we have been on here.. We know a thing or 2...

Also be careful who you take advice from. This forum is full of both... good and bad. This thread is mostly bad.

djseven

iTrader: (56)

Not an attack on BDC, but has his car stayed together for more than a few runs over the last half decade?

Also, we could start a whole other argument on his half bridges and if there is any real advantage over a much better idleing street port. Another time, another place.

While I obviously dont agree with 3mm seals, its hard to argue the reputation of Rotary Performance. I dont have a close personal relationship with Rotary Performance but I know a lot of other rotary shop owners speak highly of them and Ari has given out a lot of great advice to a lot of the drag guys over the years.

I like to support the guys who have been doing it a long time and not have a mile long list of unhappy customers over the years, in the rotary world, there just arent many of those businesses left.

rcracer_tx

iTrader: (1)

I agree that they make great mild builds for the street which is what most people are looking for when they upgrade, but it doesn't fit this persons goals of 600+whp. you are going to lose some streetability and have a significant amount of lag over small turbo cars, but its a price that has to be paid in order to make that level of power on a 2 rotor. Stock ports can make 600+whp, but with what powerband? Having the extra breathing room up top that the half-bridge gives is not always better for the street, but to stay in the boost range of a larger turbo car is nice especially for racing.

I will agree that bridging is not the best solution for many peoples street cars, but its all about what powerband you want. For example I went with a half bridge on a t04r so that I can have a car that spools quickly on the street while being a good balance to still be competitive on the track. but as you said, hats another discussion entirely.

OP, what turbo setup are you interested in? also, where is the car coming from in terms of mods (stock, bpu, small single, etc)? are you looking for 600whp on pump gas, pump+ wate/meth, e85, or race gas? It's a big difference in the setup needed between those fuels...

rotorholic

iTrader: (53)

Yeah, keep us posted on the 9 second run

sk8world

iTrader: (5)

I posted the same thing, then realized this thread just needs to die.

[QUOTE=rcracer_tx;11028248]I agree that they make great mild builds for the street which is what most people are looking for when they upgrade, but it doesn't fit this persons goals of 600+whp. you are going to lose some streetability and have a significant amount of lag over small turbo cars, but its a price that has to be paid in order to make that level of power on a 2 rotor. Stock ports can make 600+whp, but with what powerband? Having the extra breathing room up top that the half-bridge gives is not always better for the street, but to stay in the boost range of a larger turbo car is nice especially for racing.[ QUOTE]



ok.. before this thread dies. I was thinking how funny it is that all the drag racers (that have been around) accross the country speak with Ari regularly, most looking for advise or to discuss how to go quicker wheather it be chassis ideas or additional power, tranny options, nitrous, etc... Most of these guys are making north of 600, 700 even 800rwhp.

You realize Rotary Performance was running mid 9's back in 2001 and making 645rwhp? 11 years ago?

How much power you think Ari had to make to go 9.1 at 151mph? 700? 800?

Trust me, he can build a 600hp car. Question is if he cares to build warranty one. Is that a smart business move?

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

so the reality is you're butthurt over price and the fact that he wouldn't warranty a build for a 700whp street driven pump gas fuelled car? find me a shop who would.


as far as the 3mm seal argument, each builder has their own preferences. most builders know that the fuel system will eventually be the weak point and develop an issue, i really could give 2 flying ***** about how good of a tuner anyone is, it is inevitably up to the owner of the car to maintain it.... again, most shops that have been around a while have their reasons for doing things a certain way for their own reasons.

one of my longest running higher horsepower engines ran 3mm seals, coincidentally running AI and premix and also came apart looking like the day it went together, over 30,000 miles later.

btw, rx7store and rx7.com are two different entities... rx7store does not run a shop anymore, thank god.

now gtfo

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

I've been around this block a few times since 1998, and just wanted to quote myself. Not something I usually do, but I got a funny feeling

Slammedblk7

iTrader: (7)

I knew this thread was going to go down hill when it was started.

I don't even know who the hell rcracer_tx is LOL...and I've been around for 12 years.



@ Ari, good to know you still remember your password to the forum.

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

he's just an armchair warrior, easy to make claims until you're the one building all the engines and have to warranty the end result. how many shops will rebuild a moderately to even extremely modified engine? including a rotary engine? it's easy to cirticize people, i get tired as hell of all the bullshit in this community.

this guy is a worthless ****.

i'll be glad when i'm done and i am sorry to those who have to continue to deal with this sort of teenage drama.

prrex4ever

iTrader: (3)

I have had a rebuilt Rotary Performance engine in my FD for the last 5 years, hasn't missed a beat. Then again I'm not pushing real big hp but I personally could not use 500 + hp in my street driven FD, no need for it. For me at least.

RiceFx306

iTrader: (7)

RP is a great shop, but honestly I've been out of touch with them for quite some time. Another newer shop is PRT Performance in Lewisville. Both are outstanding with owners who have great reputations and also put the RX7s into the magazine for years and years on end with podium finishes. I'm happy to talk to people that have been there and done it long before we had the delightful forum formats of today.

I can't speak for other cities, but I've been spoiled living in Dallas.

sk8world

iTrader: (5)

Aka Gotham racing #2

bullet13

iTrader: (5)

Prt performance is where my fd is at right now getting a stage 3 street ported engine installed along with a T04z turbo and water injection, plus everything else to go with it

Valkyrie

Wal Mart? Heheheh.

BDC

If you're going to say something about me on a public forum, at least be fair and don't forget to mention that whatever I've broken on my own car in the past 6 years has been due to experimentation (of the likes less than a handful of people have tried still to this day). Let's also not forget that I've been more than forthright about posting all of the details in exhaustion so other folks could hopefully find some value in it and try things on their own. Everything's always said on these lousy Internet forums out-of-context to fit a meme. It's just like politics!

+1 to Ari and RP. Thanks for all the help over the past 19 years.

B

BlowenByTwins

iTrader: (6)

To the OP,

If your looking for 600+rwhp find the people on the forum that have cars like that and ask them what they did and who they worked with. That'll tell you who you need to contact to achieve your goals.

-Matt

djseven

iTrader: (56)

What great experiment have you tried that has not been proven to fail in the past? Stop trying to reinvent the wheel on a 500rwhp setup, DIY guys build reiable 500HP setups in their garage all the time. I dont have anything against you, I just found it funny a guy questioning RP while putting you on a pedastal. No internet ego here, I have no dog in this fight, I wish you the best, but your car sure has not been a good promotion for your business.

fendamonky

iTrader: (6)

He's totally at teh cutting edge of Bridge Porting design and technology..



Wait, didn't see that part... Sorry.

Force13B

iTrader: (19)

^Why did he bring the closing port so dam high and what the hell is up angles on the bridge?

fendamonky

iTrader: (6)

"Experimentation"

Who knows, it could have been awesome!

BDC

The experiment? Hot-air, non-intercooled, using alcohol as the only charge cooler while trying to run big boost (25psi+). The point of the experiment is/was to prove how well methyl alcohol works in a dual role in hopes of trying to find something more economical than race gas not to mention just plain learn more about how the rotary in a street form responds to methyl alcohol. I know of only two others who have tried something similar (with the hot-air aspect) albeit with lower boost and I think with water only. If you can point me to somebody else who's done the same experiment as mine and has succeeded, then please do as I would like to learn what all they tried and what their successes and failures were. But staying on point, would it be some big surprise if I blew an engine up or cracked a dowel land? No. Is it somehow unreasonable to expect something like that? Of course not. That's part and parcel. It's unfair in the way you've presented it because it suggests incompetence; something I'm definitely not.

I don't use my Turbo II as a promotion for the business although there are some things on there that point to what kind of experience I've got. Spend just 5 seconds looking at it and you'll see. The car isn't loaded with race stickers nor does it have $20,000 of body and interior work to show it off. I've had it 15 years and have used it as my experimental platform since day one with the willingness to break things on it and learn from it at my own expense. It's got a mix of good and bad wiring. The 5-pt harness is old and faded. The paint went from "sunshine red" to "sunset orange". The hood has slight hail damage. The tint is faded and needs to be removed. I can go on and on. But, it's got a rich history that shows my hard-earned experience. If somebody else wants to look at it differently, they're more than welcome to, but I don't use it as promotion.

By the way, you make it sound like making a 500rwhp "reliable" setup is a somewhat trivial thing. It is not and it never has been. Perhaps like you, I'm one of those guys who fixes those attempts when enthusiasts, who are given a load of BS and a false sense of security about what their car is capable of using cheap pump gas from other shops or "experts" on these Internet forums, run too much boost on too cheap a setup and break their engines. I've done it countless times in the past 10 years. I also don't have the track record of many other tuners or builders who have stacks of dead engines in their history. This strikes at the heart of this thread, to a degree, when we've got people here arguing about shops being "over-priced" or "who does a good job", etc.

Frivolity. So many enthusiasts, especially the younger ones generally speaking, expect so much for so little. It costs a lot to build a good setup and there's no guarantee it will be reliable. Certainly something experimental, like the stuff I do on my own car, is even less reliable and cannot be expected to last.

Regards,

B

Force13B

iTrader: (19)

You mean like water? Last i checked it's a lot cheaper then methanol.

Water only at 35 psi but with a small top mount

Turbo II Rotor

iTrader: (2)

Well since everybody who tries this finds out that it does not work as you think it should common sense would say try a more proven method. Have you even stopped to think no one does it because it does not work?

rxspeed7

iTrader: (5)

When we used to race professionally, our cars ran no intercoolers and we ran 50+psi of boost. We use staright methanol as fuel and run a mechanical injection system. Our latest car runs the exact same setup as the drag cars used to with the exception of a 5" thick intercooler. It does nothing for charge cooling and is solely there to slow the incoming air down a bit. It gets hard to cope with the velocity that 50psi of boost brings in. It also makes over 1000whp on a mustang dyno this way.

Now as for running pure meth *** a alternate injection, that **** doesn't work unless your dumping gallons of it in at a time. Pure water or wm50/50 is by far more superior than staright meth.