David Hayes

iTrader: (6)

The latest update is that Pettit still has no power as of today. Pettit shares a location with another company and the hurriciane took out part of the roof over the other company. The roof fell on the main electrical box (don't know what they call this) and thus power is still out. Pettit will be back up and running as soon as the roof is removed from the electrical system and the box is fixed. My guess would be next week.

Fortunately, Pettit's side sustained no damage and my car is okay. Most excellent! Looks like I will get to complete this project.

As for horsepower, anything over 400 to the wheels would be fine. At 12 PSI, this should be easily attainable. I am also interested in the increased torque of the 20B versus the 13B.

95R2-89TII Ground Zero

how much???

sub9lulu

iTrader: (7)

???
guess u jumping in a little late
35k

David Hayes

iTrader: (6)

sub9lulu is about right on the cost. It's not cheap.

Red-Rx7

David-

I suggest you should go with a single turbo setup. Depending on the turbo, you can achieve faster spool up, and more horsepower. The additional costs offset the gain. I think Cam would be gun-ho too. If you want some specifics, PM me. Cam and I talked about it with my car, and he wanted to try something simular.

NoOne

David,

Good to hear your car survived.

The LS1 has worked out great, started it up back in May 7000 miles ago and not a single issue. Single oil change and the only time the car hasn't been driveable is when I've been upgrading.

Just redid the rear suspension and today I'll do the front.

The rotary is cool motor, and hey if you got the cash to drop 35k on it then I would guess it doesn't bug you too much, everything is relevent.

Personally I'd love to do a cheapo version of those Star Mazda's with a rotary, something tube chassis strictly for the track, nice and light.

I do wonder what is the cost of the motor, nothing else...if its a majority of the cost, where do the dollars break down and what might be some of the savings in getting custom parts made.

1point3liter

a fellow I knew locally picked up TWO complete long blocks for around $5000 total.

I've seen them sell for 2500-4000.

Here's one on ebay for $4000 "buy it now."
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...category=33615

The 20b transmission, wiring harness, and ecu aren't needed when doing a swap.

David Hayes

iTrader: (6)

I've seen the same in costs as what 1point3liter just posted. Where the costs with the Pettit install come in deals with the rebuilding of the engine and the installation and tuning of the car.

At the risk of kicking off another V8 versus 20B debate, I think you should do whatever you feel comfortable with. For me, however, the 20B was the only way to go. The car needs to stay rotary!

1point3liter

lol.. please no 20b vs 57b debates..

I agree, it's all about what you want in the car. Everyone has their preference, mine is to go fast and be reliable. jk

jimlab

I used to have a breakdown of the cost of the Banzai package somewhere. A massive amount of the cost came from the rebuildable 20B core and rebuilding that core. I believe they also listed "blueprinting" the stock turbos and there was an impressive price tag associated with that, as well. The engine and turbos alone were $10,000 or more of the cost, if memory serves.

Their engine subframe was $2,100 at that time, which sticks in my mind because it was high then and still is for cutting the center out of a stock subframe and welding in some cross braces. Then you've got the stand-alone engine management system and wiring harness, coils, intercooler, custom intake piping, radiator, exhaust...

I got my core 20B for $2,700. I believe both Pettit and Shane Racing (SR Motorsports) wanted $4,800-5,000 for the core engine at that time.

1point3liter

That's because you bought one back when 20b cosmo's were still new.

FDNewbie

iTrader: (10)

Speaking of which...how long have they made the 20B Cosmo for? Is it still in production?

1point3liter

I believe the 20b powered cosmo's were only available during the early 90's.

FDNewbie

iTrader: (10)

Why...what are they powered w/ now? Cuz I got some guy who's trying to sell me a 20B front clip off an '04 Cosmo lol

jimlab

Yep. 1990-1996, according to the information on these sites...

http://www.monito.com/wankel/cosmo20b.html
http://cp_www.tripod.com/rotary/pg20.htm

RotoHead

Okay, so I ditched reading it all.. but damn. I so wanna do a 20B conversion. I just don't have a FD. So, would people get upset if I did this with an FB? J/K Too much money to do the conversion. Sounds like a nice car though!

Why so expensive? $35,000 will buy you a freakin NEW car. Not your current car with a motor swap. Hell, even my (Don't ban me for saying this) Mustang is getting a transplant for less then that. So far I'm only up to $10,000 and that is for a NEW 2000 4.6L DOHC Cobra motor, new transmission, new wiring harnesses, new gauge cluster and a few other odds and ends. (Now to buy the Diablo Predator flash programmer for the computer.)

At any rate, if it were cheaper, I'd consider doing that for my 85 GS.

blueskaterboy

well with an engine swap, new paint, etc. isnt it basically a new car??

for those of us who just want an FD and nothing else, we're out of luck finding a new one and it'd be stock.

is it worth the money to buy a 20b from pettit? i guess they do have a pretty good reputation, but if i could just buy a 20b and rebuild/port it myself for significantly cheaper u know?

rynberg

And there's your problem.

Why does everyone think the $35k is just for a new motor? The $35k is for the COMPLETE conversion....

RotoHead

I realize it isn't JUST a motor... Do they basically strip the Chassis of all wiring, and do a complete suspension, motor, transmission, rearend, brakes overhaul? What about interior and exterior. Are you basically getting a new car? I'm curious... Also, has anyone ever done this on anything other then a FD?

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

indeed... i always chuckle when somebody tells me they're "just" going to "drop in" X motor into X vehicle, and then quote me the junk yard cost of said motor as the cost of the project "plus a little bit extra" for whatever they'll need. The little bit extra IS the cost... for custom work and alot of details needed for things to work right... the gross underestimation of the complexity of these projects is staggering.

Heck anyone seen the number of single turbo conversion threads that outline the car being down for months on end, and numerous little custom jobs, essoteric fitting/gasket/part sourcings, and setup problems? Never mind tuning. And this with a supposedly bolt-on kit.

ROTARYFDTT

iTrader: (4)

Perfect time for this:

FDNewbie

iTrader: (10)

These #s are rough estimates:

- 20B/front clip coming from JAPAN (not your Mustang crate motor): $5K
- Tranny: $5K - $7K
- Engine work on 20B: $2K
- 20B subframe: $2K
- Turbo & piping: $5K
- Custom IC: $2K
- Brake upgrade: $2k
- ECU & tuning: $2K

That by itself is right around $25K, and that's assuming you do ALL of your own work (labor not included). Plus, there's still other components I didn't mention (suspension etc)

I believe the swap itself (using all the stock parts) can be done for $15K, but who's gonna go through all that and then stick w/ 350ish hp??

RotoHead

No offense, but sitting through almost 20 pages of text to find out how much the swap costs is kinda time consuming... I just didn't realize the 20B was that expensive... As I was saying.. I'm doing a swap myself. I'm not just taking a crate motor and dropping it into my car... It is LOTS of work. Even more then I ever thought possible before I started. Mine looks like this.

4.6L DOHC Mustang Cobra engine brand new off the line with T-45 Transmission included: $6200 to my door
8.8" rear end with 3.73 rear gears new from Ford Racing: $700
Underdash harness for 99+ Mustang Cobra: $400.00
17" rims used from a friend: $200
Upgraded Cobra front discs/rotors: $200

This does't include little plastic clips to reinstall the interior, the fact that I'm replacing interior carpet, etc. I figured though, for $35,000 I could do all the above and still include a Kenne Bell twin screw supercharger pushing 12 lbs boost, rebuild with all forged internals and add stage 2 heads and full exhaust. All said and done (I'm lead to believe the 99-01 Cobra block is good for it) its pushing close to 600 RWHP.

THIS is why I was finding it hard to believe that a 3 rotor conversion would be that expensive. I'm not slighting the process at all, and was wondering what all was included in a $35K pricetag. I know full well its worth the cost though. That is what I keep telling myself every time I spend more money on my Mustang. And if I had the money to upgrade my RX-7... I'd damn well do it.

Red-Rx7

It is about novelty. There are cheaper ways to get power, but if you stick to the lines of the rotary motor, this is ballpark range for it to be done correctly. At 12 psi, my car made near what your ideal KB car would. Again, just about novelty. For me, I love the 3 rotor. V8's are cool, and you can do some neat stuff with them. But, the RX-7 is already unique, and this just further makes it stay that way. Besides, how can you not love this: CLICK ME?

RotoHead

Oh, I'm all with you on the novelty of it. I keep slapping my friends head in every time he tells me I should put my Cobra motor into my RX-7. I keep telling him that I wanna put either a Renesis or a 20B in there.... So, I'm totally hearing you on that.