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It is set up for traction control if you have the additional module that allows 4 speed sensors. Apparently you can take the signal from your ABS sensors, but I haven't done it.
Additional Module?! Why wouldn't you just be able to use that massive amount of I/O for the M2000/M6000 and wire it in accordingly? I'm not 100% familiar with the ABS sensors on the FD, but this should be common knowledge for any owner as to if they are VR or Hall Effect, and interpreting that signal to identify individual wheel speeds.
I know for a fact that Andy made a video on this...
I believe that with the Select, you can run traction control out of the box. With the Modular, you currently can't.
With the Modular, right now there's only one VSS input, so you need the extra module to be able to input ground speed from undriven wheels.
They're currently working on the Arbitrary Logic portion of Eugene. When that's finished, we will be able to re-purpose one of the extra CAS inputs (CAS3) into a VSS input, which will allow traction control (and better launch control) without the additional module.
It will also allow an extra 0-5V input to be used as a digital input.
Not sure what else it will allow/facilitate.
I believe that with the Select, you can run traction control out of the box. With the Modular, you currently can't.
With the Modular, right now there's only one VSS input, so you need the extra module to be able to input ground speed from undriven wheels.
They're currently working on the Arbitrary Logic portion of Eugene. When that's finished, we will be able to re-purpose one of the extra CAS inputs (CAS3) into a VSS input, which will allow traction control (and better launch control) without the additional module.
It will also allow an extra 0-5V input to be used as a digital input.
Not sure what else it will allow/facilitate.
CAS3 = Flex Fuel Sensor
You should have plenty of generic 0-5v inputs, both digital (for hall effect) and analog (for VR) wheel speed sensors.
Who have you contacted at Adaptronic on this so far? What was their response? NO, don't tell me about dealing with one of their dealers, I mean direct to the company. Andy? Mark? etc
There has to be a work around or simple programming fault that you're not seeing. I'll go through Eugene right now and try to find out myself...
I've been talking to Mark, and my understanding is that there's no traction control possible on the Modular without either the additional "small real-time input module" or the arbitrary logic software (which isn't functional yet).
And even with either of those things, you need an additional circuit if you want to take the signal from the ABS sensors without messing up the stock ABS system
And FWIW- anybody can use traction control, whereas large parts of north america can't make use of a flex fuel sensor
Well, are these modules for sale yet or are they still in R&D?
Mark knows his ****... He's damn near Andy's right-hand man, so if he instructs you to purchase this unit for your needs, do so. $150 is a drop in the bucket compared to not having these features you wish for. It's a shame there's been so much controversy on the ECU and it's capabilities. I don't like the idea of an expandable ECU with a nice low price point and a lot of promises... The software is still junk (WARI is FAR better), the feature tree is not entirely true considering you can't have ALL of the things you'd really want, and when you add in the price of all these modules, you're actually at the price point of what I would consider a superior ECU.
What I want to do is help out. I feel a lot of you were experiments to a project that never met it's promised fruition. YES, things take time, but the priority tree as to functionality of features, software usability, etc is WAY wrong. Too much marketing, not enough R&D.
Yeah, it bothers me to see that they have new products being released, despite the existing product line being so far from completion.
I tell myself that it's a different team developing the new products in an attempt to make myself feel better, but realistically it's probably the same guys taking time off of what should be the priority and working on new stuff.
Closed loop fuel tuning and closed loop turbo control are both non-existent right now. When I bought the ECU, I was under the impression that they would both be functional
Closed loop fuel tuning and closed loop turbo control are both non-existent right now. When I bought the ECU, I was under the impression that they would both be functional
Realistically, those are the Top 2 must-have features for a modern ECU with a delicate engine configuration.
Hilarious how my 8-Bit Honda ECU from the 90s has a daughterboard soldered on it that has Boost By Gear, Closed Loop Fueling (only Open Loop Boost Control), and a wide array of external inputs/outputs while remaining inside the factory ECU and plugging into a USB cable. Ohh, did I mention it's only $500 and support is in California, 6 days a week...
Wait, is there a module for fixing the incredibly buggy software?
Last edited by RGHTBrainDesign; 06-04-18 at 08:32 PM.
Yeah, it bothers me to see that they have new products being released, despite the existing product line being so far from completion.
I tell myself that it's a different team developing the new products in an attempt to make myself feel better, but realistically it's probably the same guys taking time off of what should be the priority and working on new stuff.
Closed loop fuel tuning and closed loop turbo control are both non-existent right now. When I bought the ECU, I was under the impression that they would both be functional
What??? Closed loop fueling and boost control are not functional?? Good god, and they have the audacity to argue its an equivalent unit to a Haltech Elite. What a compete farce. May as well be a pfc in a suit. But hey...it comes in a case and you can get matching adaptronic modular sweatpants and a hoody from Shawn so it must be cool.
You have to think.... if this much is wrong and lacking on the front end, do you really have any confidence in the software functions running in the background controlling the fuel and ignition of your expensive rotary engine? I wouldn't trust one as far as I could throw it
What??? Closed loop fueling and boost control are not functional?? Good god, and they have the audacity to argue its an equivalent unit to a Haltech Elite. What a compete farce. May as well be a pfc in a suit. But hey...it comes in a case and you can get matching adaptronic modular sweatpants and a hoody from Shawn so it must be cool.
You have to think.... if this much is wrong and lacking on the front end, do you really have any confidence in the software functions running in the background controlling the fuel and ignition of your expensive rotary engine? I wouldn't trust one as far as I could throw it
Skeese
Closed loop fueling works, but not their closed loop (ie "adaptive") tuning.
Once your map is decently-done manually you can switch to closed-loop fueling for a portion of it, but the Adaptive tuning that allowed you to quickly develop a map for vac areas isn't there like it was for the Select ECUs.
Closed loop fueling works, but not their closed loop (ie "adaptive") tuning.
Once your map is decently-done manually you can switch to closed-loop fueling for a portion of it, but the Adaptive tuning that allowed you to quickly develop a map for vac areas isn't there like it was for the Select ECUs.
Why wouldn't you be able to generate a delta from the standard closed loop fueling of your o2 sensor vs. target and just apply it cell by cell (or a copy x%) fashion? That seems like one of the most basic functions of an aftermarket ECU across ALL companies. Again, my $500 Hondata does this on an early 90s OBD1 ECU...
Skeese for the win. We need more pics of Diesel though. Can you photoshop Diesel + Adaptronic + Your Backyard for some festivities?
You can can kind of do this with the Fuel Map by highlighting the cells you want to tune and press “R”.
Open the fuel map, press “T”
drive
Higlight cells you wish to tune, press “R”
To erase data, press “E”
problem is you cannot set maximum’s so you get what you get in adjustments.
FWIW free Crome (Honda) has better tunability than Eugene
Originally Posted by SirLaughsALot
Why wouldn't you be able to generate a delta from the standard closed loop fueling of your o2 sensor vs. target and just apply it cell by cell (or a copy x%) fashion? That seems like one of the most basic functions of an aftermarket ECU across ALL companies. Again, my $500 Hondata does this on an early 90s OBD1 ECU...
Skeese for the win. We need more pics of Diesel though. Can you photoshop Diesel + Adaptronic + Your Backyard for some festivities?
The ECU already does the hard work that would be required for Adaptive tuning. You can put it in closed loop mode (once you have a decent map) and it will keep the AFRs very close to target AFRs in that section of your map.
It should be very easy at that point for the ECU (when the user wants it to do so) to look at what VE# is being used to achieve that AFR target and replace the current cell's VE# with that.
It can't be more than a few hours of programming - it should just be an extra check box on the Closed Loop Fueling page and a few lines of code.
When I asked about it, they said that very few people used Adaptive tuning so it is low priority for the software :/
Unfortunately they don’t have real closed loop fuel control (from what I understand), it’s just an overall trim value and will not correct on a cell by cell basis.
Closed loop fueling works, but not their closed loop (ie "adaptive") tuning.
Once your map is decently-done manually you can switch to closed-loop fueling for a portion of it, but the Adaptive tuning that allowed you to quickly develop a map for vac areas isn't there like it was for the Select ECUs.
Originally Posted by $lacker
When I asked about it, they said that very few people used Adaptive tuning so it is low priority for the software :/
If we're talking about "Rapid Learning" and "Slow Converge", it never worked properly, which is why very few people used it. On my 440d Select, it won't work at all if you set up arbitrary map spacing, it just doesn't update cells. When you have fixed map spacing, the cells don't represent a large enough portion of the map for updating one cell at a time to accurately work. You have to be almost dead on perfect before turning the system on for the changes it makes to have any relevance. In short, their algorithm sucks. They have the hardware to make it great, but it needs to either adjust more cells at a time, or make some compromises while in the learning modes to ensure the cell(s) getting update are accurate instead of boosting them to compensate for errors in surrounding cells.
Unfortunately they don’t have real closed loop fuel control (from what I understand), it’s just an overall trim value and will not correct on a cell by cell basis.
No one uses the feature the ECU is named after?
During cruise, closed loop works great. It basically keeps me at my target AFR all the time, whereas my tune will deviate by 0.2 AFR up and down a bit otherwise.
I haven't used it during pulls because I haven't had any reason to (and it's not really intended for that, afaik)
In order to do 4 wheel traction control the Real-Time Module is needed - There is one exception with the Rx8 PnP ECU which uses the CAN data from the ABS sensors.
As of recent the traction control options have always been there since release they just do not become activated until you have the module. I personally have not used the traction control but Andy has been doing alot of testing on the Rx8 with the functions and everything is working great!
If anyone is interested in doing 4 wheel traction control on their vehicle I would be happy to help set it up with you.
In order to do 4 wheel traction control the Real-Time Module is needed - There is one exception with the Rx8 PnP ECU which uses the CAN data from the ABS sensors.
As of recent the traction control options have always been there since release they just do not become activated until you have the module. I personally have not used the traction control but Andy has been doing alot of testing on the Rx8 with the functions and everything is working great!
If anyone is interested in doing 4 wheel traction control on their vehicle I would be happy to help set it up with you.
Cheers,
Shawn Christenson
Why even mention the Rx8 on this forum? You know the clientele, it's not Rx8...
If one were to purchase a "Real-Time Module" (that's a stupid name), what features would they have to disable?
Let me break it down for everyone:
M1200
NO Hardware Upgrades Available
M2000
1x Small Module Upgrade = DBW OR Traction Control OR 6x Aux OR 4x Analog Input
M6000
Can Handle All Modules, Large and Small, Together.
This is SO Poorly Written that it Hurts to Read...
GENERAL FEATURES
- Modular system, so that people can buy hardware upgrades later as their needs develop (eg additional inputs, outputs, or specific functions, eg drive by wire or built-in lambda)
- Offer a waterproof option, using Superseal connectors
-Wireless communication
-Fast USB communication, requiring no drivers
-Headphone port for listening to the knock sensor while tuning-Exception logging, able to detect faults and log a bunch of things that happen around the same time to help with ECU setup and tech support
-Bigger maps, more of them, and more dedicated maps.
Last edited by RGHTBrainDesign; 06-12-18 at 02:58 PM.
Its modular alright...so long as you buy the most expensive model you can modularly plug in dollar signs for each new feature you want. If you didnt buy the top end expensive product as you didnt want to overspend and wanted to upgrade later as marketed you're limited to a) no expansion on the m1200 and you can just choke and go without or b) spend more money on your m2000 to add 1 type of feature and again just choke and go without anything more than that.
To top it off, no supporting documentation will be provided for anything. Forums will be deleted and those that cant be deleted will be ignored. Contact to be established through facebook where all things are credible.
This really is hilarious, I honestly can't believe it got here
Yes the m1200 is a budget ECU it cannot do 4 wheel traction control. It can how ever still do boost by gear.
The M2000 has 1 small expansion slot - By default it cannot do 4 wheel traction control - It needs the Small real-time Module - Which gives the ecu an additional 3 VSS inputs, 2 additional CAS inputs, and an Additional Flex Fuel sensor input. The other available modules are DBW, Analog input, and Output Module. Those are all defined as "small expansion slot modules"
The M6000 has 4 small expansion slots and 2 large expansions slots - currently there is only 1 type of large expansion slot - Large Output module "8 injector outputs / 8 ignition outputs / 4 high/low Aux Outputs" Any injector our Ignition outputs can be used as low drive outputs.
I did not mention the Rx8 forum.. I guess you cannot read.. I was saying that Andy has been using the traction control features with success on the Rx8 ECU. The actual functions of the features do not change between any of the ECU's. I was explaining that the Rx8 gets its speed readings over the CAN communication thus the real-time Module is not required for that particular ECU.
06-02-18, 05:26 AM
