Monkman33

iTrader: (28)

Even then, it is not YOUR responsibility. It is theirs to do a claim with UPS. Otherwise, they have crappy mail order standards.

KX500FD1

I've been running the RB rear bar for about three years with no issues, other than the bushings recently started squeaking

gen3rx7

Yep, I boxed it in an oversize container securing both ends w / styrofoam, cardboard etc., not as professional as original packing but should prevent shipping damage...

jkstill

iTrader: (11)

Agreed.

I also have the stock swaybars, and the car is pretty well behaved on track.

Some of the autocross courses we have here are rather bumpy, and stiffer bars would probably increase my times.

KX500FD1

anyone know the difference in diameter between the '93 Touring and R1 rear bar?

when I took the rear bar off my Touring, it seemed incredibly wimpy

dclin

iTrader: (4)

Actually, it's the shipper's reponsibility to ensure that the package is packed correctly. Shipping companies will refuse insurance claims if they feel that it hasn't been. I've shipped around 30 sets of wheels and several hundred car and computer parts over the years, so I know.

Having said that, short of UPS employees using the bar as a pry bar under a BBT (Big Brown Truck), the most they could possibly do to a bare sway bar is scratch it up by throwing it around; definitely not anything that would impact functionality. The forces required to bend a bar of that guage isn't something that can done without serious mechanical leverage.

That little snippet by RB about passing possible blame to the return process was pretty pathetic.

Doc-1

iTrader: (2)

Here is the rear off of a 94 R2. I have no idea what a touring might be.

FDNewbie

iTrader: (10)

You beat me to it dclin. I've actually had incidents where the receiver filed the claim and it was denied, b/c they stipulate that the SHIPPER must initiate the claim. So I initiated a claim myself, they issued me a refund, and I forwarded the check to the receiver (or used it toward replacing the item). Retarded, but that's how it works.

I was gonna say the same as well. A sway bar is STRONG. You'd have to seriously secure one end of it, then apply a HUGE amount of force on the other end in order to bend it. Not something that can be done by dropping, slamming, throwing, or otherwise mishandling the box. I too have shipped hundreds of parts over the past few years, so I'm pretty familiar w/ what the shippers can and can't do. And in this case, I don't buy it. You can ship the bar solo, w/o any foam or covering, and it wouldn't get bent. Scratched up, yes. But bent...fat chance.

~Ramy

PS: dclin, How are ya man? Long time! Nice to see you're still around and kickin Drop me a line sometime when you get a chance. It's been too long... Ramy@FDNewbieImports.com

adam c

iTrader: (2)

The rear sway bars are the same for all of the 93 FD's. In 94, they went to a softer (smaller) rear bar to induce more understeer. I recently replaced my 94 bar with a 93 bar to get rid of some understeer. It helped a little bit, but not as much as I would have liked ......... especially for autocrossing.

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

Interesting because I've yet to file a damage claim with USPS or have a package go missing. I've had numerous problems with fedex and ups.

After this post I'm definitely doomed though.

Regarding the sway bar return issue with RB I find that down right insulting no matter how you slice it. If the bar arrived bent then the installer would have a very hard time hooking it up and if he was returning it because it was bent then the only problem would be if UPS straightened it. That rep from RB should seriously rethink his customer service practices because I'm still in shock but I am easily confused so hopefully I just misread something and he's right and I'm wrong because otherwise like a said it's a serious embarrassment to the company.

FDNewbie

iTrader: (10)

Even the 93 R1s? So was it only the suspension spring rates that they softened up in the R2s?

Hey now...isn't that an insurance no-no? Does your insurance agent know about this??

KX500FD1

interesting comments by Jimbo on the RB rear bar

http://www.fd3s.net/anti-sway_bars.html

Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 12:15:43 -0800
From: "Jim LaBreck (ECA)"

Just for general information, I removed my Racing Beat front swaybar, (which will soon it will be on its way to someone else) and replaced it with my R1/R2 front bar, and thought someone might benefit from a head-to-head comparison of the two.

There is no comparison.

The Racing Beat front bar, for those who have seen pictures or a live specimen, is a huge (and I mean HUGE) red bar with annodized blue forks attached using a spline system. The R1/R2 front bar is a fairly beefy piece of black metal, with crimped ends.

After replacing the old bar yesterday, the difference was immediately noticeable. Whereas the car used to corner like "a rock on the end of a piece of string", the car still corners well, but there is noticeable roll (not much, but compared to the RB bar, it's very noticeable) in the front end. I retained my RB rear bar, and it makes a world of difference when compared to the PEP/Touring/R1/R2 rear bars, so the difference between the front and rear of the car during "spirited" cornering was also obvious.

Eventually I became "used" to the setup, as I drove home last night, and by the time I got home, it was second nature and the car felt "right" again, but the brief comparison immediately following the swap was interesting, and I'm sure that a side-by-side comparison of an FD equipped with the RB bars would show that the system is superior to the components that came from the factory.

I would highly recommend both front and rear bars, but especially the front for those of you involved with road course and track events. The rear bar should be an immediate upgrade for those with PEP and Touring suspensions, as the rear gets alarming light in high horsepower/high speed cornering situations, and the swaybar made a world of difference.



__________________

An update from Jim...

Date: Sat, 4 Dec 1999 10:38:15 -0800
From: "Jim LaBreck" (jimlab@earthlink.net)

I upgraded front and rear to the Racing Beat adjustable sway bars from Mazdatrix. I think I paid $377 for the front, and about $120 for the rear. The front one is the one that made an appearance in the infamous David Irvine's web site, along with Trev's FTL billet sway bar mounts.

Prior to their installation, the car would want to "walk" (for lack of a better term) in corners at high speed. The rear would become semi-loose and it wasn't a confidence builder, especially when we were screwing around on twisting backwoods roads (freshly paved for our enjoyment, though) and it happened at 85-90 mph in one left hand sweeper. The rear suspension would come unloaded at some point, I'd get a little hop or shimmy out of the rear of the car, and we'd be through the corner. Not sure how close to losing it I was, but it didn't feel good, which goes without saying.

After I put the bars on, and adjusted the rear bar to its lower setting, this immediately went away. The stock rear bar is puny and there was an immediate improvement in the feel (and my confidence level) of the car in high speed cornering. I then found that on tight turns at moderate levels of speed (35-40) that the rear suspension would load up and twist "coming out of the hole", which was equally annoying, so I backed the bar off to its loosest (hole closest to the bar itself, not towards the end of the bar tips) setting and I've been happy as hell with it ever since.

I removed the front bar and replaced the OEM front bar after awhile and did some back-to-back comparison, and while there was a very small but still noticeably increase in stiffness in the front end, the R1 bar felt much more natural and performed almost every bit as well as the Racing Beat front bar. I figured that $377 probably wasn't even close to being worth the small improvement. Bear in mind that I had the FTL billet sway bar mounts on the car, and they alone provide a huge improvement in stiffness over the stock mounts.

So would I recommend replacing the front bar? Probably not. The rear bar? Definitely. For $120 and the price of an upgraded sway bar mounting kit (with the FTL kit out of production, I'd recommend the Crooked Willow ? kit) you can have a vast improvement in handling. I doubt the price of an upgraded front bar would justify itself, though.

By the way, all OEM front bars are identical, regardless of year or model.

adam c

iTrader: (2)

In 94, there were 2 different front springs offered. One for the R2 (stiffer), and one for the rest.

From the following thread:

https://www.rx7club.com/suspension-wheels-tires-brakes-20/spring-rates-600982/

The "guy" that used to take care of my insurance, sold the business 1 1/2 yrs ago. He's a bum now . My current agent is Geico

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

I agree 100%. I've shipped a lot of packages in the last 5 years with USPS and there have been *zero* incidents with any of the domestic shipments. Can't say the same for UPS or fedex.

Lately my UPS guy has started something cute----when I punch in the tracking #, it'll say something like "delivey attempted, no one available to sign for packages," this when there is no signature required, and there was most definitely someone home. this has happened twice now.

dclin

iTrader: (4)

Haha, I sent you a email just a little while ago to the info@ address. I want some Ganador mirrors.

But, back on subject, I have to add that I have never had one issue with USPS either. I've had my moments with UPS and Fedex though. The first UPS driver that delivered the first set of wheels I did for the Borbet wheel GB back in '01 (it took two Big Brown Trucks) apparently wasn't amused (or a car guy); he unloaded and left the boxes in the street in front of my house. The 2nd UPS driver was nice enough to help me put them in the garage, and stuck around to talk cars for a bit.

rynberg

Wow, somehow I hadn't read this thread until tonight....very disturbing to say the least. I'm not impressed with RB's response on this issue so far.

While the only RB part on my car is their dual-tip exhaust (still the best exhaust available IMO), I have always held the company in high regard. Until now anyway.

Jim and Jim (of RB), I hope you guys start responding like the company we all think you to be. It sounds like there may be some serious QC problems with these bars -- time to have a sit-down with your supplier (Addco, perhaps?).

DomFD3S

I agree that while the packaging of the RB sway bar (sent to Racing Beat) isn't the most ideal...a sway bar by itself is pretty stout. The shipping of the bar shouldn't make a dramatic difference in knowing whether there is a problem w/ the manufacturing of the bar.

We're not talking about thin fiberglass fenders that need "special" packaging here.

I will say that while Racing Beat's knowledge of the rotary is at the top...
and their products are typically held on high regard...

I WASN'T all that happy w/ the welds on the Racing Beat dual tip exhaust.
Not sure if the manufacturing took place in China or not, but definitely not the cleanest "dimes" I've ever seen. The welds on the muffler are sufficient in that they do the job...but there are a few edges that leave me w/ a bad impression. The connecting panels where the flat side of the muffler comes in contact w/ the oval cylinder...there were areas where the weld was just large enough to connect the two together. And uneven height on the oval "side" was so dramatic (on a spot or two)...there was still a somewhat sharp edge to it. Not sharp enough to cause a cut. But sharp enough for the weld to be somewhat recessed (or sunken) between the two metals.

I was happy w/ the way the exhaust fit together, as the fit is good.
But the welds...needs some extra TLC.

gen3rx7

[QUOTE=KX500FD1]interesting comments by Jimbo on the RB rear bar

http://www.fd3s.net/anti-sway_bars.html

Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 12:15:43 -0800
From: "Jim LaBreck (ECA)"

Just for general information, I removed my Racing Beat front swaybar, (which will soon it will be on its way to someone else) and replaced it with my R1/R2 front bar, and thought someone might benefit from a head-to-head comparison of the two.

There is no comparison.

The Racing Beat front bar, for those who have seen pictures or a live specimen, is a huge (and I mean HUGE) red bar with annodized blue forks attached using a spline system. The R1/R2 front bar is a fairly beefy piece of black metal, with crimped ends.


This in NOT the bar being sold today, it is a SOLID bar with holes drilled and tapped in each end which accept a bolt that runs through the stabilizer link. My problem was that one bolt worked loose and tore out. I checked the bolt that did not back out, and found it to be a somewhat loose fit all the way in until it bottomed out. The bar has been returned and I'm waiting for Racing Beat's assessment...

The stock bar is hollow with a stud bolt assembly crimped into the tube at the ends.

BTW, does anyone know if there are polyurethane bushings available for the stock bar? I searched and couldn't find any. The only option might be the OEM rubber ones from Mazda / Mazdaspeed...

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

Check the group buy section, under SuperPro.....I have a pair of polyurethane front swaybar bushings for the stock front bar that I got in the group buy.

gen3rx7

Just emailed Global Performance, thanks for the info!

KX500FD1

I'm not sure what the heck you're talking about, the front sway bar?

I was talking about the last half of Jim's post in particular

KevinK2

OLD STYLE FRONT RB BAR:

http://www.fd3s.net/anti-sway_bar_mounts_ftl2.jpg

This RB front bar was replaced with a solid 32mm bent rod version. Both used end bolts to attach the end links, vs studs on the oem. Studs are better.

REAR BAR:

doc-1's test was likely in excess of typical max twist in service, but the 17mm mazdaspeed bar survived and the 19mm RB bar did not come close. RB should at least make sure that bar was not out of spec, ie low hardness/strength. You can get normalized alloy steel at respectable strength levels w/o needing a quench and temper.

To deal with end link interference and poor link alignment with my similar eibach hollow rear (no longer made), I modified the pivot bushing caps so I could slide the pivots back more, and used socket head cap screws. After several years of occasional track use, the bar split along the mid span, and went soft. I wondered why the car got so tight that day ...

Best to stay with oem hollows or high quality solid rear bars, if you are going to push 'em.

DomFD3S

I wonder why Racing Beat switch from their original version (which appears similar to the Tri-Point version) to their current solid bent rod design?

Maybe profit margin as the bar could be produced for less (maybe?)?
Or a more attractive price point for the customer (as it may be cheaper for the customer)?

Interesting...I never knew they had an original design.

hyperion

iTrader: (2)

I recently purchased an RB rear bar for my car. I haven't noticed any issues. I'm running it with a Tri-Point bar up front with the 0.188" wall bar.

When I jack the car up (with full suspension droop) the bar bolts right up to the control arms without any bending. I've tracked my car twice with this setup running 18x10 R-compound tires.

That said, I've had an bit of a challenge with RB's customer service. I had an issue with a muffler that was too loud. They gave me the impression that a) they didn't believe me and b) they felt it wasn't their responsibility to make me a happy customer.

I'm sure that they deal with a lot of unreasonable people, and perhaps this has jaded them. But at the end of the day, if you are in business your ONLY business is making customers happy.

-ch

gen3rx7

I just heard back from Global / Superpro and they don't make polyurethane bushings for the front sway bar. Anyone else know if these can be purchased anywhere?